Eternal grovelling or nonexistence?

[CarlinKnew]

You are not paying attention to the thread then. God offer is Heaven for believers, Hell for non-believers. Carlinknew is refusing the offer to believe. You are refusing the offer to believe. So how is it a offer than cannot be refused? You logic is not very logical.

Good glad to hear you admit to your fears. Yet you still choose to be an adamant atheist. I can respect that. Just more proof of free will.

I already addressed this. I'm not refusing any offer, because the Bible is a work of fiction. I am criticizing the God of the Bible just as I would criticize any character in any work of fiction.

 

[Enoch07]

I already addressed this. I'm not refusing any offer, because the Bible is a work of fiction. I am criticizing the God of the Bible just as I would criticize any character in any work of fiction.

You refuse to believe God is real. You think the Bible is fiction. You are refusing your offer to believe. Don't start backpedaling now. You have confirmed these statements many times throughout this thread. Denial will get you nowhere.

 

[CarlinKnew]

You refuse to believe God is real. You think the Bible is fiction. You are refusing your offer to believe. Don't start backpedaling now. You have confirmed these statements many times throughout this thread. Denial will get you nowhere.

Hahaha wow. OK, I refuse the "offer" to believe that the character of God is real in the same sense that I refuse the "offer" to believe that the characters of the Three Little Pigs are real.

 

[Tristesse]

You refuse to believe God is real. You think the Bible is fiction. You are refusing your offer to believe. Don't start backpedaling now. You have confirmed these statements many times throughout this thread. Denial will get you nowhere.

Well, by the same token your refusing to believe that the qur'an is real. Thats the exact same comparison.

 

[Enoch07]

It's not a threat to me because I don't take the Bible seriously, it's a work of fiction. I'm speaking hypothetically. The God of the Bible demands worship at the threat of eternal punishment. If I did take the Bible seriously then it certainly would be a threat to me.

Hahaha wow. OK, I refuse the "offer" to believe that the character of God is real in the same sense that I refuse the "offer" to believe that the characters of the Three Little Pigs are real.

Ah but I love the Harry Potter books. I think they are great. But I know them to be fiction. Yet I am not going around having to tell everyone that they are fiction now am I? And there is no one claiming that they are non-fiction. I accept that it is fiction and I go on about my life.

There is only a couple billion people who believe the Bible is not fiction compared to a minority (you) who do. So yeah its pretty obvious the Bible is more than fiction where you are concerned otherwise you would not be here, trying to refute the work of a "fictional book and fictional characters". If you are always going to take the infamous atheist cop out of " i don't believe" then your opinions mean nothing to begin with. Why bother arguing in something you do not believe in? Its an exercise in futility.

 

[CarlinKnew]

Ah but I love the Harry Potter books. I think they are great. But I know them to be fiction. Yet I am not going around having to tell everyone that they are fiction now am I? And there is no one claiming that they are non-fiction. I accept that it is fiction and I go on about my life.

There is only a couple billion people who believe the Bible is not fiction compared to a minority (you) who do. So yeah its pretty obvious the Bible is more than fiction where you are concerned otherwise you would not be here, trying to refute the work of a "fictional book and fictional characters". If you are always going to take the infamous atheist cop out of " i don't believe" then your opinions mean nothing to begin with. Why bother arguing in something you do not believe in? Its an exercise in futility.

You're right about one thing: no one claims that the Harry Potter books are the word of God; if they did, I'd be arguing with them too. Unfortunately, certain books that are in some ways similar to the Harry Potter books have been deemed holy, and they're causing some problems in the world.

 

[Enoch07]

You're right about one thing: no one claims that the Harry Potter books are the word of God; if they did, I'd be arguing with them too. Unfortunately, certain books that are in some ways similar to the Harry Potter books have been deemed holy, and they're causing some problems in the world.

The only problems caused in the world is from evil people.

 

[CarlinKnew]

The only problems caused in the world is from evil people.

Steven Weinberg put it perfectly: "Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion."

 

[Enoch07]

Steven Weinberg put it perfectly: "Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion."

Explain how good people can do evil things? That is a catch 22. If you are good you do good things. If you are evil you do evil things. The statement is contradictory at best.

 

[idea]

This is mainly for the Abrahamic religions. Some believers say hell isn't eternal torture but simply nonexistence. Would you prefer to spend eternity worshipping God or to cease to exist?

Who says the point is worshipping God? I don't think God wants us as slaves... You do not seem to understand what heaven is all about...

 

[CarlinKnew]

Explain how good people can do evil things? That is a catch 22. If you are good you do good things. If you are evil you do evil things. The statement is contradictory at best.

If someone tells you they'll kill your entire family if you don't do x, odds are you'll do x. Religion can have a similar effect. "Suicide bomb that building or God will be very upset with you."

 

[CarlinKnew]

Who says the point is worshipping God? I don't think God wants us as slaves... You do not seem to understand what heaven is all about...

He's the LORD and demands to be worshipped and obeyed. Does he want slaves?... well, you said it, not me

 

[idea]

If someone tells you they'll kill your entire family if you don't do x, odds are you'll do x. Religion can have a similar effect. "Suicide bomb that building or God will be very upset with you."

at the precipice, we change...

"I am not what I want to be, but I amnot what I used to be.. by the grace of God, I am what I am"...

I know who I used to be. Personally, any fire it takes to refine me - so be it. A horror to be left an unformed lump of clay don't you think?

 

[Enoch07]

If someone tells you they'll kill your entire family if you don't do x, odds are you'll do x. Religion can have a similar effect. "Suicide bomb that building or God will be very upset with you."

If you kill an entire family you are an evil person. using religion as an excuse to blame it on is denying what the real problem is. You would be able to tell the difference between a true follower of Islam and a terrorist if you ever got to meet both.

 

[idea]

He's the LORD and demands to be worshipped and obeyed. Does he want slaves?... well, you said it, not me

He is all powerful, there is nothing that He does not already have, and therefore nothing that we can give Him. It is for no self-serving purpose that He gives us attention. We can give Him nothing, slaves would be no use to Him.

He wants something different.

Man, Potential to Become like Heavenly Father (see also Father; Immortality; Perfection)
Gen. 1:26 (Moses 2:26) let them have dominion
Gen. 3:22 (Moses 4:28) man is become as one of us
Lev. 19:2 (1 Pet. 1:16) be holy: for I ... am holy
Ps. 8:5 thou hast made him a little lower than the angels
Ps. 8:6 madest him to have dominion over the works of thy hands
Ps. 82:6 ye are gods, and all of you are children of the most High
Matt. 5:48 (3 Ne. 12:48) Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father
Luke 24:39 spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have
John 10:34 (Ps. 82:1–8; D&C 76:58) Is it not written in your law ... Ye are gods
Acts 17:29 we are the offspring of God
Rom. 8:17 heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ
2 Cor. 3:18 changed into the same image from glory to glory
Gal. 4:7 if a son, then an heir of God through Christ
Eph. 4:13 Till we all come ... unto a perfect man
Heb. 12:9 be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live
1 Jn. 3:2 when he shall appear, we shall be like him
Rev. 3:21 him that overcometh will ... sit with me in my throne
2 Ne. 2:25 men are, that they might have joy
3 Ne. 9:17 to them have I given to become the sons of God
3 Ne. 27:27 what manner of men ought ye to be ... even as I am
3 Ne. 28:10 your joy shall be full ... shall be even as I am
D&C 14:7 you shall have eternal life
D&C 88:29 Ye who are quickened by ... celestial glory
D&C 88:107 saints shall ... be made equal with him
D&C 93:20 you shall receive of his fulness, and be glorified
D&C 93:29 Man was also in the beginning with God
D&C 121:32 every man shall enter into his eternal presence
D&C 129:3 spirits of just men made perfect
D&C 130:1 he is a man like ourselves
D&C 130:22 Father has a body of flesh and bones
D&C 131:2 (131:1–4) in order to obtain the highest, a man must enter into this order
D&C 132:20 (132:1–24) shall they be gods, because they have all power
D&C 133:57 that men might be made partakers of the glories
Moses 1:39 to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man
JS-H 1:17 I saw two Personages, whose brightness and glory defy
See also 2 Tim. 2:10–12; 1 Ne. 11:11; D&C 50:24.
(Topical Guide | M Man, Potential to Become like Heavenly Father:Entry)

 

[CarlinKnew]

If you kill an entire family you are an evil person. using religion as an excuse to blame it on is denying what the real problem is. You would be able to tell the difference between a true follower of Islam and a terrorist if you ever got to meet both.

You missed the point. Often suicide bombers are good kids that have been convinced by religion that they're doing something great for God.

 

[OmarKhayyam]

"You missed the point. Often suicide bombers are good kids that have been convinced by religion that they're doing something great for God."

No, he didn't miss it. He refuses to see it.

 

[Valkyr1a]

You missed the point. Often suicide bombers are good kids that have been convinced by religion that they're doing something great for God.

Suicide bombers die for a cause. Right or Wrong. They don't die for religion, they don't die to find virgins in heaven. Wake the **** up and stop listening to the ******** Americans say.

 

[idea]

You missed the point. Often suicide bombers are good kids that have been convinced by religion that they're doing something great for God.

Not all religious groups are good.

 

[CarlinKnew]

Suicide bombers die for a cause. Right or Wrong. They don't die for religion, they don't die to find virgins in heaven. Wake the **** up and stop listening to the ******** Americans say.

They may die for a political cause, but they are often convinced by religious means.