Antichrist Discussions ~ FFH ~

[DeepShadow]

I think the ultimate Antichrist will be an alien from the Dagobah system, who will awaken Cthulhu and perform an insiduous Vulcan mind-meld on the current President, who will be Paris Hilton.

What? My speculations are as valid as anyone else's.

Late breaking news! My toddler has been mumbling "dgb dgb dgb"! This is obviously the hard consonants in the name "Dagobah" (excluding the "h" which is aspirated).

Think she's trying to warn me? Could the end be near?

 

[FFH]

I'm not denying that, FFH, and while I hesistate to speak for Nutshell, his arguments so far in this thread have been specific: to say that our church has never changed is fallacious. It has changed, many times. I believe it's always been for the better. I embrace that change as part of the wonders of the gospel, that as we are ready, more is revealed.

Thus, criticizing another church for changing--especially changing for the better--is hypocritical.

Well but if you look at the changes being made in the Vatican and to their Catechism, it's not for the better...

For instance graven image worship was taken out of the Catechism, which is included in the Ten Commandments, but not in the Catechism of the Catholic church, and the changes are clear and posted for all to see..

Most Catholics members may not even be aware of this.

Catechism of the Catholic Church - The Ten Commandments

 

[Bishka]

Well but if you look at the changes being made in the Vatican and the Catechism, it's not for the better...

For instance Idol worship was taken out of the Catechism and the changes are clear and posted for all to see..

Catechism of the Catholic Church - The Ten Commandments

You obviously do not know Catholic theology very well. Let them explain in, just like we do not like people trying to explain ours. Let the Catholics explain theres.

 

[DeepShadow]

Easy DeepShadow, we're not fanatics about this, just look at scripture..

God is not against the Catholics, but against some of it's practices and leaders as well as members, just as he is against many of our practices, leaders and members, it's no different with us or any other Christian religion, also look at the Jews, God does not hate the Jews, but there are many he opposes, who are not doing what he wants them to do, the Holocaust was a result of the Jews not listening to him and escaping their enemies when they were warned to flee Germany...

The Jews were warned to sell their houses, land and businesses and flee certain parts of Europe in order to avoid the persecution they went through but they refused to do so...

Some one will inevitably misread that last bit...Again, easy big fella, no one is taking this that far...

I see more antagonism from you and Nutshell than from Madhatter...

We all need to be a bit more sensitive, but not at the expense of being in the dark about certain practices of ALL religions...

We (LDS) need to be scrutinized just as the Catholic church needs to be scrutinized so that evil does not persist in either religion...

This isnt about hate its about love and helping our fellow man see the truth...

Truth is good and it needs to be brought out into the light as do the lies and evil practices of ALL religions who frofess to be Christian...

God judges the his church first, then the world...

Doctrine and Covenants reveals this...

God will judge us (ALL Christian religions and the Jews first) before he judges the world, because we now better..

....FFH, I feel the spirit in your words. I agree that there are flaws in all churches, and that we need to scrutinize ourselves better. I took MadHatter as saying something else, but if that's not what he was saying, than I have no argument with him.

If it makes any difference to you, I'm taking you off my ignore list. Thanks for helping me keep focus.

 

[FFH]

You obviously do not know Catholic theology very well. Let them explain in, just like we do not like people trying to explain ours. Let the Catholics explain theres.

All I have to do is look it up and it's right there, no need for an explanation from any member, they may not even be aware of their own doctrine as set forth by the leaders of the Vatican, it being changed so often.

 

[DeepShadow]

Well but if you look at the changes being made in the Vatican and to their Catechism, it's not for the better...

For instance graven image worship was taken out of the Catechism, which is included in the Ten Commandments, but not in the Catechism of the Catholic church, and the changes are clear and posted for all to see..

Most Catholics members may not even be aware of this.

Catechism of the Catholic Church - The Ten Commandments

Geez, FFH! What gives? Would you accept someone from the Catholic church explaining our doctrines? Would you go to a Ford dealer to find out about Chevies?

 

[FFH]

The Mormon Meadow Massacre is now being paralleled as a Mormon Jihad, of sorts, by many. We are being scrutinized more than ever before, especially because there is a good possibility of this country being run by a Mormon now...

We need to scrutinize ALL religions and thier beliefs, to do otherwise would not allow positive changes to occur, which needs to happen before Christ returns to the earth, or the earth and it's inhabitants will all be in trouble...

 

[Bishka]

All I have to do is look it up and it's right there, no need for an explanation from any member, they may not even be aware of their own doctrine as set forth by the leaders of the Vatican, it being changed so often.

Disgusting. Just because 'it's there for everyone to read' doesn't mean you understand it. Ours is there for everyone to read, but that doesn't mean they all understand it.

 

[FFH]

Scrutinizing various political and religious leaders and other prominent political and religious members allows for positive changes to occur

 

[Bishka]

Geez, FFH! What gives? Would you accept someone from the Catholic church explaining our doctrines? Would you go to a Ford dealer to find out about Chevies?

Apparently.

I think from now on FFH, I'm going to go to *Paul* and Joeboonda and ask them to explain the LDS theology to me -- makes much more sense that way. :areyoucra

 

[FFH]

Just because 'it's there for everyone to read' doesn't mean you understand it. Ours is there for everyone to read, but that doesn't mean they all understand it.

I don't need anyone to interprete our doctrine or anyone elses, I only need to read and study it myself, as do the members of any religious organization.

Interpreting any doctrine is dangerous..

Read it and let the spirit dictate the truth...

How hard can it be to read something and understand it ????

We are a society that would rather pay someone else to interprete scripture for us than read it ourselves and allow the spirit to testify to us the things we don't understand...

 

[Bishka]

How hard can it be to read something and understand it ????

Difficult if you don't understand their theology, which by your postings, you do not. :no:

 

[DeepShadow]

Scrutinizing various political and religious leaders and other prominent political and religious members allows for positive changes to occur

Yes, but this has to be done properly. After all, people tried to link Bill Clinton to murders that occured in Arkansas based on nothing more than the fact that he was governor at the time. We need to use some sense.

 

[FFH]

Geez, FFH! What gives? Would you accept someone from the Catholic church explaining our doctrines? Would you go to a Ford dealer to find out about Chevies?

I'm sure that most Catholics agree that graven images should not be worshipped, but it's no longer included in their Catechism..

 

[Bishka]

I'm sure that most Catholics agree that graven images should not be worshipped, but it's no longer included in their Cathechism..

And?

Worry about your own theology, not theirs.

 

[DeepShadow]

How hard can it be to read something and understand it ????

Apparently quite difficult. The catachism you cite is one of MANY. I've collected and read a few, and several include the part about graven images. So you are committing a cherry-picking fallacy, choosing what supports your belief and discarding the rest.

 

[madhatter85]

I scrutinize my own religion very carefuly, because i want to know the truth.

But i let the spirit dictate to me what is the truth and what needs to be done for my own salvation. which requires fasting and fervent prayer.

my heavenly father knows what is best for me and how i can attain my highest potential and be a tool in his hands.

the things i say may sound confrontational, but in reality it's just observations and my own personal experiences.

i've seen things the way FFH is saying things since i was a kid, i was about 9 or so when i started studying these things.

I'm not ashamed about what i have said and what i have posted because i know it to be the truth.

Unfortunately for some people, in the Book Of Mormon it even states, that "The Wicked take the truth to be hard; for it cutteth them down to the core" probably not verbatim, but close enough.

I am pretty disappointed with some of the people on these forums claiming to be LDS when they are going about tyring to prove the church wrong, and posting blatant things against other members of the church, antagonizing and such. calling thier own church hypocrites. It has been stated since the church was founded, That God will never allow a prophet to lead his church astray, if he was to, he would be removed from his post. but we are to always pray about what the prophets have said and find out for ourselves the truth and what is perdinent to our own slavation. symmantecs of the past do not at all affect my own personal salvation.

 

[DeepShadow]

Where did I (or anyone else) call the church a hypocrite?

 

[DeepShadow]

Unfortunately for some people, in the Book Of Mormon it even states, that "The Wicked take the truth to be hard; for it cutteth them down to the core" probably not verbatim, but close enough.

And the righteous take lies to be hard. Begging the question.

I am pretty disappointed with some of the people on these forums claiming to be LDS when they are going about tyring to prove the church wrong, and posting blatant things against other members of the church, antagonizing and such. calling thier own church hypocrites.

I've never been trying to prove the church wrong. I've said that it changes, and I'm quite glad of it. Scripture itself says that there are changes!

"Line upon line, precept upon precept..."

"New and everlasting covenant..."

"We believe that He will yet reveal many great and important things..."

"The Lord is extending the Saints' understanding..."

It has been stated since the church was founded, That God will never allow a prophet to lead his church astray, if he was to, he would be removed from his post.

True. Relevance?

but we are to always pray about what the prophets have said and find out for ourselves the truth and what is perdinent to our own slavation. symmantecs of the past do not at all affect my own personal salvation

Good. I'm glad. Seriously.:yes:

Trying to stay in the spirit of reconciliation, MH, I gotta tell you that you're coming across as quite antagonistic of Catholic beliefs, and that while lacking a lot of knowledge about them. I hope I'm wrong. I want to be wrong.

The bottom line is that I don't feel ths Spirit from your posts. I feel the spirit of contention, and that's something I'll oppose in any form, no matter who it comes from. I don't care if you are LDS, if you have the spirit of contention, I will testify against you. That's YOU, not the LDS church. I'd never try to tear the church down--on the contrary, I'm trying to build it up and make sure it's not misrepresented.

If we can agree on some of this, I will gladly bury the hatchet.

 

[FFH]

Revelation 13: 15
And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.