Become a muslim in three days or die

[ecco]

“Whoso layeth claim to a Revelation direct from God, ere the expiration of a full thousand years, such a man is assuredly a lying impostor.

Wow, that's really cool. What I say goes for 1000 years. Anyone who tells you different is a liar.

But was that said exactly 1000 years after a different pronouncement?

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

Banned Mormon Cartoon

I am not at all surprised by who made that comment.

 

[loverofhumanity]

"Revelation direct from God" Unquote.

Will one like to first tell us in a straightforward manner?:

Did Bahaullah say that he is a servant of G-d, not a G-d, and there is no other G-d but G-d and denied god-head for him (Bahaullah) in clear and unequivocal manner?
​

One will please appreciate that it has got a direct bearing on the issue of
"Revelation direct from God".

Regards

Words of Baha’u’llah...

Certain ones among you,” He declared, “have said: ‘He it is Who hath laid claim to be God.’ By God! This is a gross calumny. I am but a servant of God Who hath believed in Him and in His signs… My tongue, and My heart, and My inner and My outer being testify that there is no God but Him, that all others have been created by His behest, and been fashioned through the operation of His Will…. I am He that telleth abroad the favors with which God hath, through His bounty, favored Me. If this be My transgression, then I am truly the first of the transgressors….” (Gleanings)

When I contemplate, O my God, the relationship that bindeth me to Thee, I am moved to proclaim to all created things ‘verily I am God!’; and when I consider my own self, lo, I find it coarser than clay!” (World Order of Baha’u’llah)

I was but a man like others, asleep upon My couch, when lo, the breezes of the All-Glorious were wafted over Me, and taught Me the knowledge of all that hath been. This thing is not from Me, but from One Who is Almighty and All-Knowing. And He bade Me lift up My voice between earth and heaven, ..(Epistle to the Shah)

Station of God

Were any of the all-embracing Manifestations of God to declare: "I am God," He, verily, speaketh the truth, and no doubt attacheth thereto. For it hath been repeatedly demonstrated that through their Revelation, their attributes and names, the Revelation of God, His names and His attributes, are made manifest in the world.

Station of Messenger

And were any of them to voice the utterance, "I am the Messenger of God," He, also, speaketh the truth, the indubitable truth. Even as He saith: "Muhammad is not the father of any man among you, but He is the Messenger of God."

Station of Servant

And were they to say, "We are the Servants of God," this also is a manifest and indisputable fact. For they have been made manifest in the uttermost state of servitude, a servitude the like of which no man can possibly attain. Thus in moments in which these Essences of Being were deep immersed beneath the oceans of ancient and everlasting holiness, or when they soared to the loftiest summits of Divine mysteries, they claimed their utterances to be the Voice of Divinity, the Call of God Himself.

So to recapitulate. No Baha’u’llah is not God but thenRepresentstive of God Who is endowed with authority from God to speak on God’s behalf.

So it is said that ...

Thus, He hath revealed: "Those shafts were God's, not Thine." And also He saith: "In truth, they who plighted fealty unto Thee, really plighted that fealty unto God.

Quran 48:10

Indeed, those who pledge allegiance to you, [O Muúammad] they are actually pledging allegiance to Allah.

It’s clear then that Muhammad and Baha’u’llah are not God but God’s Representstives but certain verses like the one from the Quran can be read as if Muhammad was God but He made it clear He was a Messenger however by turning away from God’s Messenger is the same as turning away from God.

The same with Baha’u’llah. Baha’u’llah is not God at all. But as God has appointed Hin as His Representative then to turn away from Baha’u’llah as it is with Muhammad or any Divine Messenger is the same as turning away from God.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Wow, that's really cool. What I say goes for 1000 years. Anyone who tells you different is a liar.

But was that said exactly 1000 years after a different pronouncement?

He’s only making a statement of fact or a prophecy if you want to call it that.

 

[ecco]

Wow, that's really cool. What I say goes for 1000 years. Anyone who tells you different is a liar.

But was that said exactly 1000 years after a different pronouncement?

He’s only making a statement of fact or a prophecy if you want to call it that.

No.

1. He is saying that all other religions for the next 1000 years are false religions because he said that all other religions for the next 1000 years are false religions.

2. Did someone say something similar 1000 years prior to that?

 

[loverofhumanity]

No.

1. He is saying that all other religions for the next 1000 years are false religions because he said that all other religions for the next 1000 years are false religions.

2. Did someone say something similar 1000 years prior to that?

He is saying that there will not be another new revelation direct from God for a 1000 years but the major religions gone before such as Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Buddhism and Hinduism as well as the Zoroastrian Faith are all considered to be true religions.

Only any new religions that may arise, won’t be from God but man made and invented. So God is telling us through Baha’u’llah that any religion or person who established one within the next 1000 years will not have come from God.

Christ also warned of false teachers and that we should only turn to the Educator God sends to us not clergy or priests.

 

[Muffled]

Epic Beard Man takes a whole screen to tell us that Islamic law has the death penalty for abandoning Islam. Didn't we already know that?

And why does the person who was "born a Muslim" get treated worse than the one who converted? The convert made a promise to Allah and broke it. The "born Muslim" did nothing except draw the short straw when it came to parents.

And why can't Allah punish those who defy him, rather than rely on human law courts?

I don't know of any law in the Qu'ran to that extent so I believe it was developed from the evil in men's hearts.

 

[Muffled]

Probably not. In places where Sharia is active it's possible you will be beaten for acts which insult the religion. While death is certainly on the books, it's not very common except in the most extreme areas. If you can keep your mouth shut though, they'll probably just ignore you.

I believe the problem is that Jesus never allows His servants to keep their mouths shut.

 

[Muffled]

I hope this helps clarify it a bit. Sorry about it being so lengthy.

This is a quote from His Most Holy Book regarding there not being another Messenger from God for at least a thousand years.

“Whoso layeth claim to a Revelation direct from God, ere the expiration of a full thousand years, such a man is assuredly a lying impostor. We pray God that He may graciously assist him to retract and repudiate such claim. Should he repent, God will, no doubt, forgive him. If, however, he persisteth in his error, God will, assuredly, send down one who will deal mercilessly with him. Terrible, indeed, is God in punishing! Whosoever interpreteth this verse otherwise than its obvious meaning is deprived of the Spirit of God and of His mercy which encompasseth all created things.”

Excerpt from
The Kitab-i-Aqdas
Bahá'u'lláh

This begins in 1852...

The intimation of His Revelation to Bahá'u'lláh in the Síyáh-Chál of Tihrán, in October 1852, marks the birth of His Prophetic Mission and hence the commencement of the one thousand years or more that must elapse before the appearance of the next Manifestation of God."

(Notes to the Kitáb-i-Aqdas, note 62)

That would be about 834 years from this year.

The provisions of the Most Holy Book are binding for that time.

this "Most Holy Book," whose provisions must remain inviolate for no less than a thousand years, and whose system will embrace the entire planet, may well be regarded as the brightest emanation of the mind of Bahá'u'lláh, as the Mother Book of His Dispensation, and the Charter of His New World Order."

(Shoghi Effendi, God Passes By, p. 214; Also cited in the Kitáb-i-Aqdas, p. 12)

I believe the B man made a false statement. Christians are always in all time able to bring a direct revelation of God and I know I can.

 

[ecco]

ecco:
1. He is saying that all other religions for the next 1000 years are false religions because he said that all other religions for the next 1000 years are false religions.

2. Did someone say something similar 1000 years prior to that?​

He is saying that there will not be another new revelation direct from God for a 1000 years but the major religions gone before such as Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Buddhism and Hinduism as well as the Zoroastrian Faith are all considered to be true religions.

I never indicated anything different.

Only any new religions that may arise, won’t be from God but man made and invented. So God is telling us through Baha’u’llah that any religion or person who established one within the next 1000 years will not have come from God.

Yeah. That's why I said:
He is saying that all other religions for the next 1000 years are false religions because he said that all other religions for the next 1000 years are false religions.

That's why I commented that it was a great tactic. Call them false religions beforehand. Great, but nothing really new. The OT expresses similar sentiments.

But what I asked was:
Did someone say something similar 1000 years prior to that?

Is this 1000 year reign something that just started with Bahá'u'lláh in 1863, or has the 1000 year concept always been in effect? If the 1000 concept has always been in effect, then Islam came too soon (613) and Christianity is way off. If Christianity is right, then a prophet should have come along at 1000 CE and the next not until 2000 CE.

 

[ecco]

I don't know of any law in the Qu'ran to that extent so I believe it was developed from the evil in men's hearts.

Reread the thread. The specific verses from the Koran were posted early on.

 

[paarsurrey]

Words of Baha’u’llah...

Certain ones among you,” He declared, “have said: ‘He it is Who hath laid claim to be God.’ By God! This is a gross calumny. I am but a servant of God Who hath believed in Him and in His signs… My tongue, and My heart, and My inner and My outer being testify that there is no God but Him, that all others have been created by His behest, and been fashioned through the operation of His Will…. I am He that telleth abroad the favors with which God hath, through His bounty, favored Me. If this be My transgression, then I am truly the first of the transgressors….” (Gleanings)

When I contemplate, O my God, the relationship that bindeth me to Thee, I am moved to proclaim to all created things ‘verily I am God!’; and when I consider my own self, lo, I find it coarser than clay!” (World Order of Baha’u’llah)

I was but a man like others, asleep upon My couch, when lo, the breezes of the All-Glorious were wafted over Me, and taught Me the knowledge of all that hath been. This thing is not from Me, but from One Who is Almighty and All-Knowing. And He bade Me lift up My voice between earth and heaven, ..(Epistle to the Shah)

Station of God

Were any of the all-embracing Manifestations of God to declare: "I am God," He, verily, speaketh the truth, and no doubt attacheth thereto. For it hath been repeatedly demonstrated that through their Revelation, their attributes and names, the Revelation of God, His names and His attributes, are made manifest in the world.

Station of Messenger

And were any of them to voice the utterance, "I am the Messenger of God," He, also, speaketh the truth, the indubitable truth. Even as He saith: "Muhammad is not the father of any man among you, but He is the Messenger of God."

Station of Servant

And were they to say, "We are the Servants of God," this also is a manifest and indisputable fact. For they have been made manifest in the uttermost state of servitude, a servitude the like of which no man can possibly attain. Thus in moments in which these Essences of Being were deep immersed beneath the oceans of ancient and everlasting holiness, or when they soared to the loftiest summits of Divine mysteries, they claimed their utterances to be the Voice of Divinity, the Call of God Himself.

So to recapitulate. No Baha’u’llah is not God but thenRepresentstive of God Who is endowed with authority from God to speak on God’s behalf.

So it is said that ...

Thus, He hath revealed: "Those shafts were God's, not Thine." And also He saith: "In truth, they who plighted fealty unto Thee, really plighted that fealty unto God.

Quran 48:10

Indeed, those who pledge allegiance to you, [O Muúammad] they are actually pledging allegiance to Allah.

It’s clear then that Muhammad and Baha’u’llah are not God but God’s Representstives but certain verses like the one from the Quran can be read as if Muhammad was God but He made it clear He was a Messenger however by turning away from God’s Messenger is the same as turning away from God.

The same with Baha’u’llah. Baha’u’llah is not God at all. But as God has appointed Hin as His Representative then to turn away from Baha’u’llah as it is with Muhammad or any Divine Messenger is the same as turning away from God.

"Baha’u’llah is not God at all." Unquote.

Thanks for one's input.
Please declare again here without any qualifications and firmly :

Bahaullah is not G-d, in any form and or in any position.
Bahaullah is a servant of G-d, not a G-d, and there is no other G-d but G-d and I deny god-head for him (Bahaullah) in clear and unequivocal manner.

Regards

 

[loverofhumanity]

"Baha’u’llah is not God at all." Unquote.

Thanks for one's input.
Please declare again here without any qualifications and firmly :

Bahaullah is not G-d, in any form and or in any position.
Bahaullah is a servant of G-d, not a G-d, and there is no other G-d but G-d and I deny god-head for him (Bahaullah) in clear and unequivocal manner.

Regards

Yes that’s correct. Baha’u’llah is not God in any form. His own Words should make that absolutely clear. There is indeed no God but God.

 

[loverofhumanity]

ecco:
1. He is saying that all other religions for the next 1000 years are false religions because he said that all other religions for the next 1000 years are false religions.

2. Did someone say something similar 1000 years prior to that?​

I never indicated anything different.



Yeah. That's why I said:
He is saying that all other religions for the next 1000 years are false religions because he said that all other religions for the next 1000 years are false religions.

That's why I commented that it was a great tactic. Call them false religions beforehand. Great, but nothing really new. The OT expresses similar sentiments.

But what I asked was:
Did someone say something similar 1000 years prior to that?

Is this 1000 year reign something that just started with Bahá'u'lláh in 1863, or has the 1000 year concept always been in effect? If the 1000 concept has always been in effect, then Islam came too soon (613) and Christianity is way off. If Christianity is right, then a prophet should have come along at 1000 CE and the next not until 2000 CE.

There are prophecies regarding future Messengers in the Old and New Testament as well as the Quran.

They (the Messengers) each confirm the Prophet gone before them as true and give an estimated time or and signs which will accompany the One to come after Them. So for instance the Jews in the Holy Book were given signs of the coming of Jesus, Muhammad, the Bab and Baha’u’llah and so were the Christians in the Bible given times for the coming of Christ’s return and there is even an entire chapter regarding Islam in the Book of Revelation. The Quran speaks of the Revelation of the Bab as well as the coming of Baha’u’llah.

The reason not everyone has yet discovered these truths is that as Jesus said it would be the pure in heart which would see God. In other words ones heart must be pure and cleansed of worldly defilements in order to recognize a new Messenger from God. Also, seek and you shall find applies here. If one doesn’t seek then nothing is found. A sincere effort must be made or truth will remain hidden. So a hunger is required to search for truth not just debate and argument.

But the signs, proofs and tokens are all there for anyone who wishes to investigate them for himself. Only by independent unbiased research can one find truth. No one can find truth for another person as it is a journey we all must embark upon by ourself if we are to find it.

 

[ecco]

There are prophecies regarding future Messengers in the Old and New Testament as well as the Quran.

They (the Messengers) each confirm the Prophet gone before them as true and give an estimated time or and signs which will accompany the One to come after Them. So for instance the Jews in the Holy Book were given signs of the coming of Jesus, Muhammad, the Bab and Baha’u’llah and so were the Christians in the Bible given times for the coming of Christ’s return and there is even an entire chapter regarding Islam in the Book of Revelation. The Quran speaks of the Revelation of the Bab as well as the coming of Baha’u’llah.

The reason not everyone has yet discovered these truths is that as Jesus said it would be the pure in heart which would see God. In other words ones heart must be pure and cleansed of worldly defilements in order to recognize a new Messenger from God. Also, seek and you shall find applies here. If one doesn’t seek then nothing is found. A sincere effort must be made or truth will remain hidden. So a hunger is required to search for truth not just debate and argument.

But the signs, proofs and tokens are all there for anyone who wishes to investigate them for himself. Only by independent unbiased research can one find truth. No one can find truth for another person as it is a journey we all must embark upon by ourself if we are to find it.

Your long post does not address the question I have repeatedly asked. It regards the timing of Messengers/Prophets.

Is this 1000 year reign something that just started with Bahá'u'lláh in 1863, or has the 1000 year concept always been in effect? If the 1000 concept has always been in effect, then Islam came too soon (613) and Christianity is way off. If Christianity is right, then a prophet should have come along at 1000 CE and the next not until 2000 CE.

Please try to address the actual question being raised.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Your long post does not address the question I have repeatedly asked. It regards the timing of Messengers/Prophets.

Is this 1000 year reign something that just started with Bahá'u'lláh in 1863, or has the 1000 year concept always been in effect? If the 1000 concept has always been in effect, then Islam came too soon (613) and Christianity is way off. If Christianity is right, then a prophet should have come along at 1000 CE and the next not until 2000 CE.

Please try to address the actual question being raised.

No they don’t all say 1,000 years Some mention 2300 years and others 1260 years all attached to specific historical occurrences.

The start time is usually attached to some event such as the rebuilding of Jerusalem or how long Israel would be occupied by gentiles.

Baha’u’llah only stated that ‘not within a 1,000 years’ would another Messenger appear but it could be longer.

 

[ecco]

No they don’t all say 1,000 years Some mention 2300 years and others 1260 years all attached to specific historical occurrences.

The start time is usually attached to some event such as the rebuilding of Jerusalem or how long Israel would be occupied by gentiles.

Baha’u’llah only stated that ‘not within a 1,000 years’ would another Messenger appear but it could be longer.

So...
Your 1863 prophet is at least 1000 after Islam? OK
Your 613 prophet Mohammed/Allah is at least 1000 after ___________?

It still doesn't add up and it skips Jesus.

 

[loverofhumanity]

So...
Your 1863 prophet is at least 1000 after Islam? OK
Your 613 prophet Mohammed/Allah is at least 1000 after ___________?

It still doesn't add up and it skips Jesus.

I

So...
Your 1863 prophet is at least 1000 after Islam? OK
Your 613 prophet Mohammed/Allah is at least 1000 after ___________?

It still doesn't add up and it skips Jesus.

The Holy Books must be referred to in order to determine when these events are to occur not just applying 1,000 years.

 

[paarsurrey]

There are prophecies regarding future Messengers in the Old and New Testament as well as the Quran.

They (the Messengers) each confirm the Prophet gone before them as true and give an estimated time or and signs which will accompany the One to come after Them. So for instance the Jews in the Holy Book were given signs of the coming of Jesus, Muhammad, the Bab and Baha’u’llah and so were the Christians in the Bible given times for the coming of Christ’s return and there is even an entire chapter regarding Islam in the Book of Revelation. The Quran speaks of the Revelation of the Bab as well as the coming of Baha’u’llah.

The reason not everyone has yet discovered these truths is that as Jesus said it would be the pure in heart which would see God. In other words ones heart must be pure and cleansed of worldly defilements in order to recognize a new Messenger from God. Also, seek and you shall find applies here. If one doesn’t seek then nothing is found. A sincere effort must be made or truth will remain hidden. So a hunger is required to search for truth not just debate and argument.

But the signs, proofs and tokens are all there for anyone who wishes to investigate them for himself. Only by independent unbiased research can one find truth. No one can find truth for another person as it is a journey we all must embark upon by ourself if we are to find it.

"The Quran speaks of the Revelation of the Bab as well as the coming of Baha’u’llah." Unquote.

Please don't misrepresent Quran.
Quran does not speak of Revelation to Bahaullah.
If Bahaullah talked about it, then it is a good proof of his fallibility to misunderstand Quran, please.

Regards

 

[loverofhumanity]

"The Quran speaks of the Revelation of the Bab as well as the coming of Baha’u’llah." Unquote.

Please don't misrepresent Quran.
Quran does not speak of Revelation to Bahauallah

That is your individual opinion which you are fully entitled to. I see it very differently. Let God decide between us then.

Quran 31:27

And if all trees that are on the earth were to be pens, and the ocean (converted into ink) is supported by seven seas following it, the words of Allah would not come to an end. Surely, Allah is Mighty, Wise.

The Quran itself says the Words of God will never end. So for Baha’u’llah to come and bring new Words from God is in full agreement with this passage in the Quran.

This is one of many references which I believe refers to the coming of Baha’u’llah :

And thy Lord shall come with angels, rank on rank, (89:22)

People once denounced Jesus as false. Were they right? And they were supposed to be the most learned of their day!

By accepting Baha’u’llah, I believe I am remaining faithful to the Covenant of God in the Quran and showing the utmost reverence and respect for thr Holy Quran by accepting the truth.