Your view on abortion. Atheist welcome.

[leahrachelle]

No, the point was that this is an ambiguous matter with no right or wrong. There is only perspective

But what if there is right and wrong?

 

[Storm]

What if the moon is made of green cheese?

 

[leahrachelle]

What if the moon is made of green cheese?

What if it is? We assume we know so much about why we're here and what's out there but compared to how big the universe is, we know extremely, extremely little.

 

[Storm]

What if it is? We assume we know so much about why we're here and what's out there but compared to how big the universe is, we know extremely, extremely little.

Little, yes. Not stupid.

 

[leahrachelle]

Little, yes. Not stupid.

Not stupid? Who?

 

[Storm]

If you're trying to seem clever, it isn't working.

 

[DallasApple]

The point was that if everyone isn't right then someone has to be wrong. And we can't all be right on this because most people's ideas contradict others.

Can you not understand that right and wrong can in fact be weighed for each individual?

What if I said its WRONG for a child be to left with a baby sitter while both parents work?..Who gets to decide that? Me? Should you be forced to stay at home because I thought it was "wrong" for the mother to work?

Do you not understand that what is right for you may not be right for me?

Do you want the right to decide for your self? Or do you want me to decide for you?

In this case..If you think its wrong for you to have an abortion then by all means dont have one.I wouldnt force you to even if you were completely unfit.I would call social services though and report you if you were.

Love

Dallas

 

[DallasApple]

What if it is? We assume we know so much about why we're here and what's out there but compared to how big the universe is, we know extremely, extremely little.

Some know more than others sweetheart.Thats what you need to learn at this point.

Love

Dallas

 

[DallasApple]

Also..I've noticed you seem to feel threatened by people trying to "change you".Change you about what?..I would never try and convince you to change your personal view on abortion.That is your view.You in fact seem to be on some sort of mission to change someone elses mind.And as you can see ..as with you ..its not working out.

Love

Dallas

 

[idea]

Exodus 21: 23, shows that God does not consider a forming foetus to be a living person.
If a man in a fight happens to knock a pregnant woman down, and if the woman herself, (A living Person) is hurt in any way, the punishment shall be life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise. But if it only the forming foetus which is lost, the womans husband only has the right to monetary compensation according to the approval of the judges, which is the same as in the case of the death of one of his animals by the hand of his neighbour....

so according to your logic a slave is not a person either, because in Exodus the same exact result is given for a slave as well as a fetus...

20 ¶ And if a man smite his servant, or his maid, with a rod, and he die under his hand; he shall be surely punished.
21 Notwithstanding, if he acontinue a day or two, he shall not be punished: for he is his money.
22 ¶ If men strive, and hurt a woman with achild, so that bher fruit depart from her, and yet no cmischief follow: he shall be surely punished,
(Old Testament | Exodus 21:20 - 22)

You know, awhile ago people did not really know what was going on in the womb... people know a lot more now though...

A baby in the womb can:
think
hear
see
feel
has their own blood type
their own heartbeat
their own set of DNA etc. etc...

CatholicVote.org

horror to kill them

 

[Willamena]

Right. And the point is, we will change.

I certainly hope so.

Person A says it is not a human being
Person B says it is

How are they both right?

If no one can be right, then we are all wrong.

 

[DallasApple]

so according to your logic a slave is not a person either, because in Exodus the same exact result is given for a slave as well as a fetus...

20 ¶ And if a man smite his servant, or his maid, with a rod, and he die under his hand; he shall be surely punished.
21 Notwithstanding, if he acontinue a day or two, he shall not be punished: for he is his money.
22 ¶ If men strive, and hurt a woman with achild, so that bher fruit depart from her, and yet no cmischief follow: he shall be surely punished,
(Old Testament | Exodus21:20 - 22)

You know, awhile ago people did not really know what was going on in the womb... people know a lot more now though...

A baby in the womb can:
think
hear
see
feel
has their own blood type
their own heartbeat
their own set of DNA etc. etc...

CatholicVote.org

horror to kill them

Dna and blood type..have only occurred in the very earliest abortions.there is no heartbeat ..there is no feeling..no hearing..no sight..and certaintly no thought.

So if that is your argument..you should be O>k with early abortions.Unless DNA and blood type constitutes a person.

And if thats the case..You shold be MARCHING in disgust and PROTEST that brain dead people who have DNA and a BlOOD TYPE are taken off of life support.And you should be even MORE marching against their(fully formed) organs are harvested (with family permission) to save other lives.

Love

DAllas

 

[idea]

The heart is the first organ to form in a fetus' body. ... there is a heartbeat. Have you ever been pregnant? You go into the doctor's office, and they let you listen to the heartbeat. Thta's how you know everything is going ok - when you can hear their little heart...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RS1ti23SUSw

Their little eyes can see. You can put a flashlight up to your tummy, and they squirm! It really works. They actually like the dark better - keep you up all night long, then they sleep during the day. They can hear - my second and third could recognize the voices of their siblings in the delivery room. They can hear, they respond to noises - I went to a big fireworks show when I was prego - squirmed and squired at each blast, I felt a little bad about subjecting them to that scary noise.

If you have been pregnant, you know they are alive. You know they are human, you know they are worth everything you can possibly give to them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03NE1zjYltI&feature=related

How do you define life?
YouTube - Life Begins at Fertilization

 

[idea]

LOL!

YouTube - Baby almost kicking out of mothers stomach
I can relate to this one!

 

[darkendless]

What makes you think that we are overpopulated? Do you not have all of the resources that you need to live plus some..? I don't think we are close to overpopulation at all. I think we could easily double our population and still be fine. If I had to guess, I'd say the earth's carrying capacity is somewhere between 15 and 20 billion.

Because i've studied a subject on sustainability, people who know a lot more than you and I have said so.
With your ideaology its obvious to see why the world is the way it is. We wait until we cannot wait any longer to address problems. Its a sick mentality that we need to get over. We are over-populated, we can barely sustain ourselves. At the moment we're managing but it will not get any easier with the urbanisation of the world. Mark my words.

 

[DallasApple]

The heart is the first organ to form in a fetus' body. ... there is a heartbeat. Have you ever been pregnant? You go into the doctor's office, and they let you listen to the heartbeat. Thta's how you know everything is going ok - when you can hear their little heart...
YouTube - fetal development

Their little eyes can see. You can put a flashlight up to your tummy, and they squirm! It really works. They actually like the dark better - keep you up all night long, then they sleep during the day. They can hear - my second and third could recognize the voices of their siblings in the delivery room. They can hear, they respond to noises - I went to a big fireworks show when I was prego - squirmed and squired at each blast, I felt a little bad about subjecting them to that scary noise.

If you have been pregnant, you know they are alive. You know they are human, you know they are worth everything you can possibly give to them.

YouTube - Diary Of An Unborn Baby

How do you define life?
YouTube - Life Begins at Fertilization

The heart may very well be the first organ to form.But before it forms there is no heart let alone a heartbeat.

Love

Dallas

 

[DallasApple]

Because i've studied a subject on sustainability, people who know a lot more than you and I have said so.
With your ideaology its obvious to see why the world is the way it is. We wait until we cannot wait any longer to address problems. Its a sick mentality that we need to get over. We are over-populated, we can barely sustain ourselves. At the moment we're managing but it will not get any easier with the urbanisation of the world. Mark my words.

But if i we have "all the resources " we personally need and then some ..it couldnt possibly be the world is over populated.Don't you undertand that? I personally think that the world could handle at LEAST 30 or 40 billion people.To assume otherwise is just plain wrong.

Love

Dallas

 

[darkendless]

But fi we have "all the resources " we personally need and then some ..it couldnt possibly be the world is over populated.Don't you undertand that? I personally think that the world could handle at LEAST 30 or 40 billion people.To assume otherwise is just plain wrong.

Love

Dallas

We expend too many resources in transporting resources to their destination. If you looked at an aerial photo of Shanghai 10 years ago, and then now, you would see a drastic difference. Simply speaking, we do not have the resources and method of transportation to feed the world. With these mega cities (London, Shanghai, New York etc.) they are simply users. These cities often do nothing but drain the resources in rural areas which are becomming sparse due to urbanisation (people moving to the city). At the moment its ok, people assume your position because they're not personally affected. However, the urbanisation of the world is killing us. This means that essentials like food at water have to be transported hundreds of miles in some cases. Have you any idea what kind of logistics that involves?

Then we get to salinisation, which is basically salting the land. Because we have to harvest and grow at an accelerated rate to accomodate increasing populations, the land is becomming less and less fertile. I don't know about America but Australia and Argentina are suffering pretty badly from this. A long time ago Egypt suffered as well. Natural disasters and the sort also do their bit.

My point is we're stretching the limits of our means to provide for ourselves. we're fine now, but in 30 years time things could be much darker.

 

[DallasApple]

We expend too many resources in transporting resources to their destination. If you looked at an aerial photo of Shanghai 10 years ago, and then now, you would see a drastic difference. Simply speaking, we do not have the resources and method of transportation to feed the world. With these mega cities (London, Shanghai, New York etc.) they are simply users. These cities often do nothing but drain the resources in rural areas which are becomming sparse due to urbanisation (people moving to the city). At the moment its ok, people assume your position because they're not personally affected. However, the urbanisation of the world is killing us. This means that essentials like food at water have to be transported hundreds of miles in some cases. Have you any idea what kind of logistics that involves?

Then we get to salinisation, which is basically salting the land. Because we have to harvest and grow at an accelerated rate to accomodate increasing populations, the land is becomming less and less fertile. I don't know about America but Australia and Argentina are suffering pretty badly from this. A long time ago Egypt suffered as well. Natural disasters and the sort also do their bit.

My point is we're stretching the limits of our means to provide for ourselves. we're fine now, but in 30 years time things could be much darker.

I dont know what you mean.But all Im saying is I have a very good feeling we are doing just fine as we are.We should stop assuming about things we dont even know about.

Besides that..we can give the land some fertilizer.And if we need logistics we can just drive there.

Love

Dallas

 

[darkendless]

I dont know what you mean.But all Im saying is I have a very good feeling we are doing just fine as we are.We should stop assuming about things we dont even know about.

Besides that..we can give the land some fertilizer.And if we need logistics we can just drive there.

Love

Dallas

Sadly though the world does know, but we're all stuck in this rediculous mentality that everything is fine until a crisis hits. Look what happened when oil went over $125 a barrel. The world went nuts, everything went up in price. Then when it went down again everyone stopped worrying. Its frsutrating to see people ignore the reality. Sure fuel is cheap right now but long will it take for it to go up again? Sure we have enough food now but what happens as our population grows? We simply can't just grow more food. The urban population of the world is around 75%. How can we expect the 25% of the rural population to sustain the city dwellers who increase every year? More and more people move to cities every year. These cities are users and not producers. As the producers weaken the cities grow and the stress on our logitics and our supply of food gets stronger.
Drastic means are required to prevent a worldwide crisis. Its terribly sad that most of the world cant understand or cannot be bothered.