God's opposition to homosexual behavior. Why?

[Subduction Zone]

Why does God want to have sex with you?

Those gods are all horny old buggers.

One suggestion, if you meet one don't turn your back on him . . . or her . . . or it

 

[SomeRandom]

Those gods are all horny old buggers.

One suggestion, if you meet one don't turn your back on him . . . or her . . . or it

 

[Shadow Wolf]

You forget that people also draw the line according to God's commandments.

You mean like how people made up the 10 Commandments and then forgot which ones where actually labeled the 10 Commandments?

It's also intangible to not become all you can be because you are taking an easy path to relationship, where opposite gender couples have to overcome and grow, etc.

What's easy about them? They get crap from people, and to work to overcome challenges and grow just like heterosexual couples.

 

[BilliardsBall]

Been there. Done that.

Then kindly post your counter-proof here, please, so I can read it and understand it.

 

[BilliardsBall]

Yes, this is true. So short of providing me statistics from a reputable source that specifically says gay people are on average more likely to experience depression caused solely by the factor of sexual orientation, not sure you can present that as evidence of anything.


Something that occurs with sterile heterosexual couples. Might cause distress and feelings of inadequacy in either partner. Can't think why, it's not like there's a good chunk of society that repeatedly holds up being fertile and having kids "naturally" as the ultimate reason for being a complete human or anything.............. Oh wait.
And progeny is not the be all and end all of being a human. You realize that everyone having babies is not always the ideal survival strategy for a species, right? We're already facing overpopulation, we should be thanking gay people for not dooming us to starvation.


Uhh, having to face literal persecution just for being in a same sex relationship from society is a pretty damned hard path. I'd argue that with societal judgment (both religious and secular) constantly poured onto gay couples as opposed to opposite sex couples makes their relationship a much harder path to traverse by default. Also gay people are still people. Their relationships also have to overcome and grow. What the hell are you even talking about? Do you not understand how relationships work?
Do you honestly think that a gay relationship is all sunshine and roses just because they're of the same sex? I thought you knew tons of gay people, how are you that naive about their lives?

So please, if you would kindly, give me an objective negative associated with homosexuality existing that is the result of their sexual orientation specifically? Or can you not do this?

You will say this is not an objective negative:

8 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, 19 because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. 20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse, 21 because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Professing to be wise, they became fools, 23 and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man—and birds and four-footed animals and creeping things.

24 Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves, 25 who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.

26 For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. 27 Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due.

28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind, to do those things which are not fitting; 29 being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality,wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness; they are whisperers, 30 backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, 31 undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving,unmerciful; 32 who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.

 

[BilliardsBall]

You mean like how people made up the 10 Commandments and then forgot which ones where actually labeled the 10 Commandments?

What's easy about them? They get crap from people, and to work to overcome challenges and grow just like heterosexual couples.

The word "them" tells me you are the self-appointed straight spokesperson for the gay community. Why?

 

[Subduction Zone]

The word "them" tells me you are the self-appointed straight spokesperson for the gay community. Why?

Why make such a bogus claim? Just because someone is willing to protect a minority that many theists want to oppress that does not make that person a spokesman for that community.

This indicates that there may be some doubt and guilt in your mind, so you have at least that going for you. If you did not have those feelings then you would be able to debate properly.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

The word "them" tells me you are the self-appointed straight spokesperson for the gay community. Why?

No. "Them" was in reference to homosexual relationships, which you implied are roses and rainbows and do not require the the normal relationship maintenance skills and heterosexual relationships do, and you also ignored the harsh social repercussions homosexuals face from people such as yourself.

 

[Skwim]

The word "them" tells me you are the self-appointed straight spokesperson for the gay community. Why?

Considering how inane this is, I'm beginning to think thou dost protest too much.

.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Then kindly post your counter-proof here, please, so I can read it and understand it.

We've already been over this. Same with the Israel becoming a nation thing. Why can't God ever just come out and state these numbers and dates outright? Why should all the searching through texts and mental gymnastics be necessary at all? Because you're just trying to fit current knowledge into your Bible so that you can continue to claim it's inerrant.

I'm not sure what you mean by counter-proof.

 

[Polymath257]

If you're open to it, there are multiple answers. Here's one: Pi And The Bible

That isn't even *internally* consistent, let alone meaningful mathematically.

 

[Subduction Zone]

That isn't even *internally* consistent, let alone meaningful mathematically.

It is an application of the Bible Code:

Bible code - Wikipedia

One can get almost any idea "supported" by taking bits and bobs and misapplying a mathematical analysis to it. The same can be done with almost any book of significant length. One looks for something that one wants to "prove" and then crunches the numbers until it turns up. Since one can easily predict both sides to a possible outcome it is in the category of Not Even Wrong.

 

[Polymath257]

It is an application of the Bible Code:

Bible code - Wikipedia

One can get almost any idea "supported" by taking bits and bobs and misapplying a mathematical analysis to it. The same can be done with almost any book of significant length. One looks for something that one wants to "prove" and then crunches the numbers until it turns up. Since one can easily predict both sides to a possible outcome it is in the category of Not Even Wrong.

No kidding. Numerology, in general, isn't the best area of 'study'.

There are so few small numbers, you can literally get *anything* by appropriate manipulation of *any* sufficiently large collection. Long books allow this easily.

 

[SkepticThinker]

It is an application of the Bible Code:

Bible code - Wikipedia

One can get almost any idea "supported" by taking bits and bobs and misapplying a mathematical analysis to it. The same can be done with almost any book of significant length. One looks for something that one wants to "prove" and then crunches the numbers until it turns up. Since one can easily predict both sides to a possible outcome it is in the category of Not Even Wrong.

Exactly!

 

[SomeRandom]

You will say this is not an objective negative:

8 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, 19 because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. 20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse, 21 because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Professing to be wise, they became fools, 23 and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man—and birds and four-footed animals and creeping things.

24 Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves, 25 who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.

26 For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. 27 Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due.

28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind, to do those things which are not fitting; 29 being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality,wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness; they are whisperers, 30 backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, 31 undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving,unmerciful; 32 who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.

You're correct. A Bible verse only applies to people who follow the Bible, oddly enough. I could quote from my own scripture verses promoting peace, tolerance and even mild acceptance of homosexuality, which you would dismiss as not being from your specific Holy Book. Which would be fair enough.
Because Holy Books don't hold much sway over people not following them and thus irrelevant to real life outside of specific religious communities. It is literally subjective. So try again.

You know if you haven't got objective evidence, away from scripture, churches and even the Government, all you had to do was say so. There's no shame in admitting that. Although it makes your prejudice seem kind of inane, but hey you do you.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

God never meant for the same sex people to get together .

Technically God never meant for heteros to have sex either. Adam had to go through every other life form before God finally figured out Adam needed a twin sister to reproduce, because I guess God left the "making a person from dirt" recipe near His dog and it got eaten or something.

 

[BilliardsBall]

No. "Them" was in reference to homosexual relationships, which you implied are roses and rainbows and do not require the the normal relationship maintenance skills and heterosexual relationships do, and you also ignored the harsh social repercussions homosexuals face from people such as yourself.

"Such as myself?!"

For thousands of years, nearly all cultures have condemned homosexuality. Could it be that homosexuality is wrong on an evolutionary or other basis?

As comedians to philosophers have noticed, it's FAR easier to have a relationship with someone of the same gender.

 

[BilliardsBall]

We've already been over this. Same with the Israel becoming a nation thing. Why can't God ever just come out and state these numbers and dates outright? Why should all the searching through texts and mental gymnastics be necessary at all? Because you're just trying to fit current knowledge into your Bible so that you can continue to claim it's inerrant.

I'm not sure what you mean by counter-proof.

The Bible has a just-so story for your question, regarding that God hides Himself just enough to make people to search for Him, a just response to human sin. I found Him!

I've noticed a pattern, additionally, which is atheists, not believers, find "flaws" in the Bible like "the idiots didn't know Pi," and then we see Pi to enough places to show a superior intelligence far beyond the ANE wrote the Bible. It works beautifully, actually.

By counter-proof, I mean I'd like to see you deconstruct the proof on that page so I understand why their calculation of Pi is off, because Pi to five or more decimal places is a compelling "coincidence" with odds of 1 in billions!

 

[BilliardsBall]

That isn't even *internally* consistent, let alone meaningful mathematically.

Please provide your refutation below, so I come to understand where the math was fudged:

Polymath explains the math is wrong, " ... "

 

[BilliardsBall]

You're correct. A Bible verse only applies to people who follow the Bible, oddly enough. I could quote from my own scripture verses promoting peace, tolerance and even mild acceptance of homosexuality, which you would dismiss as not being from your specific Holy Book. Which would be fair enough.
Because Holy Books don't hold much sway over people not following them and thus irrelevant to real life outside of specific religious communities. It is literally subjective. So try again.

You know if you haven't got objective evidence, away from scripture, churches and even the Government, all you had to do was say so. There's no shame in admitting that. Although it makes your prejudice seem kind of inane, but hey you do you.

Why? If I show you statistics and studies showing pain, trauma, heightened risk for domestic violence and domestic abuse, will you not say it all stems from unrighteous oppression from non-gays?