Evidence that Ivrim, Benei Yisrael, Yehudim, and Modern day Jews do not descend from Yadavas farmers

[Bharat Jhunjhunwala]

The most important and agriculturally relevant description of miccai would be to sorghum, domesticated in Egypt 5000 years ago. The plant then "travelled", or better understood to be imported, to the Indian subcontinent 1000 years later.

What is interesting about sorghum is, the husks of the plant were bound very tightly, and had to removed forcefully to get to the useful grain inside.

I think we are going very far in identifying Mitsrayim with Sorghum. I request you to reconsider why Mitsrayim is not definitely from the Indus Valley. The problems of geography of Exodus cannot be resolved in an Exodus from Egypt. They get resolved in the exodus from the Indus Valley. Hence, the case for Indus Valley is not based on the name Mitsrayim but on the geographical descriptions of the Exodus. That said Mitsrayim may be Indian Mathura where we have the common consonants m, t and r but I am wary of linguistic associations because they can be very loose.

 

[GoodAttention]

I think we are going very far in identifying Mitsrayim with Sorghum. I request you to reconsider why Mitsrayim is not definitely from the Indus Valley. The problems of geography of Exodus cannot be resolved in an Exodus from Egypt. They get resolved in the exodus from the Indus Valley. Hence, the case for Indus Valley is not based on the name Mitsrayim but on the geographical descriptions of the Exodus. That said Mitsrayim may be Indian Mathura where we have the common consonants m, t and r but I am wary of linguistic associations because they can be very loose.

I have no interest in your Aryan centered pseudo-analysis.

 

[River Sea]

@GoodAttention @Bharat Jhunjhunwala

Two words

Hodu means giving thanks
Havilah means circle

Two videos
First video Hodu (giving thanks) - re-sharing
Second video Havilah (circle)

@GoodAttention

Hodu means give thanks
He's giving thanks to God (Hashem) as he's playing banjo and later singing: that's what the video means.

New Hodu Lashem niggun on clawhammer banjo

my understanding of any mention to India in thee Hebrew scriptures is "Havilah".

Havilah means "circle,"

Hebrew scriptures is circle (Havilah)

Havilah Children singing--Bless The Lord Oh My Soul

So two words

Hodu means giving thanks
Havilah means circle

 

[River Sea]

I have little knowledge about the genes. I am studying point of view of every poster. The names of the places and persons has similarity, one must say.
Our friends have not traced the name of Pharaoh in India, will anybody reflect on it, please, right?

Regards

@paarsurrey

I'm asking @Bharat Jhunjhunwala

Do I have the wrong mud volcano? I was thinking mud volcano in fars Iran that's south-west and causing river to rise north-east in Indus Valley. Or do I have the wrong mud volcano? Yet I ask, how does water rise when river is dry due to drought? How does Mud volcano make water?

I asked @Bharat Jhunjhunwala
Who were the pharaohs in India as mentioned about the Army from the Pharaoh who drowned in the river after the mud volcano erupted from Fars Iran?

Also, I questioned this due to I thought there was a drought.

@Bharat Jhunjhunwala
Will you please help me understand how people drown in a rising river when there's a drought and how this happens from a mud volcano in fars Iran?

I understand I'm using modern names for locations

From @Bharat Jhunjhunwala book Common Prophets

Page 304 PDF Common Prophets

Crossing the Indus River on Dry Land
The flow of the Indus River could be blocked by eruption of a
mud volcano upstream. The Hebrews crossed the riverbed on
dry land, then the mud got eroded, the waters of the Indus River
came back and drowned Pharaoh and his army who were
following in pursuit.

My question is, this was during the Krishna era, so who were the kings or kings during the Krishna era? Pharoah means King?

Who were the people who drowned who chased the Yadavas?

Krishna had a long battle with Jarasandh, similar to Moses having a long battle with Pharaoh.

Krishna's cousin Arjuna killed Jarasandha, so that means Jarasandha didn't drown then. So who's the Pharaoh and his army who drowned?

I understand Krishna is from King Yadu line. Kamsa is similarities to Pharaoh in Moses Krishna era

Could it be Kamsa? Was Kamsa the Pharaoh and so it's Kamsa and his army who drowned?

The Greeks referred to the Jews as Judeos, or Jah deos or Yadavas, meaning people of Ya or descendants of Yadu, one of the sons of Yayati.
According to Vedic traditions and also as mentioned in Puranas there was a great flood around 10000 years ago where only Manu (Noah) and his family survived on the boat as mentioned in the Shatapatha Brahmana (1.8.1).
His important descendants are the Pauravas, Ayu, Nahusha, and Yayati. From Yayati came the five Vedic clans; the Purus, Anus, Druhyus, Turvashas, and Yadus (these clans later spread around the world). Thus the Yadavas or Jah deos or Judeos are an extension of the same Vedic culture or Indo-aryan culture or race. Rishi (Saint ) Kapila might have imparted the wisdom in the form of Kabbalah to the Yadavas before they were called Judeos by the Greeks.

@Bharat Jhunjhunwala
Who do you think is the Pharaoh in Indus Valley and his army drowned in that river that's further northeast from the mud volcano in fars Iran that erupted that's further south-west, causing a river to rise yet there's a drought? How does a river raise water when a river is dry? There's no water, and how does mud cause water? The river was dry due to drought. Mud does not create water? Or does it? What is a mud volcano? What causes mud to erupt? Is there water under the ground, more similar to cisterns and wells, and causes water to flow north-east, yet how can water drown an army? Didn't these people know how to swim?

 

[River Sea]

However I will again go back to the Tamil language for your interest. Mitzrayim we understand to be associated with Egypt. Looking at the first part of the word, I see miccai, when written in Tamil is the following. Note the "c" is a soft c, like in cheese, and not hard, like in cat.

That said Mitsrayim may be Indian Mathura where we have the common consonants m, t and r

@GoodAttention
Where did @Bharat Jhunjhunwala write the word Aryan?

@GoodAttention
please explain where this word Aryan is mentioned?

@Bharat Jhunjhunwala claims Mitsrayim located in (India) Indus Valley from letters m,t,r. (Mathura)
@GoodAttention claims Mitsrayim located in (Egypt) KMT from letter soft c (miccai)

@GoodAttention Where is the word Aryan? Show me?

 

[paarsurrey]

Friend @River Sea
You sent me a preface of a book 21/450 four river
Preface, Structure and Purpose , by friend @Bharat Jhunjhunwala, kindly sent me the link of the book, if possible, please, right?

Regards

 

[River Sea]

Friend @River Sea
You sent me a preface of a book 21/450 four river
Preface, Structure and Purpose , by friend @Bharat Jhunjhunwala, kindly sent me the link of the book, if possible, please, right?

Regards

@paarsurrey

Website and can find book at website

Common Prophets of the Jews, Christians & Muslims and Hindus

www.commonprophets.com

@Bharat Jhunjhunwala

 

[GoodAttention]

@GoodAttention
Where did @Bharat Jhunjhunwala write the word Aryan?

@GoodAttention
please explain where this word Aryan is mentioned?

@Bharat Jhunjhunwala claims Mitsrayim located in (India) Indus Valley from letters m,t,r. (Mathura)
@GoodAttention claims Mitsrayim located in (Egypt) KMT from letter soft c (miccai)

@GoodAttention Where is the word Aryan? Show me?

This person's entire premise and belief system regarding the Indus Valley is Aryan supremacy.

Aryan is synonymous with Sanskrit, so they are looking to impose where-ever they can their "all roads lead to Sanskrit/Aryan origin" nonsense. It is unfounded, and all archaeological evidence points to the opposite. They fear the Indus Valley Civilization spoke a proto-Dravidian language, and so they look to manipulate history and religion where they can.

Do not be fooled, in any other context, these people are modern day Nazis posing as "scholars".

 

[paarsurrey]

Evidence that Ivrim, Benei Yisrael, Yehudim, and Modern day Jews do not descend from Yadavas farmers

@Bharat Jhunjhunwala
Who do you think is the Pharaoh in Indus Valley and his army drowned in that river that's further northeast from the mud volcano in fars Iran that erupted that's further south-west, causing a river to rise yet there's a drought? How does a river raise water when a river is dry? There's no water, and how does mud cause water? The river was dry due to drought. Mud does not create water? Or does it? What is a mud volcano? What causes mud to erupt? Is there water under the ground, more similar to cisterns and wells, and causes water to flow north-east, yet how can water drown an army? Didn't these people know how to swim?

Now answer to every question put to friend @Bharat Jhunjhunwala might not be readymade, so let us not be in a hurry and give him some time to prepare for the answer, so, we must wait, please, right?

Regards

 

[Bharat Jhunjhunwala]

@paarsurrey @River Sea

Evidence that Ivrim, Benei Yisrael, Yehudim, and Modern day Jews do not descend from Yadavas farmers

Now answer to every question put to friend @Bharat Jhunjhunwala might not be readymade, so let us not be in a hurry and give him some time to prepare for the answer, so, we must wait, please, right?

Regards

1. The pharaoh in the Indus Valley would be the kings of Mohenjo Daro. The one person named in the Hindu text is Jayadratha but there is very little evidence of the mud volcano erupting because the Hindu texts mentioned only about Krishna having gone in an unknown direction and it does not give more details about what happened after he went in the unknown direction.



2. When the mud volcano erupted, it stopped the flowing of water and the Hebrews could walk on the bed whether it was dry, it was not dry due to drought. It was simply dry because of the absence of water. Maybe it was muddy and a slush but it would still be easier to cross that than to cross a river full of water.



3. I do not know what causes a mud volcano to erupt. My suspicion is that just some changes deep in the earth caused a lava volcano to erupt. Similarly, the mud volcanoes could erupt but I am not a geologist and I have not studied this phenomena but I can assure you that mud volcanoes do erupt in in this region.

 

[River Sea]

Evidence that Ivrim, Benei Yisrael, Yehudim, and Modern day Jews do not descend from Yadavas farmers

Now answer to every question put to friend @Bharat Jhunjhunwala might not be readymade, so let us not be in a hurry and give him some time to prepare for the answer, so, we must wait, please, right?

Regards

@paarsurrey I need to re-look at locations of mud volcanoes.

The Hingol Mud Volcano in Pakistan caused the rising of the Indus River further north, causing Pharaoh and his army to drown

@Bharat Jhunjhunwala If a river further north east was dry due to drought, how does water rise in the river due to mud from a mud volcano further south west that erupted?

Do I have the wrong mud volcano? I was thinking mud volcano in fars Iran that's south-west and causing river to rise north-east in Indus Valley. Or do I have the wrong mud volcano? Yet I ask, how does water rise when river is dry due to drought? How does Mud volcano make water?

I asked @Bharat Jhunjhunwala
Who were the pharaohs in India as mentioned about the Army from the Pharaoh who drowned in the river after the mud volcano erupted from Fars Iran?

@paarsurrey I was wrong it's located in Pakastin

How come I was thinking fars Iran for?

Are there any mud volcanos' in Fars Iran?

The Hingol Mud Volcano in Pakistan caused the rising of the Indus River further north, causing Pharaoh and his army to drown

@paarsurrey @Bharat Jhunjhunwala I personally get my navigation all mixed up

@paarsurrey @River Sea

1. The pharaoh in the Indus Valley would be the kings of Mohenjo Daro. The one person named in the Hindu text is Jayadratha but there is very little evidence of the mud volcano erupting because the Hindu texts mentioned only about Krishna having gone in an unknown direction and it does not give more details about what happened after he went in the unknown direction.



2. When the mud volcano erupted, it stopped the flowing of water and the Hebrews could walk on the bed whether it was dry, it was not dry due to drought. It was simply dry because of the absence of water. Maybe it was muddy and a slush but it would still be easier to cross that than to cross a river full of water.



3. I do not know what causes a mud volcano to erupt. My suspicion is that just some changes deep in the earth caused a lava volcano to erupt. Similarly, the mud volcanoes could erupt but I am not a geologist and I have not studied this phenomena but I can assure you that mud volcanoes do erupt in in this region.

I do get Pakistan and Iran mixed up in my mind for some reason.

I will re-look up fars Iran which seems in the location of Pakistan in my mind

I'll to that later

Hingol mud volcanoes - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

How far is Fars Iran compare to this Hingol Mud volcano in Pakistan?

I'll look that up

Wow am I far off take a look

I wrote red X where the mud volcano is and look at where Fars Iran is

 

[River Sea]

@paarsurrey

The pharaoh in the Indus Valley would be the kings of Mohenjo Daro

Mud volcano in Pakistan not in Fars Iran

please look at message above

I'm getting Iran and Pakistan mixed up (my fault with all of this)

 

[River Sea]

@paarsurrey

I'm going to display it here this mess, to help me organize this in my mind

For some reason I'm mixing up Pakistan and Iran

I understand this is modern names - however using modern names to help with navigation

@Bharat Jhunjhunwala explained that the Mud Volcano is located in Pakistan and this mud volcano is called Hingol Mud volcano in Pakistan.

@paarsurrey I think around 1947 AD Pakistan taken land from India: not sure how much land. So @Bharat Jhunjhunwala was Hingol mud volcano of India at some time?

The Yamuna River moved eastward due to tectonic uplift, and what did all the people do when living in Harappan cities, depriving them of water?

What all areas are the Harappan area, this wasn't extremely west of India that Krishna travelled? Not all of India was the Harappan area, and what does Harappan word mean I'll ask both to @GoodAttention and @Bharat Jhunjhunwala

Keep in mind Fars Iran is extremely far from the Hingol Mud volcano in Pakistan

I think why I was mixing this area: I was mentally thinking the travelling that could had taken place with other tribes: either later trading or whatever reasoning travelling from Fars Iran to India and also from India to Fars Iran and perhaps found challenges due to the Hingol Mud volcano

Still I'm surprised at the Yadavas needing to go a longer route way further north-east before going west, due to treaties that I was asking @Bharat Jhunjhunwala about.

 

[River Sea]

@GoodAttention meet @Aupmanyav

@Aupmanyav comprehension is about AIT which means that the Aryans invaded India (not sure when) perhaps @Aupmanyav can explain when?

Is it this:
What is the AIT Aryan Invasion Theory?

About AIT. It was German linguist Max Muller who in the 19th century proposed that 3,000-4,000 years ago an Indo-European (the Aryans) tribe invaded the subcontinent and brought along with it Indo-Aryan religion (Hinduism) , its culture and the caste system.

Sanskrit eastward while German westward, yet where's the brits in this situation, I'm confused? Where are the romans as well?

@Aupmanyav what do you like about this, and how much as the Aryans influenced you?

Who are the Aryans and how much has this taken away from the southern India from their language the Tamil language., yet you @GoodAttention used a circle word for scriptures, you favored the word 'Havilah' and that's Hebrew, what would this be in the Tamil language meaning circle?

my understanding of any mention to India in thee Hebrew scriptures is "Havilah"

@GoodAttention
what is this about Ayran is synonymous with Sanskrit and you claim nonsense, please explain this nonsense more in detail because what is nonsense, but a dismissive word that allows then the Sanskrit that branched eastward from India more say, as they will grab all the details that is dismissed. Because they had and how? What all happened to the people who speaks the Tamil language do the Meema community speak the Tamil language still? How come you favor Hebrew word circle for, what is the Tamil word for circle?

Aryan is synonymous with Sanskrit, so they are looking to impose where-ever they can their "all roads lead to Sanskrit/Aryan origin" nonsense. It is unfounded, and all archaeological evidence points to the opposite. They fear the Indus Valley Civilization spoke a proto-Dravidian language, and so they look to manipulate history and religion where they can.

Do not be fooled, in any other context, these people are modern day Nazis posing as "scholars".

What is Nazis, what is proto-Dravidian language, how has this affected the education system? Please teach me what all happened?

However I will again go back to the Tamil language for your interest. Mitzrayim we understand to be associated with Egypt. Looking at the first part of the word, I see miccai, when written in Tamil is the following. Note the "c" is a soft c, like in cheese, and not hard, like in cat.

மிச்சை​

miccai n. இலாமிச்சை. Cuscus-grass. See இலாமிச்சை. (தைலவ. தைல.)

The most important and agriculturally relevant description of miccai would be to sorghum, domesticated in Egypt 5000 years ago. The plant then "travelled", or better understood to be imported, to the Indian subcontinent 1000 years later.

What is interesting about sorghum is, the husks of the plant were bound very tightly, and had to removed forcefully to get to the useful grain inside.

@Bharat Jhunjhunwala claims Mitsrayim located in (India) Indus Valley from letters m,t,r. (Mathura)
@GoodAttention claims Mitsrayim located in (Egypt) KMT from letter soft c (miccai)

What happened in 1500 BCE?

Floods western India while yet droughts towards the west of the Yamuna river that's where, yet tribes did well living east of this river how?

Water so important where's all the wells and cisterns?

What are these treaties about that Rama made with nearby tribes that also includes the Pharaohs, yet how would Pharaohs drown, all of them, and this includes the army, how, did they not know how to swim are they less skillful then the sea people?

How did they communicate treaties how?

 

[paarsurrey]

Evidence that Ivrim, Benei Yisrael, Yehudim, and Modern day Jews do not descend from Yadavas farmers

"India"

The words "India/Hindu" and of course "Hindu-ism" are after the river Indus* and no part of this river is in Bharat, the rest is the politics, and I don't discuss politics, one could check/search/research/verify/explore yourself and form one's own opinion , please, right?
The mud volcano "Hingol" is located in Uthal* which is 124 km north of Karachi, afar from India.

Regards
_____________

1.​

https://en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Hingol_mud_volcanoes The Hingol mud volcanoes are located in Lasbela District, Balochistan, Pakistan at a distance of around 100 km from Uthal*, which is the headquarter of ...​

2.Harappa is an archaeological site in Punjab, Pakistan, about 24 km west of Sahiwal. Wikipedia
3.Distance between Indus River to Yamuna River
847 km

 

[River Sea]

@paarsurrey @Tamino @Bharat Jhunjhunwala @Aupmanyav @GoodAttention

To understand the water situation in this area, can people drink water? Is the water safe enough to drink? If not safe, how come? How did Krishna help in this situation? How does protecting people from poison snakes help? What is poison snakes in water? How does that cause water not to be safe?

There's different types of water. I do not know much about the sea.

I understand more about river water that people were able to drink, which confuses me about poison water that somehow Krishna took care of due to poison snakes.

Let's look at where India had flooded way west, shall we, and so badly that this whole area was gone from India—how much was Dwarka gone and is under the sea?

Dwarka was completely flooded. How come the sea was rising?
Drought west of the Yamuna River yet flooding from sea west India at Dwarka

Picture a drought near flooding; how does that happen?

I'll draw my confusing

Flood west. Drought middle area, which is west of Yamuna River. East of the Yamuna River, perfect for living conditions.

How come tribes didn't move east of Yamuna? Live where the Karmali tribe would be welcoming them, I'm sure of; also, that's where the Yadavas tribe came from, before traveling further west and dealing with that drought., am I understanding? Couldn't the Yadavas with Krishna return back to the Karmali tribe instead of traveling so far to Israel?

South what happened south in India, don't know??? @GoodAttention please help me know? What were the thoughts of Indians in southern India about Krishna?

Something happened northern India from flood west from sea, horrible situations horrible.

The Yamuna River moved eastward due to tectonic uplift, and what did all the people do when living in Harappan cities, depriving them of water? Please people, please move back to the Karmali tribe who lives east., it's safe there and no need to leave India.

How is flooding from sea west to drought uplift from river that's also west - picture flood next to drought, how?

under the sea Dwarka yet not far is a drought how?

Yet not far there's a drought close to Yamuna river how?

Dwarka: a fascinating realm of myth and materiality!

Dr. S.

www.linkedin.com

Keep in mind the Yamuna river isn't far from this place called, Dwarka

So one would think water spreading even areas where the Yamuna river is?

How far away is this Yamuna River from Dwarka?

Let's find out

But look at that place all under water, is that still there? Can people see that when scooper diving?

What really, the Yamuna river goes into the sea - take a look

This is what confuses me, because how does one live west of Yamuna river then, how?

A lot of Dwarka is gone, but still there's Dwarka, so can one see some of Dwarka under the sea, and what is the water like? Is the water salty? Can people drink this water today?

Where is this drought @Bharat Jhunjhunwala because look how long this Yamuna River is, it continues through India and reaches this sea

How come people can't drink sea water?

https://en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Hingol_mud_volcanoes The Hingol mud volcanoes are located in Lasbela District, Balochistan, Pakistan at a distance of around 100 km from Uthal*, which is the headquarter of ...​

2.Harappa is an archaeological site in Punjab, Pakistan, about 24 km west of Sahiwal. Wikipedia
3.Distance between Indus River to Yamuna River
847 km

Here's videos from google map

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

www.google.com

click on it it'll take you to quick videos that people taken. Shows Yamuna river.

 

[River Sea]

Arabian sea how much salt do you have, yet people can drink salt from sea.

Moses then joined the Pharaoh's household how? What was pharaoh's household like, what was it like to drink water in this house hold, was the water salty?

Krishna was summoned to Mathura by Kamsa really, what was that like for Krishna to be summoned after he became an adult, was Krishna happy or sad?

@Bharat Jhunjhunwala have you scooper dive in the sea to see this Dwarka that's under water? @GoodAttention were there any flooding in southern India ever? What were the wells and cistern like in southern India?

 

[River Sea]

@paarsurrey

The pharaoh in the Indus Valley would be the kings of Mohenjo Daro

@Bharat Jhunjhunwala claims the Pharaoh was the kings of Mohenjo Daro, Sindh, Pakistan. So Pharaohs' lived in Pakistan then.

Please educate us about these pharaohs from Mohenjo Daro and the daughter who taken Moses in to raise 'till adult.

so no Jarasandha and Kamsa weren't the Pharaohs.

Moses killed a Mitsrite and fled from Mitsrayim. Similarly,
Krishna killed Kamsa and left Mathura.

What is a Mitsrite?

The Pharaoh ordered the Mitsrite midwives to kill all the
newborn sons of the Hebrews at Goshen.
Kamsa ordered demoness Putna to do the same.

So is that midwives killing newborn sons?

So Mitsrite were midwives?

 

[River Sea]

If no Jew who knew ancient Hebrew existed then no one would have a reference for the language.

Your thoughts @GoodAttention because what about Tamil language from southern India? I'm interesting your thoughts especially explaining circle

you @GoodAttention used a circle word for scriptures, you favored the word 'Havilah' and that's Hebrew, what would this be in the Tamil language meaning circle?

@GoodAttention
So the first language is Tamil, meaning circle; did this show how it circled back to India then? Because what is this circle scripture then, yet you show Hebrew Havilah, which means circle? How come as Yadavas were Hebrews then circled how? Can you show more detail about this, please? Tamil language before Sanskrit, am I understanding correctly?

@GoodAttention but look how @Ehav4Ever wonders about no language for Jews, because Jews didn't know any ancient languages, how come? What about learning the circle word from Tamil, would that help learning about ancient language then in any ways?

Because circle is needed to know any language from past, or what pattern is needed to know?

Let's analyze this stated by @Ehav4Ever quote:
If no Jew who knew ancient Hebrew existed then no one would have a reference for the language.

Explain this to me how is it that no one would have any reference for the language yet you @GoodAttention brought up about this circle scriptures Havilah please what is this all about and reference this please with the Tamil language please

How would this help the Jews how to be able to reference how?

 

[GoodAttention]

The Yamuna River moved eastward due to tectonic uplift, and what did all the people do when living in Harappan cities, depriving them of water?

What all areas are the Harappan area, this wasn't extremely west of India that Krishna travelled? Not all of India was the Harappan area, and what does Harappan word mean I'll ask both to @GoodAttention and @Bharat Jhunjhunwala

My explanations are very simple, and although theoretical only, are certainly more logical than what others are giving. In fact, all I do when a person asks what the Tamil name or explanation can be is to search the Tamil dictionary. There is no premeditation whatsoever.

I do not know how old the name Harappa is, however interestingly, like miccai before, Harappa could also be describing a plant.

University of Madras Lexicon​

கரப்பர்ணம்​

karapparṇam n. cf. kara-parṇa. Castor-plant; ஆமணக்கு. (சங். அக.)

​

The "ka" sound in Tamil can also be a "ha" sound depending on the word.

Castor oil is extracted from the castor bean plant, which we know to be native in locations such as Harappa. The oil has a very ancient history, with evidence of use in Egypt going back to 4000 BCE. The two most important purpose would have been as an anti-fungal preservative for rice, grains, and pulses and for inducing labour in pregnant women. It could also be used to fuel lamps for light, and be used on the skin.

Harappa could have become a central city for the Indus Civilization simply from the importance of castor oil.

Castor oil - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org