Why liberalism can and has been a disease.

[Shadow Wolf]

you've no idea what you're talking about. Not one iota.

I don't? California feeds America, Kern county pumps out more oil than any other American county, and there is a ton of various things, from food to entertainment, that come from here. And I do know California has very obviously met the requirements for statehood, and I can say with confidence no judge would strip any state of statehood. And it is Constitutionally impossible for a state to succeed. And you want to throw that out after you make a post wanting unrealistic and impossible outcomes?
Name me one state that is free of corruption. Name one that has never defied or attempted to defy federal law. Do you need reminding that 13 states in the union have committed acts of high treason, and were allowed back into the Union as 13 states?

 

[Nakosis]

Spoiler Alert:

I'm sure that $3k a month for a studio is luxury or in an affluent area. Not even downtown Los Angeles has something that cost that much for a studio and that is near Staples and LA Live.

Works for Google. Interesting life style. Doesn't own a car. Cost of parking is too much. Everything he needs is on the same block. Grocery, about 20 restaurants, fitness center, bar. Everything he'd ever need in walking distance. Maybe upper-middle class area drawns in the homeless as they are more likely to get handouts.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Then what are Democrats going to do about it?

I'll tell you.

Nothing.

They are still in charge of the city over there. Status quo. Business as usual.

Can we assume you have to be hyperfocused on this one city because your argument completely falls apart and fails once we look at the rest of California? Democrats are in charge throughout California. But the North, South, and Central Valley tend to be different enough to give rise between a Northern-Southern California rivalry. Smog and air quality though are problems in the Central Valley (it's also about the only place here Republicans can win - but their crude love of crude oil comes after the fact we're surrounded by mountains here as to why smog and air quality are problematic).
So, if Democrat policy and Democrats being in control is why San Fransisco looks like it does, why does the rest of the state not have the same reputation? If you stay away from LA and San Fransisco you won't even find yourself paying the high cost of living the rest of America seems to think all of California pays.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Spoiler Alert:

I'm sure that $3k a month for a studio is luxury or in an affluent area. Not even downtown Los Angeles has something that cost that much for a studio and that is near Staples and LA Live.

It does question the disparity in economy.

I can't help but think disparity is a way politicians tactfully control the poor through economics. It seems that San Francisco is the unofficial dumping grounds here.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Can we assume you have to be hyperfocused on this one city because your argument completely falls apart and fails once we look at the rest of California? Democrats are in charge throughout California. But the North, South, and Central Valley tend to be different enough to give rise between a Northern-Southern California rivalry. Smog and air quality though are problems in the Central Valley (it's also about the only place here Republicans can win - but their crude love of crude oil comes after the fact we're surrounded by mountains here as to why smog and air quality are problematic).
So, if Democrat policy and Democrats being in control is why San Fransisco looks like it does, why does the rest of the state not have the same reputation? If you stay away from LA and San Fransisco you won't even find yourself paying the high cost of living the rest of America seems to think all of California pays.

Maybe that's where the Democrats want to dump less affluent people. San Francisco in this case. .
Maybe Oakland too.

The remaining major municipalities in the state of course will look pristine and progressive with the intent of attracting higher income more affluent and educated people, to which they can make it look like a paradise where their policies are working wonders while sweeping the dirt under the rug so to speak .

The boom of Silicon Valley comes to mind.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

None of us can rely on being able to sort out what is cant and
what is wont.

Not always, but sometimes it's pretty obvious if they are a "can't," and a brief conversation with a "won't" will often reveal which camp they belong to. Sometimes they'll even be straightforward and admit they are a won't.
I also hardly ever give my own thoughts towards someone's ability to work and will urge them to instead ask their doctor. "Social worker me" won't even answer such a question and will instantly default to telling clients that is a question for their doctor. But the "regular me," when someone is missing limbs, walking with a severe and profound limp, or speaking in a disorganized and tangential way they might just be a can't. Of course it's not something you can always see or hear, but there are no grounds to assume "none of us" can sort the two, because if someone is barely able to walk to the point they seem drunk when they do walk we can safely assume they are a can't. And even if they can, no one is going to hire them.

 

[Stevicus]

San Francisco is one of those unique cities where just about every policy of liberalism has been put into practical real world use without any conservative policy in play.

This is the real world result. The video is about 6 months old.

Conservatism isn't perfect either, maybe I'll make a thread on that , but for now, from what I see here, liberalism is clearly far far worse. I will never ever support leftist and liberal policies that can bring about something like this.

Keep going left, and more left, and you just might eventually have a nation that looks like San Francisco with a mayor that has no real sense of humanity in their own backyard. Their minds are too much on character assassination and politicking between themselves. I don't want what is going on in San Francisco to ever happen to our entire country.

San Francisco is a pretty frightening precursor enough as it is. It's a shame , because it really at one time was a gorgeous and beautiful city. Now look at what it's turned into.

Maybe it's a time for a new party to emerge where a proper balance of liberalism and conservatism rules the day. Not the extreme.

Yeah, it seems pretty grim, with all the poop on the street like that. Maybe they need more public restroom facilities. I know that a lot of places in the downtown area here don't let the public use their restrooms, since too many transients were coming in to use the bathroom. I've noticed quite a few fast-food places put locks on their bathrooms.

It does seem a bit incongruous, though. A city that's supposedly run by "liberals," how can they let people languish and suffer on the streets like that? Especially if some of them are mentally ill. They should be in hospitals, not out in the streets. It seems that if they really were liberals, they'd be outraged about this and want to do something to help these people. At least build them a few public toilets - or maybe even some shower facilities. It might not help that much overall, but at least it might keep them from pooping on the streets.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Maybe that's where the Democrats want to dump less affluent people.

That's not even what's going on here. Lots of people--from around America but it seems especially Texas--come here for work. Some move here from LA or San Fransisco to live here and work in the city to have a lower cost of living with higher metropolis earnings. No one has to dump anyone here because so many people are already coming here that the population exploded from less than 100,000 to nearly 400,000 in about 20-30 years. And though those are the numbers for Bakersfield, cities throughout the Central Valley have experienced explosive population growth over the past couple decades. LA is still the most populace city in California though, with the Central Valley not having a city on the lists of most populated cities in California until fifth (Fresno).

 

[Stevicus]

I don't? California feeds America, Kern county pumps out more oil than any other American county, and there is a ton of various things, from food to entertainment, that come from here. And I do know California has very obviously met the requirements for statehood, and I can say with confidence no judge would strip any state of statehood. And it is Constitutionally impossible for a state to succeed. And you want to throw that out after you make a post wanting unrealistic and impossible outcomes?
Name me one state that is free of corruption. Name one that has never defied or attempted to defy federal law. Do you need reminding that 13 states in the union have committed acts of high treason, and were allowed back into the Union as 13 states?

I've heard some talk about California possibly seceding, but it's more tongue-in-cheek than anything else. Although I do recall proposals to split California into two states. But that never seemed to get that much support.

A lot of areas of California are pretty conservative, and it was the home state of Reagan and Nixon. My grandparents lived in Orange County, and that was pretty conservative, although I don't think it's that way anymore. I remember watching Wally George on TV. That guy was a trip.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

A city that's supposedly run by "liberals," how can they let people languish and suffer on the streets like that?

We have yet to determine why it is the way it is. We have determined it is definitely not due to a lack of jobs, and not due to the minimum wage here because minimum wage is going up at least a couple more times and there are still businesses building stores, factories, and warehouses here. But from there thus no one knows even why the city has such a problem with homeless people. Is the drug problem worse than we realize? Are assistance programs clogged and backed up? But we don't even know why they stay instead of going to a different city where the cost of living is significantly cheaper.
And those who think they are "doing nothing" need to catch up on the news. And keep in mind that throughout the state Democrats are in control, yet no other city has the same reputation that San Fransisco has. That's another question that hasn't been answered, and that is what is it specifically about San Fransisco that is causing this? And what is it about California that gives rise to such a presence of those with physical disabilities and who are homeless? If Florida has a higher-than-average homeless rate, it may be the weather that is drawing in the homeless who can make it here.

 

[sayak83]

San Francisco is one of those unique cities where just about every policy of liberalism has been put into practical real world use without any conservative policy in play.

This is the real world result. The video is about 6 months old.

Conservatism isn't perfect either, maybe I'll make a thread on that , but for now, from what I see here, liberalism is clearly far far worse. I will never ever support leftist and liberal policies that can bring about something like this.

Keep going left, and more left, and you just might eventually have a nation that looks like San Francisco with a mayor that has no real sense of humanity in their own backyard. Their minds are too much on character assassination and politicking between themselves. I don't want what is going on in San Francisco to ever happen to our entire country.

San Francisco is a pretty frightening precursor enough as it is. It's a shame , because it really at one time was a gorgeous and beautiful city. Now look at what it's turned into.

Maybe it's a time for a new party to emerge where a proper balance of liberalism and conservatism rules the day. Not the extreme.

I have lived for 10 years in and near SF. Its one of the best places to live, period.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I've heard some talk about California possibly seceding, but it's more tongue-in-cheek than anything else.

I think every state talked about after the past two presidential elections. People can want it all they want, the Constitution doesn't allow for it.

Although I do recall proposals to split California into two states. But that never seemed to get that much support.

It was three states, and it was ruled logistically impossible to do without causing massive interruptions in various services, complications with taxes, and utilities would have to be reorganized.

A lot of areas of California are pretty conservative, and it was the home state of Reagan and Nixon. My grandparents lived in Orange County, and that was pretty conservative, although I don't think it's that way anymore.

From what I've seen, it's not. People still say it's Conservative, and while at one time that may have been, today these once Conservative places today seem solidly moderate/centrist.
Another thing that tends to get me odd looks and sympathy points here is when I explain to people what Conservative Indiana is like. Here in "mini Texas," at a transgender support group a couple MtF, not that much older than me, where complaining about how Conservative it is here and all the bigotry at all these places, but when questioned about it the only places they could name where they get grief at are bars. Of course it's not a competition, but in Indiana "going down the street" is one of the many places people people gave me grief. Here, being me, I haven't even noticed anyone sending me a second glare, let alone shooting me glares that need to be permanently frozen on their faces so their ugliness is apparent and visible to the world. And of course in Indiana you just don't see people with tattooed forearms like you do here (especially working with costumers and ESPECIALLY a tattooed man driving a school bus), and the fairly common streaks of blue, purple, and teal that are dyed into hair here, where nobody cares, in Indiana it tends to draw some nasty comments about Halloween and thinking everyday is dress up day. Dress codes also seem to be way more relaxed here, and no one here has said anything about me leaving in my facial jewelry while at work, something that is pretty much a universal no in Indiana if you aren't working in a factory (that doesn't process food) or warehouse.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I have lived for 10 years in and near SF. Its one of the best places to live, period.

I really need to make it up to San Fransisco. I especially want to see Alcatraz (I'd like to tour it if they do that), and have a weekend of dark tourism.

 

[Valjean]

Those with mental challenges go where they're least likely to be hassled. Build an asylum and they will come. If there were other places with liberty and justice for all, they'd go there.

So what are the options? Jail? Mental health facilities? San Francisco? Other?

I was listening to a radical liberal radio station the other day driving home and I was truly and honestly dumbfounded by the lack of basic intelligence that I heard. I swear to God, they forgot the topics they were discussing and couldn't even answer each other -the host had to ask his guest if they had anything more to ad because he couldn't think of anything to say.
I felt bad for them.

Out of curiosity, what was this radical liberal program? If there were other places with liberty and justice for all, they'd go there.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I have lived for 10 years in and near SF. Its one of the best places to live, period.

If you have the wealth, and in an area where those people are pretty much out of sight and mind, I wouldn't doubt it.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Those with mental challenges go where they're least likely to be hassled.

That could be. People here are way laid back, and as I've mentioned a few times people here just are not treating me as poorly as they were in Indiana. If you don't want to be hassled by others, this is definitely the place to get that.
But we'd have to know how many of them are from around the area and how many moved to. Though that, along with winter temperatures that are 60 during the day are not often below freezing at night, would make for an ideal location when you just want to be left alone and have to roof over your head. Also helps we don't have to worry about hurricanes like Florida.

 

[sayak83]

If you have the wealth, and in an area where those people are pretty much out of sight and mind, I wouldn't doubt it.

Explain your answer.
San Francisco has high liveability index compared to most large US cities. See below,
The Most Livable Cities In America
Though most cities are represented by Democrats...so it can be said that urban people prefer liberal governments.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Explain your answer.
San Francisco has high liveability index compared to most large US cities. See below,
The Most Livable Cities In America
Though most cities are represented by Democrats...so it can be said that urban people prefer liberal governments.

Way to go bursting bubbles. They're supposed to believe California as a whole is pretty much LA and San Fransisco, that the cost of living anywhere you are is crippling, you'll be taxed to death, and there aren't many jobs here and the quality of life isn't that good.
At least that's how people I knew in Indiana tended to view California. I gave up on telling people back there I'm not even paying over a grand a month for rent, I'm paying less in taxes here than I was in Indiana, and I'm not having to climb over homeless people to go anywhere.
From what I can see, those on the Right want to hate on California because it is so Blue here and not failing miserably as the Right loves to foretell when things go too much to any group on the Left. It can't be easier here, to them anyways, because the Conservative way is supposed to be the way for job creation, personal financial stability, and economic stability, not the way of welfare, handouts, and a higher minimum wage, which as everyone knows is how the Left ruins society.

 

[Stevicus]

We have yet to determine why it is the way it is. We have determined it is definitely not due to a lack of jobs, and not due to the minimum wage here because minimum wage is going up at least a couple more times and there are still businesses building stores, factories, and warehouses here. But from there thus no one knows even why the city has such a problem with homeless people. Is the drug problem worse than we realize? Are assistance programs clogged and backed up? But we don't even know why they stay instead of going to a different city where the cost of living is significantly cheaper.
And those who think they are "doing nothing" need to catch up on the news. And keep in mind that throughout the state Democrats are in control, yet no other city has the same reputation that San Fransisco has. That's another question that hasn't been answered, and that is what is it specifically about San Fransisco that is causing this? And what is it about California that gives rise to such a presence of those with physical disabilities and who are homeless? If Florida has a higher-than-average homeless rate, it may be the weather that is drawing in the homeless who can make it here.

Yes, I think the weather is a factor in the Sun Belt states, as we have a noticeable homeless population here, too. It might also be due to the perceived wealth in California, whereas in some of the more affordable, less affluent areas, people don't have as much money to spare for panhandlers.

 

[Cooky]

Way to go bursting bubbles. They're supposed to believe California as a whole is pretty much LA and San Fransisco, that the cost of living anywhere you are is crippling, you'll be taxed to death, and there aren't many jobs here and the quality of life isn't that good.
At least that's how people I knew in Indiana tended to view California. I gave up on telling people back there I'm not even paying over a grand a month for rent, I'm paying less in taxes here than I was in Indiana, and I'm not having to climb over homeless people to go anywhere.
From what I can see, those on the Right want to hate on California because it is so Blue here and not failing miserably as the Right loves to foretell when things go too much to any group on the Left. It can't be easier here, to them anyways, because the Conservative way is supposed to be the way for job creation, personal financial stability, and economic stability, not the way of welfare, handouts, and a higher minimum wage, which as everyone knows is how the Left ruins society.

LOL, yeah my dad being the gun fanatic conservative that he is, is always hassling me about leaving California. He thinks I should leave, but I'm in paradise!

Yeah, I'm paying like 3500 a month for rent, but I'm making a killing here. I make over 3 times that a month, straight up... It's steak dinners every other night.