Why do many Muslims believe that God wants them to injure, kill, or imprison homosexuals?

[berrychrisc]

I see. Do you think you have the right to harm yourself? it's your life right? do you have the right to do so?

So homosexuality = bestiality and freedom = suicide. Naturally, because everything must be carried to the extreme.

 

[TashaN]

I find it amusing / sad that every time the subject of gay people comes up in a thread a Muslim feels the need to compare it to either rape or bestiality. What does the sexual expression of two consenting adults who care about each other have to do with either of those two things? The bottom line is you just don't have a good argument for why you feel okay with persecuting LGBT people, other than Allah told you to do it. God is about love, not hate - no matter what you happen to proclaim.

Isn't this in the Holy Bible?

Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.(Leviticus 18:22 KJV)

If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.(Leviticus 20:13 KJV)

 

[TashaN]

I don't know what all Islamic countries are like to comment, but if it's anything like what goes on in Iran, I'd call that oppressive. You don't consider Saudi Arabia a tad oppressive?

I call Saudi Arabia a progressive country compared to Iran.

 

[Autodidact]

I don't think it's possible to reason with someone like you. Insult the Muslims and their religion now all you want.

It's not enough to call me names; you need to show what is not reasonable about what I'm saying. You seem to miss my point; I don't have to like Islam, and I don't have to agree with it. What I do need to do is respect your right to practice it--as long as it doesn't infringe on me. Do you agree or disagree?

 

[Autodidact]

I find it amusing / sad that every time the subject of gay people comes up in a thread a Muslim feels the need to compare it to either rape or bestiality. What does the sexual expression of two consenting adults who care about each other have to do with either of those two things? The bottom line is you just don't have a good argument for why you feel okay with persecuting LGBT people, other than Allah told you to do it. God is about love, not hate - no matter what you happen to proclaim.

It says more about the people making the comparison than it does about homosexuality.

 

[Autodidact]

Isn't this in the Holy Bible?

Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.(Leviticus 18:22 KJV)

If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.(Leviticus 20:13 KJV)

What relevance could the Bible possibly have to a conversation about Islam and homosexuality?

Over and over again I've seen Muslims here at RF resort to the "But Johnny does it to" defense. It's pitiful, and reveals that they realize their position is indefensible.

If you want to argue that the Bible prohibits homosexuality, start a thread.

 

[Autodidact]

I call Saudi Arabia a progressive country compared to Iran.

Yes, well they're both Muslim countries, and neither is free. Saudi Arabia is progressive compared to Iran. Compared to Iceland it's a repressive monarchy. Turkey might be a better example for you. But then, Turkey is secular.

 

[Sahar]

I call Saudi Arabia a progressive country compared to Iran.

I disagree much, I believe the opposite is true.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

I don't think I've seen any so-called Muslim countries that are really that progressive and that's my point. Has Islam become a tool to be weilded by oppressive governments, as oppessed to being the progressive vehicle of peace and advancement it once was? Just look at the Golden Age of Islam and tell me the difference. Muslims embraced philosophy, they embraced art, they embraced humanisms, music, and things that uplift the soul and make it free. What has happened?

 

[Autodidact]

O.K., so I gather there is not a Muslim here who is willing to grant me equal rights?

Can you take a wild guess as to why I might want to oppose Islam?

 

[Ahmad Rushd]

The great factor that brings the 7th century Islam to all ages is based on:
Quran 2:85: Do you, then, believe in some parts of the divine writ and deny the truth of other parts? What, then, could be the reward of those among you who do such things but ignominy in the life of this world and, on the Day of Resurrection; they will be consigned to most grievous suffering? For God is not unmindful of what you do.” This verse compels Muslims to obey all the verses and commands of the Qur'an. Here are the Word of Allah, the words of Allah made text:
5:38 Cut off the hands of thieves, whether they are male or female, as punishment for what they have done—a deterrent from God: God is almighty and wise.
"Unbelievers are those who do no judge according to God's revelations. We decreed for them a life for a life, an eye for an eye, a nose for a nose, an ear for an ear, a tooth for a tooth, and a wound for a wound" The Table #43-
9:23, O ye who believe! take not for protectors your fathers and your brothers if they love infidelity above Faith: if any of you do so, they do wrong.
"Believers, take neither the Jews nor the Christians for your friends1. They are friends with one another. Whoever of you seeks their friendship shall become one of their number. God does not guide the wrongdoers." The Table (5) #51. (Response 1, 2)
"Muhammad is God's apostle. Those who follow him are ruthless to the unbelievers but merciful to one another." Victory 48:29
9:28, O ye who believe! Truly the Pagans are unclean; so let them not, after this year of theirs, approach the Sacred Mosque.
9:29, Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.
9:39, Unless ye go forth, (for Jihad) He will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place; but Him ye would not harm in the least.
9:111, Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on Him in truth, through the Law, the Gospel, and the Qur’an
9:123, O ye who believe! fight the unbelievers who gird you about, and let them find firmness in you: and know that Allah is with those who fear Him.
More verses against Non-Muslims or Unbelievers:
2:191, And slay them wherever ye catch them
2:193, And fight them on until there is no more Tumult or oppression
2:216, Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you
3:28, Let not the believers Take for friends or helpers Unbelievers rather than believers: if any do that, in nothing will there be help from Allah
4:84, Then fight in Allah’s cause - Thou art held responsible only for thyself - and rouse the believers. It may be that Allah will restrain the fury of the Unbelievers; for Allah is the strongest in might and in punishment.
4:141, And never will Allah grant to the unbelievers a way (to triumphs) over the believers
8:12, I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them
8:17, It is not ye who slew them; it was Allah: when thou threwest (a handful of dust), it was not thy act, but Allah’s: in order that He might test the Believers by a gracious trial from Himself
9:5, But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem.
9:14, Fight them, and Allah will punish them by your hands, cover them with shame, help you (to victory) over them, heal the breasts of Believers
25:52, So obey not the disbelievers, but strive against them herewith with a great endeavour.
25:68 ”Those who invoke not, with Allah, any other god, nor slay such life as Allah has made sacred except for just cause, nor commit fornication; - and any that does this (not only) meets punishment. “(But) the Penalty on the Day of Judgment will be doubled to him, and he will dwell therein in ignominy,-
37:22-23, “Bring ye up”, it shall be said, “The wrong-doers and their wives, and the things they worshipped- Besides Allah, and lead them to the Way to the (Fierce) Fire!
47:4, Therefore, when ye meet the Unbelievers (in fight), smite at their necks; At length, when ye have thoroughly subdued them, bind a bond firmly (on them): thereafter (is the time for) either generosity or ransom: Until the war lays down its burdens.
48:13 And if any believe not in Allah and His Messenger, We have prepared, for those who reject Allah, a Blazing Fire!
8:39, And fight them on until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah altogether and everywhere.
Quran 5:50 "Do they then seek the legislation of (the Days of) Ignorance? And who is better in legislating than Allah for a people who have Faith."

Quran 5:45 "And whoever rules not by what Allah has revealed, those are the wrongdoers."
Quran 12:40 "The rule is only for Allah."

Quran 18:26 "And He (Allah) allows none to share in his rule."

 

[Ahmad Rushd]

8:39, And fight them on until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah altogether and everywhere.
The above verse 8:39 means that Muslims must fight Non-Muslims until there is no distraction to the Muslim faith and until the Muslim’s concept of justice and faith prevails wherever the Muslims live, let say Canada, Canadian people must be fought until the Muslim’s concept of justice and the Muslim faith prevails in Canada. The problem with Islam is that Allah claims to be the Creator of mankind so He orders Muslims to crush down the Non-Muslim cultures, values, faiths, histories (which together form a Non-Muslim Civilization), government systems and install Allah’s perfect religion (Islam), Allah’s way- the Sharia Law in all Non-Muslims countries. Isn’t this a clash of Civilizations, the Clash of Islam with the Civilizations of the world? Allah tells to Muslims that YOUR kingdom is MY kingdom or MY kingdom is of this world. After the journey of the Qur’an and the examples of Muhammad (Hadiths), one comes to the conclusion that Allah strives for worldwide political dominance thus converting the World into World-Wide Islamic Empire under Caliphate, the Rule is for Allah, when Muslims conquer a Non-Muslim State what they do with its Constitution?:
Quran 5:50 "Do they then seek the legislation of (the Days of) Ignorance? And who is better in legislating than Allah for a people who have Faith."

Quran 5:45 "And whoever rules not by what Allah has revealed, those are the wrongdoers."
Quran 12:40 "The rule is only for Allah."

Quran 18:26 "And He (Allah) allows none to share in his rule."

 

[Ahmad Rushd]

his factor is based on this:
Islam claims its founder to be the Creator of universe, the God of Abraham, its holy book is believed to be eternal the copy of the one Qur'an which is up there in heaven. The pure Islam is believed to be the Mohammad's time Islam & the Caliphate time. What is the Mohammad and Caliphate time Islam, how does it look like? History bears witness, it was (………..….…) that conquered the Middle East, North, West, East Africa, Asia Minor (Turkey), Spain, Central Asia, Northwestern India much of the known world by Sword, if the West did not become powerful, I suspect Muslims, who followed Islam the way Mohammad and his Sahabas (companions) which brought the much of the known world under Islam by the red blood sword, would have continued to (………) mankind. Just as Christians who long for the apostle time Christianity and try, some utmostly try to follow it Muslims do also long for the Islam of Mohammad and Caliphate time and try, many utmostly, try to follow it. You can't transform Islam into peaceful religion because its true face, the 7th century Islam, was a religion of (…….): Qur'an9:29, Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. This is one of the last commands, revelations of Allah to Muslims. Another INhumane command 9:111, Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on Him in truth, through the Law, the Gospel, and the Qur’an
Due to this verse we have Muslimah and Muslim Suicide Bombers who are quite sure that getting killed for Allah's way and killing unbelievers they end up in Paradise (even innocent people, because they think they do service to Allah even in killing innocent people because Allah hates Unbelievers (kafirs), thus by killing the unbelievers they remove annoyance to Allah). The Qur'an is believed to be the Will of Allah, every Muslim loves to do the will of Allah.
Quran 2:85: Do you, then, believe in some parts of the divine writ and deny the truth of other parts? What, then, could be the reward of those among you who do such things but ignominy in the life of this world and, on the Day of Resurrection; they will be consigned to most grievous suffering? For God is not unmindful of what you do.” This verse compels Muslims to obey the verses that tell to conquer for Allah the Non-Muslim World, cut off the hands of thieves both men and women, kill unbelievers, fight against Jews & Christians until they pay tax (Jizah) and feel subdued, and other inhumane orders, commands. The evidence entails that Islam is worse than any… but as its true face is revealing itself nowadays Muslims are in trouble therefore declare Islam as the “religion of peace” to fool the Westerners. There are 2 groups of Muslims who do this: One group is Muslims who ignorant of all of the content of the Qur’an and Hadiths and Muslims who know but lie for the sake of Allah’s religion as lying for the way, sake of Allah is commanded by Islam (have patience, in the future I will post on it and you will know from what Islamic Source I say this). I was myself one of the ignorant Muslims who shouted Islam to be peace, because I was taught that Islam means peace and Mohammad was depicted to me as Jesus is depicted to Christians.

 

[.lava]

8:39, And fight them on until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah altogether and everywhere.
The above verse 8:39 means that Muslims must fight Non-Muslims until there is no distraction to the Muslim faith and until the Muslim’s concept of justice and faith prevails wherever the Muslims live, let say Canada, Canadian people must be fought until the Muslim’s concept of justice and the Muslim faith prevails in Canada. The problem with Islam is that Allah claims to be the Creator of mankind so He orders Muslims to crush down the Non-Muslim cultures, values, faiths, histories (which together form a Non-Muslim Civilization), government systems and install Allah’s perfect religion (Islam), Allah’s way- the Sharia Law in all Non-Muslims countries. Isn’t this a clash of Civilizations, the Clash of Islam with the Civilizations of the world? Allah tells to Muslims that YOUR kingdom is MY kingdom or MY kingdom is of this world. After the journey of the Qur’an and the examples of Muhammad (Hadiths), one comes to the conclusion that Allah strives for worldwide political dominance thus converting the World into World-Wide Islamic Empire under Caliphate, the Rule is for Allah, when Muslims conquer a Non-Muslim State what they do with its Constitution?:
Quran 5:50 "Do they then seek the legislation of (the Days of) Ignorance? And who is better in legislating than Allah for a people who have Faith."

Quran 5:45 "And whoever rules not by what Allah has revealed, those are the wrongdoers."
Quran 12:40 "The rule is only for Allah."

Quran 18:26 "And He (Allah) allows none to share in his rule."

that's pretty false information. but don't worry Muslims are used to see this kind of manipulations. that verse is given to Muslims while they were under attack by enemies of Muslims. in Canada noone is killing people for being Muslims and so far i know Muslims can practice their religion without being oppressed by Canadian government. they have no need to fight back. besides Canada belongs to Canadian. Muslims there either guests or immigrants which means they should respect laws of Canadian government

.

 

[.lava]

i described the true face of islam as its purity is found in the 7th century, if you deny Mohammad killing innocent people, a sudden attack on a tribe in Arabia

on the contrary, Mohammad SAW and Muslims had to watch their families and friends getting killed, humiliated, tortured by those "innocent" people for years. only when God commanded them to fight back, they defended themselves. btw...considering the title of this thread, are you suggesting all those innocent and maniac murderers who killed women and unarmed Muslims were actually "gay"?

.

 

[Autodidact]

that's pretty false information. but don't worry Muslims are used to see this kind of manipulations. that verse is given to Muslims while they were under attack by enemies of Muslims. in Canada noone is killing people for being Muslims and so far i know Muslims can practice their religion without being oppressed by Canadian government. they have no need to fight back. besides Canada belongs to Canadian. Muslims there either guests or immigrants which means they should respect laws of Canadian government

.

I think this belongs in the other thread. However for some reason Muslims in England are bombing people. Oh, excuse me, so-called Muslims.

 

[.lava]

I think this belongs in the other thread. However for some reason Muslims in England are bombing people. Oh, excuse me, so-called Muslims.

oh really? tell me all about it, Autodidact. i haven't checked the news yet but i assume it must be very recent like this morning or this afternoon since i haven't heard about it, not even from people around. so you say, some people who pretend to be Muslims did it. wow, just wow. how did they manage to figure that out? it must be very difficult to make tiny little pieces of meat talk. that would be also great if you just provide source for your claims. that would be very interesting to read considering it was English secret agencies who wear like Iraqis and shot at civilians on the streets to start chaos among Iraqis. well, nothing really changes..right?

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[enchanted_one1975]

Some people just believe what they want to believe. Actually a lot of people do that. It's sad, like constantly telling lies to yourself.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Ahmad you seem pretty disgruntled about Islam, LOL. You're an ex-Muslim, so now you spend all your time trying to discredit it as a religion, LOL? Where'd you get these apologetics from, an anti-Muslim website? What those verses actually mean is that Muslims are allowed to fight to free themselves and others from oppression. Muslims are called to do what is best for everyone, even non-Muslims.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

I'm an ex-Muslim too, btw, a Shi'ite- Twelver.