Did Jesus really have to die for our sins?

[sojourner]

It really wasn't that much of a caricature when you think about it, it was pretty spot on other than the wording.

Yes it was. It had no spot to be on.

 

[1robin]

Yes it was. It had no spot to be on.

Your last two replies were brilliant. I addressed these as well but you got me beat.

 

[waitasec]

Did he?

yes.
vs 18 No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have authority to lay it down and authority to take it up again. This command I received from my Father.”

as th father commanded that he has the authority to do so.

Let's be a little more specific. God loves Jesus for his love for God's people.

lets get even more specific

vs 17 The reason my Father loves me is that I lay down my life —

he didn't.

so what was he doing on the cross?
more specifically why did he say in john 14

I am going there to prepare a place for you?

or what did he means in john 16:5,16

5 but now I am going to him who sent me...
16 Jesus went on to say, “In a little while you will see me no more, and then after a little while you will see me.”

It isn't contingent upon that.

i'll repeat
17 The reason my Father loves me is that I lay down my life —

Not necessarily.

john 14:6

Straw man.

if it makes you feel better.

So? None of this states explicitly that "Jesus has to die to atone for our sin."

so why say he's a good shepherd for laying his life down and the reason god loves him for willing to obey his command of laying down his life for the sheep?

 

[CMike]

Human sacrifice solves nothing.

Also he wasnt a sacrifice. He was captured and arrested.

He also was whinning about it.

 

[CMike]

God almighty disagrees. Who backs up your claim.

You talk for G-d?

 

[CMike]

Do you think He died for no cause at all?

Narcissism.

 

[1robin]

You talk for G-d?

Didn't need to. He happened to give us a book that contains over 300,000 of his words.

 

[waitasec]

Didn't need to. He happened to give us a book that contains over 300,000 of his words.

how can you confirm that it's the word of god?

look, this is what i take issue with. your interpretation is your interpretation. your interpretation doesn't apply or override someone else's interpretation
because ultimately your interpretation is subjected to faith not evidence.

does that make sense?

so instead of saying:

God almighty disagrees. Who backs up your claim.

it would be a better discourse, imo, to 1st back up your claim that it is the word of god in an objective manner that is understood as empirical evidence.

if you cannot support the claim with empirical evidence then why not just say, 'imo, god almighty disagrees...'

how can anyone argue with that sentiment?

 

[waitasec]

It lacks sound theological development, based upon a proper exegetical treatment of the texts.

in other words, it's one opinion vs another opinion.

 

[sojourner]

in other words, it's one opinion vs another opinion.

In other words, your post is completely provocative.

 

[waitasec]

In other words, your post is completely provocative.

well i only hope it doesn't provoke one to...

 

[CMike]

Didn't need to. He happened to give us a book that contains over 300,000 of his words.

No where is that in my book.

 

[Me Myself]

God almighty disagrees. Who backs up your claim.

Myself.

I seem to be way better than him for the little you have talked to me about this guy "God all Mighty". Does he has a facebook account or does he only talk through really old texts that incite genocide and regulate good ways to make your daugther a slave?

 

[Thief]

Narcissism.

False accusation.

 

[helpmeplease]

Really? Maybe you can tell me what the "result" of Jesus' "sacrifice" was?

No takers?

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Result of Jesus sacrifice is: to give his life as a 'ransom' for many.- Matthew 20 v 28

A ransom is an exchange for something or someone.

Since we were all born after Adam disobeyed God we all inherited Adam's imperfect nature. None of us can stop sinning. If we could stop sinning we would not die.
[ Death is the wages or price that we pay for our sins - Romans 6 vs 23,7]
But, we can not resurrect oneself or another so we need someone to resurrect us.
So the result of Jesus faithful ransom sacrifice is that Jesus was given the keys to unlock death for us. - Revelation 1 v 18; 1st Corinthians 15 v 26
Jesus can and he will. Some resurrected to heaven [Rev. 20v6] as part of a first or earlier resurrection, and the majority of mankind to be resurrected back to life on earth during Jesus 1000-year reign over a paradisaic earth.
- Acts 24 v 15; John 3 v 13

 

[Heathen Hammer]

Sin existed before Jesus gave his life.
People were dieing before Jesus gave his life.
God was angry at sinners before Jesus gave his life.
People went to Hell before Jesus gave his life.

What changed?
Nothing.
It would appear some kind of promise unfulfilled.

How can it be verified that anything changed, because of it?

 

[helpmeplease]

Result of Jesus sacrifice is: to give his life as a 'ransom' for many.- Matthew 20 v 28

A ransom is an exchange for something or someone.

Since we were all born after Adam disobeyed God we all inherited Adam's imperfect nature. None of us can stop sinning. If we could stop sinning we would not die.
[ Death is the wages or price that we pay for our sins - Romans 6 vs 23,7]
But, we can not resurrect oneself or another so we need someone to resurrect us.
So the result of Jesus faithful ransom sacrifice is that Jesus was given the keys to unlock death for us. - Revelation 1 v 18; 1st Corinthians 15 v 26
Jesus can and he will. Some resurrected to heaven [Rev. 20v6] as part of a first or earlier resurrection, and the majority of mankind to be resurrected back to life on earth during Jesus 1000-year reign over a paradisaic earth.
- Acts 24 v 15; John 3 v 13

From whom did he receive the magic key? And to whom was the ransom paid?

 

[1robin]

No where is that in my book.

What book did you write?

 

[sojourner]

No takers?

See post #1738