Luminous
non-existential luminary
If you kill someone, but no-one ever finds out, and the person you murdered is not missed, is that not the same situation?
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Wrong to Cheat on Partner?
- Thread starter Kilgore Trout
- Start date
Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
Ostensibly, the person you murdered would mind.
darkendless
Guardian of Asgaard
So would the person you cheated on.
Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
How do you mind something that you don't know about?
That is the case in that example indeed. What is hard to find however, is what exactly that sound is in this scenario. Why is a broken promise in itself regardless of damage wrong?
There are scenarios and not really that extreme where breaking a promise would not only be okay, but the best thing to do. If the grounds the promise was made upon completely changed, and now to keep that promise the other person would be hurt.
darkendless
Guardian of Asgaard
Being an honest person would dictate that they should find out one way or another.
If you don't tell your partner then you don't deserve to breath let alone be in a relationship.
I like what Kathryn said and very much agree.
So far as I know, depending on the study, anywhere from 15% to 40% of partners cheat. It seems hard to believe it never benefits any of them.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
Well, like I said in an earlier post on this thread, you can come up with tortured scenarios in which it may be "the best thing for everyone" to cheat on a partner, but you know as well as I do that generally speaking, it's not the right choice, often brings unexpected complications and dangers along with it, and nearly always damages the relationship even if the damage isn't immediately evident.
We're not talking about telling a little white lie ("You always look beautiful to me, honey.") We're not talking about breaking a little promise ("I promise not to buy a Lotto ticket today.") We're talking about deceit which undermines the very integrity and security of a monogamous relationship.
Quite so i agree. The proposed scenario isn't saying that this is the general case, merely discussing a certain situation.
To make it clear of course its wrong in most cases, and that is exactly based on the fact that most of the time (and possibly always) we can never be sure when it comes to a situation like this.
But the OP as i understand is specifically addressing possible exceptions, thats why saying that its always wrong will need a very good explanation, because thats the entire point of discussion.
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
I don't think there is anything wrong with it as it were, but there is karma of which such things may prove painful and cause remorse. Sometimes things may go without a hitch without repercussions to which is great and fine, other times it may cause one to pause in reflection after all is said and done should things not go as smooth as expected. Point being is to weigh out any repercussions, use foresight, and decide for yourself and fully accept in life whatever happens whether positive or negative be the outcome.
Luminous
non-existential luminary
Not unless they don't notice, or love it while you are doing it to them.
In the being forced to commit adultery case, personally I think that being honorably tortured(the more grotesc and painful the better) or killed is better than subjegating yourself to commit an evil act for the sake of selfish self interests (even if those include the interests of your loved ones.) obviously if your partner allows you to do it its not cheating, so the senerios could change in your favor. Ofcourse one may think differently, perhaps morals aren't as important as life, love, and triumph; or other morals
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I agree. The OP is not asking whether cheating is generally wrong, but rather whether there are instances in which it is right. I certainly believe I've known people who cheated on their partners and in doing so did the best thing they could have done given their circumstances. I would not make it a general rule, "Thou shall cheat on thy partner", but I've seen it work out well for some people.
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I think the problem here is the difficulty of accepting what you just stated, emotionally that is. That in addition to confusing the OP to be excusing or downplaying cheating, rather than addressing these exceptions. Which by the way in that process also shows why there is in the first place such emphasis on breaking a promise always being wrong (which is not the case), as people make these promises in the first place to preserve each side's feelings.
This is also obvious to me in the fact of how people easily get somehow offended when this discussion comes to the point where you have to either address or accept that there are exceptions. I can't see so far one good reason why there wouldn't be exceptions to cheating where its not wrong.
I've seen a few instances in which cheating seems to have been the right -- or at least the best -- course of action given the circumstances. But the one that most comes to mind involved a friend of mine.
His wife cheated on him. He told me that when he found out, he at first felt relieved -- because the two of them were sorely mismatched but emotionally clinging and he was unable to end their loveless marriage from a misplaced sense of duty. After three days of feeling relief, he started to second guess his feelings, and by dwelling on the negatives, he managed to plunge himself into a depression. The depression lasted six months.
It ended one morning when he woke up spontaneously happy. He realized that he was free of a horrible marriage -- but one he never would have willingly left because of his sense of duty. This time around, he was not foolish enough to second guess his feelings, and he says he's felt grateful to his ex-wife ever since that morning.
There seem to be legitimate exceptions to the prohibition against killing your fellow humans. How much more so are there likely to be legitimate exceptions to the prohibition against cheating on your partner.
Great point.
Gloone
Well-Known Member
I will just give my input.
When it comes to dating, you can date whoever, whenever you want. That is how I always viewed it and have never seen anything wrong with. But the person you are dating might find it wrong that you are talking to more than one person so that might cause some conflict or problems, so it is probably just better to know how to handle those situations before they get out of control. So, being somewhat upfront probably works out for the best.
I would probably be a liar if I said there are no benefits. But sometimes I think things just workout for the best either way. I don't think keeping things secretive between you and your partner is the way to go though. I guess it just depends on how seriously you take your relationship. If you don't take it very seriously, then you will probably date or talk to other people.
Cheating often ends up being a lesser evil, as psychoterapists worldwide will very reluctantly tell you when pressed against the wall. It is one of those things that people just don't like to talk about, due to an (IMO accurate) perception that while it may be ultimately useful, no one in his right mind will want to take responsibility for that choice or its destructive consequences.
But cheating it is still wrong. Just because the people involved may well lack the means or the inclination for making a constructive choice and must instead settle for a lesser evil does not make it less wrong.
Maybe it is just me, but my understanding of the meaning of the verb "to cheat" is that it is by definition wrong, a betrayal of the trust of a cared person. Perhaps we should consider using a different wording, perhaps talking about marital infidelity instead.
I don't doubt that strict monogamy isn't always the best arrangement for people who love each other. But calling the exceptions "cheating" leads me to believe that the OP is addressing situations where the feelings of one party are being disrespected by the actions of the other. That is what cheating means, and of course it is wrong, until and unless we have established that it is morally acceptable to hurt the other party or at least to disrespect her.
Which, of course, I think we are all better off not trying to do.
Liberal arrangements may well be a good idea for some people. Perhaps even a pact of voluntary ignorance might be a good idea, although I find the idea a bit self-limiting at least in conception. But then we are hardly talking about cheating, and I certainly don't support unilateral decisions that one party should decide alone what is best for the two of them. Particularly if it ends up being simple rationalization for cheating.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
Here's my problem with this whole thread's premise:
As self-centered humans, we can usually find a way to justify just about anything we do. And even tragic events in our lives can have (eventually) good outcomes. But that doesn't relieve us of our responsibilities to others, including maintaining our integrity in our relationships.
The thing is, when we cheat, we DON'T know that it won't hurt anyone, no matter how much we tell ourselves it won't. We DON'T know whether or not our partner will find out. We DON'T know whether we may contract a disease, or become a party to a pregnancy, or destroy a family.
The risk we subject others to is in many ways just as wrong as the adultery itself.
Sure - we can all come up with scenarios of cheating which have "happy endings." Heck, my ex husband cheated on me, and if I hadn't caught him and divorced him, I wouldn't be married now to a terrific person who is truly my soulmate. That still doesn't justify what he did or make it right or OK.
As for your friend, you are saying that he second guessed his feelings, and "managed to plunge himself into a depression." Having been there - bad marriage, then a cheating spouse whose actions finally pushed me to divorce him, I can assure you that in spite of the GREAT relief one can feel from finally leaving a bad marriage, the fact that your spouse committed adultery is still incredibly painful. I would say that his depression was a perfectly normal response to a very sad situation. He didn't do it to himself - his cheating wife is who is responsible for his grief.