Scott C.
Just one guy
See the new thread "Do God the Father and God the Son have physical bodies?"
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Why Dont Christians Accept the Book of Mormon as Valid?
- Thread starter madhatter85
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See the new thread "Do God the Father and God the Son have physical bodies?"
Criteria for the bible canon was it smiliar to the way the LDS books came about
Criteria used by apostolic fathers to determine canon.
SOME CRITERIA ARE BELOW:
special relation to God, i.e., inspiration;
apostolic origin;
used in Church services, i.e., used by the community of believers guided by the Holy Spirit.
Criteria used by apostolic fathers to determine canon.
SOME CRITERIA ARE BELOW:
special relation to God, i.e., inspiration;
apostolic origin;
used in Church services, i.e., used by the community of believers guided by the Holy Spirit.
the student
New Member
The teaching of the Mormons, their doctrines contradicts the Christian doctrines that's why....
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
The only criteria I believe the Prophet and Twelve Apostles use today is the confirming testimony of the Holy Ghost. Our Apostles aren't just called Apostles because we liked the term. We believe they hold the same authority as Christ's Apostles held anciently. So we believe any doctrines they reveal to us as being from God have an "apostolic origin." Communication from Jesus Christ, through the Holy Ghost does not require that any man-made criteria be in place. We can't very well tell God that something He has said to His servants is wrong because it doesn't fit in with our standard of measuring truth. He speaks only truth.
Like the sitar in Moulin Rouge.
I do not feel the need to believe in a plagiarised fantasy about the imaginary visit of Jesus to USA. (Who wrote The Pearl of Great Price?) Neither do I find it credible that a convicted fraudster such as Joseph Smith should deserve to be treated as if God, in a lapse of sanity, decided to make him a prophet.
Mormonism and Islam have certain things in common - their 'holy books' are plagiarised fantasies and their founders are fake self-appointed prophets.
Mormonism and Islam have certain things in common - their 'holy books' are plagiarised fantasies and their founders are fake self-appointed prophets.
jtartar
Well-Known Member
madhatter,
God does not want His people to be fooled by other writings that claim inspiration, so He caused His writers to give us a warning about all other writings that differ from what His Bibliotheca Divina says.
Consicer 2Tim 3:16,17, where it says that a man is COMPLETELY equipped for EVERY good work with the Bible. Christians need nothing else.
Consider also Gal 1:6-9, where we are warned about other teachings. If anyone comes to you and teaches something different that what the apostles and Jesus taught, let them be cursed. This is a serious warning about writings that do not agree with the Bible. If they DO agree we do not need them, we have the Holy Scriptures.
I am glad to see that you, a member of L.D.S. accept the fact that Christians do not and cannot accept the book of Mormon as valid.
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Ghostkill221
New Member
I AM NOT GOING TO SAY IF ONE IS RIGHT OR WRONG, I AM ONLY HERE TO EXPLAIN THE DIFFERENCE. One of my next door neighbours is a mormon, and so was my current proffesor (he is now Christian) I have also read the book of Mormon and with all of these there are several key reasons why Christians don't accept Mormons as other Christians and in some cases consider it a cult. (REALIZE THAT WHAT YOU HAVE BEEN TAUGHT MAY NOT BE WHAT I HAVE LEARNED DUE TO THE FACT THAT DIFFERENT CONGREGATIONS HAVE DIFFERENT TEACHINGS I LEARNED THESE FROM EITHER A FOLLOWER OF MORMON WHO WENT TO AN OFFICIALLY SANCTIONED MORMON CHURCH OR WHEN I WAS 17 I SNUCK INTO A SACTIONED MORMON TEMPLE AND EAVES DROPPED)
Here the reasons are:
Primarily, because the way to get to heaven is different in mormon and christian teachings. in Mormon, you have to follow a specific set of rules in order to better yourself for god, in Christianity, Jesus takes all responsibility for thw wrongs we commint and as long as we let him, and acknowledge that he did so. we are insured a place in heaven. So it is Faith based
Number two : in The book of mormon there are several more books and some verses have been removed including Revelation 22:18 "For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book" that's King James version which was around before Joseph Smith
Third: the fact that the laws of Mormon keep changing based upon public opinion; 50 years ago the Mormon church held that Joseph Smith was told that slavery was fine because being black was how god marked people unworthy of his love. and the whole polygamy thing i'm not sure about
Finally and this is the weird one but I've verified through many ex Mormon's and i even heard it when i snuck in and it ingrained into my head. this is apparently not told to you until you have been accepted into the temple by an official member of the Mormon pastorage. In Mormon we are all son's of god, and as long as we continue to better ourselves. when we die the men of enough stature can become demigods and rule their own creation, and if they want they can pull their wife from the grave to rule with them.
Realize i am a Christian so make sure you try to take as much of actual information try to ignore how i said it because that may be unintentionally biased. I hope this helps you, feel free to message me any other questions you have //Ghostkill221
Here the reasons are:
Primarily, because the way to get to heaven is different in mormon and christian teachings. in Mormon, you have to follow a specific set of rules in order to better yourself for god, in Christianity, Jesus takes all responsibility for thw wrongs we commint and as long as we let him, and acknowledge that he did so. we are insured a place in heaven. So it is Faith based
Number two : in The book of mormon there are several more books and some verses have been removed including Revelation 22:18 "For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book" that's King James version which was around before Joseph Smith
Third: the fact that the laws of Mormon keep changing based upon public opinion; 50 years ago the Mormon church held that Joseph Smith was told that slavery was fine because being black was how god marked people unworthy of his love. and the whole polygamy thing i'm not sure about
Finally and this is the weird one but I've verified through many ex Mormon's and i even heard it when i snuck in and it ingrained into my head. this is apparently not told to you until you have been accepted into the temple by an official member of the Mormon pastorage. In Mormon we are all son's of god, and as long as we continue to better ourselves. when we die the men of enough stature can become demigods and rule their own creation, and if they want they can pull their wife from the grave to rule with them.
Realize i am a Christian so make sure you try to take as much of actual information try to ignore how i said it because that may be unintentionally biased. I hope this helps you, feel free to message me any other questions you have //Ghostkill221
First, welcome to the RF.
Second, you don't know what you're talking about.
Number One: We are saved not by what we do, but by Christ. We do what we do to follow what we believe he would have us do. Doing things doesn't qualify us for Heaven - only Christ does.
Number Two: Revelation isn't in the Book of Mormon. It's the last book of the New Testament. So you're wrong about that. We use the King James Version of the Bible and I assure you that Rev. 22:18 is there. The Book of Mormon and Bible are different scriptures, but both testify of Christ.
Number Three: There were black members of the church and black priesthood holders in Joseph Smith's time. The one who claimed they had the mark of Cain was Brigham Young. This was never official doctrine, but it was the official practice of the church to not allow blacks the full blessings of the gospel. Some of us recognize this mistake. Eventually the prophets did too and they received revelation to correct this mistake. You might call it public opinion. What you might not know, however, is that we don't claim our prophets are infallible. Brigham Young was a product of his time. It's not an excuse - it's just a fact. I wish he'd been more progressive.
Number Four: We teach that we are all children of God and may progress to become like Him, but we don't really know what that means. What you claim as Mormon teachings are just some peoples opinions - not official doctrine.
Second, you don't know what you're talking about.
Number One: We are saved not by what we do, but by Christ. We do what we do to follow what we believe he would have us do. Doing things doesn't qualify us for Heaven - only Christ does.
Number Two: Revelation isn't in the Book of Mormon. It's the last book of the New Testament. So you're wrong about that. We use the King James Version of the Bible and I assure you that Rev. 22:18 is there. The Book of Mormon and Bible are different scriptures, but both testify of Christ.
Number Three: There were black members of the church and black priesthood holders in Joseph Smith's time. The one who claimed they had the mark of Cain was Brigham Young. This was never official doctrine, but it was the official practice of the church to not allow blacks the full blessings of the gospel. Some of us recognize this mistake. Eventually the prophets did too and they received revelation to correct this mistake. You might call it public opinion. What you might not know, however, is that we don't claim our prophets are infallible. Brigham Young was a product of his time. It's not an excuse - it's just a fact. I wish he'd been more progressive.
Number Four: We teach that we are all children of God and may progress to become like Him, but we don't really know what that means. What you claim as Mormon teachings are just some peoples opinions - not official doctrine.
CaptainBritain
Active Member
I am late to this thread as ive not been here long, but the question is a very valid one, I have never read the book of Mormon, so I cannot say if I accept it or not, Im going to rectify that asap, I think however that its important for all Christians to know that God is at work 24/7, from the start to this very day to the very end, there are many Christian texts that were never included in the Bible and there have been many revelations since the Bible was first formed as it is, it would not suprize me if I do find the book of Mormon to be the word of God, God is without limit and even if we look at the Bible which is not one book, but a collection of books.
This collection of books was given to us by God over thousands of years, and im willing to suggest God has been giving us revelations ever since.
I am going to try and find an online book of Mormon but in case i fail is there a good link anyone can suggest, a site with a commentary would be perfect if such a site exists.
This collection of books was given to us by God over thousands of years, and im willing to suggest God has been giving us revelations ever since.
I am going to try and find an online book of Mormon but in case i fail is there a good link anyone can suggest, a site with a commentary would be perfect if such a site exists.
This site doesn't have commentary, but you can find all LDS scriptures here, including the Book of Mormon.
Scriptures
Scriptures
Yea, I wouldn't mind browzing that site also. I read the Book of Mormon years ago, and everything inside me screamed out "Rubbish," but i suppose it's time to give it a bit of a study. If you're gonna tear a building to peices, it's wise to study it's construction first, don't want no beams fallin down on us, do we?
Plus I have to know what material to bring with me in order to replace the rubbish that I know will have to be removed, don't want you'se all to be without a roof over ya heads.
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With that attitude, don't expect to get anything out of the Book of Mormon.
Question: Is this how you approached the Bible? If not, what's the difference?
CaptainBritain
Active Member
Cheers Watchmen thats just the ticket, and dont worry about that guy scripture tells us that without humility understanding scripture is not possible.
Proverbs says it best at the start regarding the foundation of all wisdom,
Peace to you and many thanks for the link.
No problem. Enjoy your reading and let me know if you have any questions.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
Actually, many Christians do accept Mormons as Christians, but you are right -- some don't. Of course, I don't find their rationale to be at all logical, but then some of them don't seem particularly Christian to me either. Maybe it's in how we all define the word "Christian."
Okay, you lost me. Are you seriously saying that you were able to get into an LDS temple without anybody knowing it? You're going to have to explain how you pulled that off and tell us all what you learned there.
Evidently you're one of those Christians who don't consider Catholics to be Christians either. A few of the more conservative Protestant groups believe in the doctrine of Sola Fide, but it was definitely NOT taught by Jesus Christ. Jesus stressed obedience to His Father's commandments as necessary to enter the Kingdom of God. You are obviously ignoring huge sections of the New Testament to have come away with such an attitude.
LOL. So you noticed a few missing verses, huh? That's not awfully surprising since only about 3% of the verses in the Book of Mormon match those in the Bible. You're one very observant guy! With respect to Revelation 22:18, I'm sorry to have to break this to you, but the Bible itself did not exist when John received that prophesy, so God was obviously not referring to the Bible as a whole, but to Revelation. Furthermore, virtually all Biblical scholars today recognize the fact that Revelation was not the last book of the New Testament to be written. As a matter of fact, John's own gospel account and epistles were written after he recorded Revelation. Why would he have risked God's wrath for "adding" to scripture? Hint: He understood God's warning. You obviously don't.
You really need to so some serious homework. Joseph Smith was postively against slavery. He even ran for President of the United States on an abolitionist platform. "The whole polygamy thing" is clearly not the only thing you're not sure about.
Oh my gosh! What can I say? :biglaugh:That's what you learned in the Temple? I guess I haven't been listening carefully enough, because not once in the several hundred times I've been in the Temple have I heard such a thing.
I realize you're very, very, very uninformed, Ghostkill, but it was fun talking to you anyway. It's been a long day, and I really needed a good laugh.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
Hi, Cap'n. How pleasant to actually run into somebody who is actually willing to withhold judgment of the Book of Mormon until after reading it. I know it's really hard for me to read anything very lengthy online. If it's hard for you to do that, and you would like a free copy of the Book of Mormon -- no strings attached -- please PM me and I'll be happy to mail you one. I've sent three other RFers copies during the past few years and I'm absolutely confident that they would all tell you that I have never pressured them to read it or discuss it with me, nor have I sent missionaries to try to convert them. I can buy a book for next to nothing and would be more than happy to get you one if you'd like.
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