Holes in the trinity

[Tumah]

There is not a single fact in this post.

Not pronouncing Jehovah's name is not respectful at all.

I just proved to you that it is. "No its not" is not a valid argument.

He commands us to use it.

Does he though?

There is no bait and switch. Rejecting the Christian Greek scriptures is totally disrespectful to Jehovah.

Yes it is. It means we believe G-d is not so wishy-washy as to keep changing his mind. That's the omniscient part of being G-d.
I could justas easily claim that rejecting the Qur'an, Book of Mormon, etc. is disrespectful to G-d.

Israel is no longer Jehovah's chosen nation.

That's false.

What's impossible about that? Attempting to refute that is impossible.

Not at all. The Christian Bible is "of the devil" (to use a Christian phrase). So whatever it says in it, is wrong.

Attempting to think Israel is Jehovah's chosen nation still, even after He said they were no longer, is impossible.

Theoretically that would be true. But as noted above, He never made such a statement.

Being Jehovah's friend, and He yours, under those circumstances is impossible.

I agree. That's why obviously, you must be wrong about the basic principle.

So I suppose Israel has been attempting, unsuccessfully, to do the impossible. Yes I agree with that.

Nope.

Not pronouncing Jehovah's name? No, His name is not God or Adonai or any other title. His name is Jehovah. You've not misspelled His name, you've misspelled His TITLE. Now that is not rational. It's kind of nuts.

Well, technically its not a misspelling of anything. But where its coming from is quite rational indeed. I don't expect a Christian who doesn't have the Spirit of the L-rd residing in him, to be able to understand. Only people with G-d's Holy Spirit in them could understand such a thing. G-d has blinded the minds of people like you who don't believe.

 

[truthofscripture]

"Jesus was fully human as well as fully divine"... So Jesus was God whilst on earth as a human then?

No. Jesus is God's only first hand creation, the "firstborn of all creation". He was not equal to his Father, but subservient to Him, as he is now. He was sent by his Father, prayed to Him, was resurrected by Him. Would one pray to ones self, be sent by ones self, be subservient to ones self? Can one beget ones self? No, it's iimpossible. Plus Jesus and God Himself both said several times that God is father, Jesus is son. The teaching that God and Jesus are the same comes from false religions claiming to be Christian. Only Christianity is Christian. It is what Jesus taught while on Earth. After his death, many sects/denominations began to appear. They are Christendom, not Christian, although they claim to be. They are most certainly not. They teach the lies most people believe, like Jesus dying on a cross and not a toruture stake, immortality of the soul, hell fire, and many other lies. Only an accurate translation of the inspired word of God is approved by God, none of the false religions or their false teachings are God approved. The false religions are called "works of the flesh" and "Babylon the Great". If God approved them, why are they called these things? Why are they said to be destined for destruction in the final battle?

 

[truthofscripture]

There is not a single fact in this post.

I just proved to you that it is. "No its not" is not a valid argument.

Does he though?

Yes it is. It means we believe G-d is not so wishy-washy as to keep changing his mind. That's the omniscient part of being G-d.
I could justas easily claim that rejecting the Qur'an, Book of Mormon, etc. is disrespectful to G-d.

That's false.

Not at all. The Christian Bible is "of the devil" (to use a Christian phrase). So whatever it says in it, is wrong.

Theoretically that would be true. But as noted above, He never made such a statement.

I agree. That's why obviously, you must be wrong about the basic principle.

Nope.

Well, technically its not a misspelling of anything. But where its coming from is quite rational indeed. I don't expect a Christian who doesn't have the Spirit of the L-rd residing in him, to be able to understand. Only people with G-d's Holy Spirit in them could understand such a thing. G-d has blinded the minds of people like you who don't believe.

Why do you post such things that are clearly in total contradiction to the scriptures? They may agree with the Talmud, but the Talmud isn't approved by God. Yes, Israel was ABANDONED by God, because Israel constantly ABANDONED God, and do to this day. They lie and claim that the Tanakh is the inspired word of God, but the rest isn't. That clearly is not the case, but Israel refuses the Messiah. It's Israel who will perish, again, permanently, for this position, at Jesus' hand in the final battle. So be it. It is your choice as part of Israel. I choose, however, to believe God, rather than men, not Rabbis (teachers only, not leaders), not religions, not a work opposing God (Talmud), not writings of any religion or religionist. I choose the inspired word of God as it's the ONLY truthful source of truthful information about God, His son, and the coming government of Earth.

 

[Tumah]

Why do you post such things that are clearly in total contradiction to the scriptures? They may agree with the Talmud, but the Talmud isn't approved by God. Yes, Israel was ABANDONED by God, because Israel constantly ABANDONED God, and do to this day. They lie and claim that the Tanakh is the inspired word of God, but the rest isn't. That clearly is not the case, but Israel refuses the Messiah. It's Israel who will perish, again, permanently, for this position, at Jesus' hand in the final battle. So be it. It is your choice as part of Israel. I choose, however, to believe God, rather than men, not Rabbis (teachers only, not leaders), not religions, not a work opposing God (Talmud), not writings of any religion or religionist. I choose the inspired word of God as it's the ONLY truthful source of truthful information about God, His son, and the coming government of Earth.

As far as I can tell, the only thing you've chosen is willful ignorance.

 

[truthofscripture]

As far as I can tell, the only thing you've chosen is willful ignorance.

I have no willful ignorance, especially concerning the word of God, His intentions, His teachings, and His requirements. It appears that possibly your understanding is flawed, and not as you claim, mine. I've spent many decades in study of His word, comparing each scripture to each other one, and re-translating from as many original texts as are available to us. Is it possible you use one of the false translations as most do? Is it possible that you stick to the words of men (the Talmud), or only to the words of God? Is it possible you reject the Christian Greek portion of God's inspired word and adhere only to the Tanakh? I think that maybe that is so.

 

[Tumah]

I have no willful ignorance, especially concerning the word of God, His intentions, His teachings, and His requirements.

How can you deny willful ignorance when you are ignorant of the other side?

It appears that possibly your understanding is flawed, and not as you claim, mine. I've spent many decades in study of His word, comparing each scripture to each other one, and re-translating from as many original texts as are available to us.

Really? So let's pull up a Hebrew Bible and get cracking.

Is it possible you use one of the false translations as most do?

Nope. I can do Hebrew and Aramaic.

Is it possible that you stick to the words of men (the Talmud), or only to the words of God? Is it possible you reject the Christian Greek portion of God's inspired word and adhere only to the Tanakh? I think that maybe that is so.

You bet its so!

 

[truthofscripture]

How can you deny willful ignorance when you are ignorant of the other side?

Really? So let's pull up a Hebrew Bible and get cracking.

Nope. I can do Hebrew and Aramaic.

You bet its so!

If you willfully ignor one word of God's inspired word, how can pleasing Jehovah God be accomplished? If you reject God's word in favor of the words of men, how can pleasing Him be accomplished? If you reject His son the Christ, how can you please Him? The answer is quite clear, one cannot please God in doing these things. Adding to or taking away ONE WORD of the inspired word of God makes one God's enemy. The Talmud does that, and rejecting the Christian Greek texts accomplishes that as well. I prefer to be God's friend, and He mine, rather than have Him as an enemy by ignoring His words and sticking to the words of men. I still cannot understand why anyone could or would do this. I am also not "ignorant" of "the other side". One of my business partners years ago tried fruitlessly to teach me that the Talmud was more important than God's inspired word, and that the Christian Greek scriptures were false. He was also unsuccessful, as your efforts are with me. I use the entirety of His inspired word, not just the first five books. I would never adhere to any texts that change God's teachings and intent, as does the Talmud. All of the Jewish people who have become true Christians feel exactly the same way as I do. They really don't understand how they took their previous course, except that it was taught them from their toddler years on up. They knew nothing else, until they began to search, and then saw the truth of the matter. They are to be commended.

 

[Tumah]

If you willfully ignor one word of God's inspired word, how can pleasing Jehovah God be accomplished?

That's true.

If you reject God's word in favor of the words of men, how can pleasing Him be accomplished?

That's true too.

If you reject His son the Christ, how can you please Him?

That is one of the things that is pleasing to Him.

The answer is quite clear, one cannot please God in doing these things.

Hmm... Let's try the next one.

Adding to or taking away ONE WORD of the inspired word of God makes one God's enemy.

That's not entirely true, but can be true under certain circumstances.

The Talmud does that,

Nope. You won't find a single rejection of even a letter in any of the ~8,000 pages of the Talmud.

and rejecting the Christian Greek texts accomplishes that as well.

No. That would be how to get on G-d's good side. He doesn't like when false prophets get up in His name.

I prefer to be God's friend, and He mine, rather than have Him as an enemy by ignoring His words and sticking to the words of men.

Theoretically that would be a good stance, except in context, it means you are doing the exact opposite.

I still cannot understand why anyone could or would do this.

It seems there's still a lot you don't understand, my son.

I am also not "ignorant" of "the other side". One of my business partners years ago tried fruitlessly to teach me that the Talmud was more important than God's inspired word, and that the Christian Greek scriptures were false. He was also unsuccessful, as your efforts are with me.

I'm sure your business partner was quite the scholar. Meanwhile, we'll just stick with the NT being contrived words of men.

I use the entirety of His inspired word, not just the first five books.

Your ignorance is showing. Jews use the 24 books of Scriptures. From Genesis until Nehemia.

I would never adhere to any texts that change God's teachings and intent, as does the Talmud.

And yet, the NT does exactly that worse than the Talmud could ever be accused of doing.

All of the Jewish people who have become true Christians feel exactly the same way as I do.

All the Jews who have fooled themselves feel fooled just like you do. What's your point?

They really don't understand how they took their previous course, except that it was taught them from their toddler years on up.

Yeah. You need to be raised from birth with a story like "god in the flesh", to be able to take that seriously. Its too ridiculous to be true: Like believing that G-d would poop his diapers and spit up on his mommy's brand new toga that she just got from Rome. Sometimes he would get a rash on his cute little tush. And auntie Lizabeth would pinch those chubby cheeks when he would take all the jugs out meal out of his mother's pantry. Yeah. Jesus was a terror during the terrible twos.

They knew nothing else, until they began to search, and then saw the truth of the matter. They are to be commended.

And in 95% of the cases, they were also ignorant. In the other 5% of cases they usually had a bone to pick with the Jews as was evidenced after their conversion.

 

[truthofscripture]

That's true.

That's true too.

That is one of the things that is pleasing to Him.

Hmm... Let's try the next one.

That's not entirely true, but can be true under certain circumstances.

Nope. You won't find a single rejection of even a letter in any of the ~8,000 pages of the Talmud.

No. That would be how to get on G-d's good side. He doesn't like when false prophets get up in His name.

Theoretically that would be a good stance, except in context, it means you are doing the exact opposite.

It seems there's still a lot you don't understand, my son.

I'm sure your business partner was quite the scholar. Meanwhile, we'll just stick with the NT being contrived words of men.

Your ignorance is showing. Jews use the 24 books of Scriptures. From Genesis until Nehemia.

And yet, the NT does exactly that worse than the Talmud could ever be accused of doing.

All the Jews who have fooled themselves feel fooled just like you do. What's your point?

Yeah. You need to be raised from birth with a story like "god in the flesh", to be able to take that seriously. Its too ridiculous to be true: Like believing that G-d would poop his diapers and spit up on his mommy's brand new toga that she just got from Rome. Sometimes he would get a rash on his cute little tush. And auntie Lizabeth would pinch those chubby cheeks when he would take all the jugs out meal out of his mother's pantry. Yeah. Jesus was a terror during the terrible twos.

And in 95% of the cases, they were also ignorant. In the other 5% of cases they usually had a bone to pick with the Jews as was evidenced after their conversion.

It saddens me that you choose destruction to everlasting life in a Paradise Earth. It always does when I see someone take the course you are on.

 

[sojourner]

"Jesus was fully human as well as fully divine"... So Jesus was God whilst on earth as a human then?

Read Philippians 2: God gave up divinity to become on of us, in human form. For Paul, Jesus did not become Divine until the resurrection.

 

[Tumah]

It saddens me that you choose destruction to everlasting life in a Paradise Earth. It always does when I see someone take the course you are on.

In other words your answer is:
You make good points that I can't argue against Tumah. But I can't admit to your winning the argument. So instead I'll just duck out.

Sayonara

 

[moorea944]

Read Philippians 2: God gave up divinity to become on of us, in human form. For Paul, Jesus did not become Divine until the resurrection.

You might want to read Phil 2 again.... Your saying that God "gave up' divinity? To become one of us? You serious? So God, who created us, still doesnt know how we feel as humans, so He has to "change" himself into us? That is absolutely awefull and totally degrades our creator.

In the form of God - does not mean he was God. You have to get this doctrine out of your head. Was Jesus in the "form" of God? Yes, he was God manifest in the flesh. He manifested God in everything he did. Some people thought he was trying to say that he was God, because they didnt understand. But then it says that he "didnt' make that reputation. He was a servant, he humbled himself. And then verse 11 - "And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father"

Very simple language here. Jesus does everything to the Glory of the Father. Plain and simple.

 

[sojourner]

You might want to read Phil 2 again.... Your saying that God "gave up' divinity? To become one of us? You serious? So God, who created us, still doesnt know how we feel as humans, so He has to "change" himself into us? That is absolutely awefull and totally degrades our creator.

In the form of God - does not mean he was God. You have to get this doctrine out of your head. Was Jesus in the "form" of God? Yes, he was God manifest in the flesh. He manifested God in everything he did. Some people thought he was trying to say that he was God, because they didnt understand. But then it says that he "didnt' make that reputation. He was a servant, he humbled himself. And then verse 11 - "And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father"

Very simple language here. Jesus does everything to the Glory of the Father. Plain and simple.

It might help if you understood the Greek text, and were able to exegete the text to understand what Paul means here.

 

[moorea944]

It might help if you understood the Greek text, and were able to exegete the text to understand what Paul means here.

I do...

 

[moorea944]

The other point that I want to make is that God does not change. Why would you even think that God doesnt even understand about His creation that He made. And that He would have to change down to our level of life so he can understand us for Himself. Does that really make sense to you? Are you saying that God is not in control? God is in control of everything. His angels are also here on earth, they are the fingers of Yahweh. God does not have to come down to earth to do anything. He is always in Heaven.

 

[sojourner]

The other point that I want to make is that God does not change.

Becoming Incarnate isn't what's meant by that sentiment.

Why would you even think that God doesnt even understand about His creation that He made.

I don't think that. Why would you think that I thought that?

And that He would have to change down to our level of life so he can understand us for Himself.

I didn't think that either. You're coming up with stuff out of whole cloth.

Are you saying that God is not in control?

Nope. Are you?

God is in control of everything.

Mkay. Is God in control of our choices?

His angels are also here on earth, they are the fingers of Yahweh.

Not cogent to the argument.

God does not have to come down to earth to do anything.

God doesn't have to come down to earth. But, apparently, God did need to become Incarnate.

He is always in Heaven.

God is always everywhere.

 

[sojourner]

I do...

Somehow, that hasn't been exhibited here...

 

[truthofscripture]

In other words your answer is:
You make good points that I can't argue against Tumah. But I can't admit to your winning the argument. So instead I'll just duck out.

Sayonara

Oh most certainly not. I disagree with your viewpoint totally and completely. I cannot reject half of God's inspired word as you promote. I cannot consider any words of man over the word of God the Almighty, Jehovah, as you promote. I feel bad that anyone would take the position as you do, since I know their fate. Maybe someday you will seek out the truth, but I am not holding my breath.

 

[sojourner]

Oh most certainly not. I disagree with your viewpoint totally and completely. I cannot reject half of God's inspired word as you promote. I cannot consider any words of man over the word of God the Almighty, Jehovah, as you promote. I feel bad that anyone would take the position as you do, since I know their fate. Maybe someday you will seek out the truth, but I am not holding my breath.

You "know" no one's fate. It's entitled hubris to think that you do.

 

[moorea944]

God doesn't have to come down to earth. But, apparently, God did need to become Incarnate.

No, not at all. Incarnate is not used in scripture. Words like manifest is. Incarnate means to change into something else. God does not change. Are you saying that God changed into Jesus? Not really sure what your saying here..... Your bringing words into scripture.

God is always everywhere.

Yes, His spirit is.