Death penalty: Are you for or against it?

[Jainarayan]

Going by Catholicism. In my view, no one has the right to take a life. I dont see the logistics in doing so.

And that's fine as a personal belief. I don't disrespect it. But again, this is not a country governed by religious laws or by religious sentiment. The logic, and I don't know how I can make it any clearer, is that the punishment should fit the crime. And in the case of premeditated and cold-blooded murder... the death penalty.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

But he is not in control of the laws of the US. I mentioned David Berkowitz and Mark David Chapman before... I don't see what God has done to exact punishment from them, nor so I care to sit around on my duff waiting for a God who may or may not exist to do what our laws should do. Moreover we are in control of our own actions. The problem is that no one wants to take responsibility. Nice little Eagles song sums it up:

I turn on the tube and what do I see
A whole lotta people cryin' "Don't blame me"
They point their crooked little fingers at everybody else
Spend all their time feelin' sorry for themselves
Victim of this, victim of that
Your momma's too thin; your daddy's too fat
...

You say you haven't been the same since you had your little crash
But you might feel better if I gave you some cash
The more I think about it, Old Billy was right
Let's kill all the lawyers, kill 'em tonight
You don't want to work, you want to live like a king
But the big, bad world doesn't owe you a thing ... Get Over It

Writer(s): Don Henley, Keith C. Follese, Glenn Lewis Frey, Stephanie Kay Bentley
Copyright: Breaker Maker Music, Red Cloud Music, Universal Music - Careers, Black Cypress Music

I prefer (oh, and there's naughty words in it, for those who don't like that):

Lmao.

 

[Curious George]

Yes, society is growing increasingly castrated.

Death penalty to the patriarchy.

 

[Curious George]

What's so hard to understand? The death penalty is about justice, punishment and removing demons from this world who have proven to be a danger to others and who can't be rehabilitated.

Removing demons?

 

[Curious George]

Would you kill someone to keep them from killing you or a loved one?

Yes, well if a loved one was human.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Removing demons?

Do you have a better term for "people" like Richard Chase, Fred and Rose West, Ashley Nicole Richards and Brent Justice (if you don't know who the latter two are, Google it)?

 

[columbus]

[Punishment] ought not go to the extreme of executing the offender except in cases of absolute necessity: in other words, when it would not be possible otherwise to defend society. Today however, as a result of steady improvements in the organization of the penal system, such cases are very rare, if not practically non-existent. John Paul II, The Gospel of Life,


In his encyclical The Gospel of Life, Pope John Paul II told us that we have an inescapable responsibility of choosing to be unconditionally pro-life.18 This Catholic campaign brings us together for common action to end the use of the death penalty, to reject a culture of death, and to build a culture of life. It poses an old and fundamental choice: I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse. Choose life, then, that you and your descendants may live. (Dt 30:19)
—USCCB, A Culture of Life and the Penalty of Death

A pair of quickly found quotes from the United States Council of Catholic Bishops website.
Just for a Catholic opinion on the subject.
Tom

 

[Unveiled Artist]

What's so hard to understand? The death penalty is about justice, punishment and removing demons from this world who have proven to be a danger to others and who can't be rehabilitated.

We disagree. If I murdered someone, I would

1. Suffer the consequences of My actions not the gov.
2. Justice would be serve by letting me live out my jail sentence and make changes to my life.
3. As a human being (not a demon) I may have some trouble issues that may need to be addressed..maybe psychologically, religious means, with myself
4. I will be able to be rehabilitated. I am the only one who can change my life.

This is how I see criminals from this perspective.

It lets me see things in Their eyes not my own
It lets me take out my anger, bias, and the emotions pint up to prevent the criminal from changing his life
It lets me have compassion for people eve though I disagree with their behavior
If still practicing and could do it, I would be in prision ministry to help criminals not condemn them as demons.

I dont know. I just see more value in life than others. Its hard to really understand how one can see the logic, in say, killing for ones faith. Others find logic in aborting children. Excuses to kill.

Please read it in context.

I value life too much to be pro-killing for any reason, by anyone, guilty, not guilty, young, old, catholic, pagan, muslim, american, and so forth.

Thats just me. I think the world would be a peaceful place if Everyone (criminals too) both guilty ans innocent saw thr value and right to live.

Maybe bot guilty and innoncent will not think of killing. They both be helping each other.

Utopia.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

[Punishment] ought not go to the extreme of executing the offender except in cases of absolute necessity: in other words, when it would not be possible otherwise to defend society. Today however, as a result of steady improvements in the organization of the penal system, such cases are very rare, if not practically non-existent. John Paul II, The Gospel of Life,


In his encyclical The Gospel of Life, Pope John Paul II told us that we have an inescapable responsibility of choosing to be unconditionally pro-life.18 This Catholic campaign brings us together for common action to end the use of the death penalty, to reject a culture of death, and to build a culture of life. It poses an old and fundamental choice: I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse. Choose life, then, that you and your descendants may live. (Dt 30:19)
—USCCB, A Culture of Life and the Penalty of Death

A pair of quickly found quotes from the United States Council of Catholic Bishops website.
Just for a Catholic opinion on the subject.
Tom

You rest my case with Frank. Dont know what else to say.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

[Punishment] ought not go to the extreme of executing the offender except in cases of absolute necessity: in other words, when it would not be possible otherwise to defend society. Today however, as a result of steady improvements in the organization of the penal system, such cases are very rare, if not practically non-existent. John Paul II, The Gospel of Life,


In his encyclical The Gospel of Life, Pope John Paul II told us that we have an inescapable responsibility of choosing to be unconditionally pro-life.18 This Catholic campaign brings us together for common action to end the use of the death penalty, to reject a culture of death, and to build a culture of life. It poses an old and fundamental choice: I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse. Choose life, then, that you and your descendants may live. (Dt 30:19)
—USCCB, A Culture of Life and the Penalty of Death

A pair of quickly found quotes from the United States Council of Catholic Bishops website.
Just for a Catholic opinion on the subject.
Tom

You can spare me the hypocrisy since in another thread, you defend killing innocent people if it might end up killing the guilty. So just stop, or you're going back on ignore.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

You rest my case with Frank. Dont know what else to say.

You saying nothing would be just fine, since you don't understand much about the psychology of criminals in the first place.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

You saying nothing would be just fine, since you don't understand much about the psychology of criminals in the first place.

Does t matter. Life is life.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Does t matter. Life is life.

Have fun in la-la land. If you actually worked in a prison, you wouldn't be spouting such delusional silliness. You wouldn't last long with what naive attitude, anyway.

 

[Adramelek]

I am all for the death penalty in cases of murder and serial rape. But states shouldn't be spending so many tax dollars for all of these lethal injection drugs that lull the perpetrator to death. A 5.7mm bullet to the head costs only about 30 cents per bullet, and so what if they feel a few seconds of pain, their victims went through far worse.

 

[Curious George]

Do you have a better term for "people" like Richard Chase, Fred and Rose West, Ashley Nicole Richards and Brent Justice (if you don't know who the latter two are, Google it)?

Are they people who committed crimes?

While I'm a fan of whimsical writing, metaphor, and allusion, the use of such for political rhetoric strikes too close to propaganda. Are you by chance dehumanizing a list of people in order to justify apathy towards said people and in order to advocate harsh treatment?

We have already established that I am not against the death penalty for humans. Using the terms monster, or demon, or animal feels to much like disguising meat as something different from a dead animal.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Are they people who committed crimes?

Google is your friend.

While I'm a fan of whimsical writing, metaphor, and allusion, the use of such for political rhetoric strikes too close to propaganda. Are you by chance dehumanizing a list of people in order to justify apathy towards said people and in order to advocate harsh treatment?

We have already established that I am not against the death penalty for humans. Using the terms monster, or demon, or animal feels to much like disguising meat as something different from a dead animal.

I'd rather not be classified as a member of the same species as those types. They're not human, to me. If you don't like that, I really couldn't care less. As if they deserve sympathy.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

And that's fine as a personal belief. I don't disrespect it. But again, this is not a country governed by religious laws or by religious sentiment. The logic, and I don't know how I can make it any clearer, is that the punishment should fit the crime. And in the case of premeditated and cold-blooded murder... the death penalty.

Its a moral thing. I value life. Normaly, if we, say, steal someone's car the gov. doesnt take our car. We go to jail, pay a fine, whatever. If I kidnaped someone elses child, the gov.doesnt kidnap mine unless child protective services felt I was not set to take care of my child. If i had a wife and CPS new thr child would be safe, we wouldnt loose our child.

My point is the gov. doesnt have the right to take a life unless its protecting others, country, self. DP is not protecting others but preventing that person to implement change to his or her life. The gov. is literally acting as if they know the criminals mind, as if he wont change. Yet, many "innocent" people kill individuals with words and in some cases people rather be dead than be in an verbal abuse home or relationship.

I dont understand the morality of why "innocent" people wish anyone to die. Thats like wishing themselves to die if they murdered. I mean, would you want tondie if you murdered someone? Would you want to change? Do you believe you can be rehabilitated?

In my view, it doesnt matter what one studied...pyrensics whatever. If their studies come befor their faith, then I question that too.

In general, though. In my faith, there is no excuse for killing a soul.

 

[Jainarayan]

I prefer (oh, and there's naughty words in it, for those who don't like that):

Lmao.

Reminded me of the punker on the bus in Star Trek The Voyage Home.

 

[columbus]

You can spare me the hypocrisy since in another thread, you defend killing innocent people if it might end up killing the guilty. So just stop, or you're going back on ignore.

If you had read my post in that thread you'd have seen the moral dilemma. What do you do when the question is not "Will innocent civilians die?" "But can I prevent a greater number of deaths by sacrificing some?".
I don't see that as an easy question. That's part of the reason I am so hardcore pro life. I'd rather prevent the problems in the first place.
Tom

Hey if you want to ignore me go ahead. I'll be in good company, popes and the bishops council, etc...

 

[Curious George]

Google is your friend.


I'd rather not be classified as a member of the same species as those types. They're not human, to me. If you don't like that, I really couldn't care less. As if they deserve sympathy.

I don't believe I said sympathy, but if you can't kill an animal, you probably shouldn't hunt.


That you don't like being of the same species bears nothing on the truth of the matter.

But pretending we are "removing demons" to justify killing offers little rational to not kill whatever people deem is a demon.