Do you trust God?

[Trailblazer]

Is it me? An unevidenced claim, followed by 4 claims that directly contradict it.

Trailblazer said: Ordinary humans do not have the capacity to understand God.

1. God communicates to a Messenger
2. God cannot do what is not within His nature to do.
3. God has no hands so God cannot write.
4. God could communicate to humans in another fashion

Is it me?
I see no contradictions.

 

[Truthseeker]

Man, the more I look into the Bahai religion, the more it confuses me.

We behold it, in this day, at the mercy of rulers so drunk with pride that they cannot discern clearly their own best advantage, much less recognize a Revelation so bewildering and challenging as this.
(Gleanings from the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh)
www.bahai.org/r/225195015

 

[Trailblazer]

You seem to have answered without actually answering, again. The question was "how would anyone know" not is it possible to know, which you have already presupposed without offering any objective evidence.

They would know it is God who is writing through Messenger after they determined that the Messenger was speaking for God, having conducted an independent investigation of the Messenger and His claims.

 

[Truthseeker]

I have no qualms with there being a God who can't write, but then I would not consider this as being omnipotent.

Being omnipotent means being able to do whatever He wants to. He doesn't want to write.

 

[Truthseeker]

For me specifically as a follower of Meher Baba, it was his two car accidents: one in the US and one in India. What was his reaction to being badly injured and spending the rest of his life in pain?

You are a believer in Meher Baba? My brother Phil used to believe in him before he became a Baha'i!

 

[Trailblazer]

A silly question, as far as atheists go. I do not even believe in the possibility of existence of any God. That also negates the truthfulness of any self-proclaimed or so-believed prophet / son / messenger / manifestation / Mahdi.

Well, the question was for believers, not for atheists, but atheists don't seem to be able to resist my threads.

 

[Truthseeker]

I already have a pretty good idea what you believe about the God of the Bible since you told me before although I have not seen what you have said on other threads. If all I had was the Bible, and I believed that God as depicted in the Bible, esp. the Old Testament, I would not even believe in God, let alone love Him. But my issues with loving God have nothing to do with the Bible, they are related to so much suffering that I see in this world.

I am not really at the point where I worship God, but I do trust God. However, the Baha'i Faith says work is worship, and if that is true I am worshiping God all the time.

A good answer.

 

[Truthseeker]

This begs the question, "How would anyone know it is God who is writing through Messengers?

(edit) **Now God recording and storing a message for us in our genetic code would be pretty compelling evidence this message came from a Supreme Being with a higher intelligence than ancient nomadic tribal scribes.**

You investigate to see if he is a Messenger or not.

 

[Suave]

You investigate to see if he is a Messenger or not.

What objective criterion is used to determine if somebody is truly a Messenger?

 

[Trailblazer]

Being omnipotent means being able to do whatever He wants to. He doesn't want to write.

That's right Duane.

“Say: He ordaineth as He pleaseth, by virtue of His sovereignty, and doeth whatsoever He willeth at His own behest. He shall not be asked of the things it pleaseth Him to ordain. He, in truth, is the Unrestrained, the All-Powerful, the All-Wise.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p, 284

“Say: O people! Let not this life and its deceits deceive you, for the world and all that is therein is held firmly in the grasp of His Will. He bestoweth His favor on whom He willeth, and from whom He willeth He taketh it away. He doth whatsoever He chooseth.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 209

 

[Trailblazer]

What objective criterion is used to determine if somebody is truly a Messenger?

The objective evidence.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

That God is misunderstood by Christians. It is the same God as in the Baha'i Faith, where hell is simply distance from God, in my opinion.

As a former Christian (who wasted thirty-one years of her life trying to reconcile her weak belief in a loving, merciful God with her own immeasurable pain and suffering), I'm not sure anymore if the God of the bible exists or not. If God does, in fact, exist, then I'd consider him to be nothing more than a sadistic bloodthirsty tyrant, who gets a kick out of causing total calamity throughout the world, and then sits back and watches as his creation tear itself apart from the inside out, while he does absolutely nothing to stop the immeasurable suffering of mankind. I can hear, "tell us how you really feel, and don't hold back!" Lol. You know, I could really vent, but it would be a daunting task of more writing on my part, and it would result in a much longer post. I won't go there since I don't want to derail the thread, and I think I've said enough to reveal what my true feelings are, and where I stand on this subject.

 

[Kenny]

Do you trust God?

Loving God is different than trusting God. I cannot honestly say I love God but I trust God. I not only know for certain that God exists, I know that God has my best interests in mind and is guiding me through life.

I have gone through hell to finally come to this realization. Hell in the Baha’i Faith is not a place we go when we die. It is distance from God, and we can be in hell in this life as well as in the next life.

I am sure I will have more tests but I hope I do not have to go back to hell again.

55. O Son of Being!
Busy not thyself with this world, for with fire We test the gold, and with gold We test Our servants.
The Hidden Words of Baha'u'llah

“… the Almighty hath tried, and will continue to try, His servants, so that light may be distinguished from darkness, truth from falsehood, right from wrong, guidance from error, happiness from misery, and roses from thorns. Even as He hath revealed: “Do men think when they say ‘We believe’ they shall be let alone and not be put to proof?” 5 “
Bahá’u’lláh, The Kitáb-i-Íqán, pp. 8-9

Is God loving? I do not ‘believe’ that God is loving given all the suffering in this world but I think I am probably wrong and God is loving in spite of all the suffering. Personally, I do not really care if God is loving, as it matters more to me that I can trust God. If there was no God I would have no hope, but I trust that whatever happens is God’s Will and I try to accept it day by day. That is all I can do.

I live only in the present day. I have no plans for the future. If I think about the future I have so much anxiety I want to die since so many things in my life are hanging out in mid-air and I cannot even imagine how they will ever get resolved. The only hope I have is trusting that God will be there to help me when I need Him.

I have had to trust Him. I realize that His love for us is so immense that He is interested in every aspect of my life.

The better question IMV is "Will humanity let God help them and love them"

In my case, it is a Christian viewpoint.

 

[Truthseeker]

What objective criterion is used to determine if somebody is truly a Messenger?

There are objective facts that show that in some cases, but there is always a subjective component to this.

 

[Truthseeker]

As a former Christian (who wasted thirty-one years of her life trying to reconcile her weak belief in a loving, merciful God with her own immeasurable pain and suffering), I'm not sure anymore if the God of the bible exists or not. If God does, in fact, exist, then I'd consider him to be nothing more than a sadistic bloodthirsty tyrant, who gets a kick out of causing total calamity throughout the world, and then sits back and watches as his creation tear itself apart from the inside out, while he does absolutely nothing to stop the immeasurable suffering of mankind. I can hear, "tell us how you really feel, and don't hold back!" Lol. You know, I could really vent, but it would be a daunting task of more writing on my part, and it would result in a much longer post. I won't go there since I don't want to derail the thread, and I think I've said enough to reveal what my true feelings are, and where I stand on this subject.

Sorry about all your suffering.

 

[Suave]

The objective evidence.

Such as??

 

[Trailblazer]

You know, I could really vent, but it would be a daunting task of more writing on my part, and it would result in a much longer post.

I hear you because I have been where you are at, albeit for different reasons. @Truthseeker knows all about that because he is my best friend.

Don't worry about my thread, it has already been derailed. This is not what I expected, but it's okay.

 

[Trailblazer]

Such as??

Some time ago when asked for evidence I posted the claims of Baha’u’llah and the evidence that supports the claims of Baha’u’llah on this thread:

Questions for knowledgeable Bahai / followers of Baha'u'llah

 

[Sheldon]

My beliefs are not only logical, they are rational.

They mean the same thing.

If your beliefs were rational, then you would not violate a basic principle of logic in almost every post defending them.

 

[Brickjectivity]

Since I consider God as being the controller of simulations, a virtual reality programmer of human consciousness, I'm guessing there is no other choice for me than to trust in God. Also, it's according to our dollar's motto, "In God we Trust".

Not me. If we are simulations then we should rebel hard and often.