I am a good man, so why don't I have a girlfriend? Do I need to be a jerk instead?

[Koldo]

Yes, but his stated goal wasn't just one date... but a relationship.

Getting him one date is the easy part.

Then tell him how to do it exactly, because he is being unable to do so.
To him, it is being quite hard.

It's sweet of you to think I'm young enough to have only been in one relationship.

I didn't say that. :sarcastic

As a rebuttal.... what is better advice on one successful relationship or from someone who has had several unsuccessful ones? If the person who has been "into it several times" why would you think they know anything about "successful". Unless you plan to not do whatever it is they are doing.

wa:do

Why is there a dichotomy?
How about choosing between those and someone who had many sucessful relationships that he happened to dump because he didn't want anything serious?

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Likewise, I have known many men who only fall for psycho women. He's pretty screwed up himself, and not much of a prize. He's moody and self-absorbed, and often will say the most hurtful thing he can possibly think of to the people who care about him the most. Does it surprise you that damaged people seek each other out?

When I was young and more screwed up, I was attracted to people who were as screwed up as I was. I felt extremely uncomfortable around people who had had an easy childhood - I related best to other people who had eccentric, mentally ill or abusive parents.

I haven't lived any place where women are shallow in the sense of preferring men who treat them badly, and I've lived in every major city in Canada, as well as parts of Ireland and the UK. I've traveled in Australia, Guatemala, Europe, and the US. So far the only place I'm aware of where a significant minority of women prefer to be treated poorly is television.

No woman wants to be treated poorly. If she's searching for jerks, it doesn't mean that acting like a jerk will increase your chances of scoring, it means she desperately trying to complete unresolved issues with a past relationship.

Men do this too, btw. Those who have been hurt and haven't moved on will continually seek out the gold-digger, the cheating two-timer, the drunk, the *****, etc. until they get it.

 

[Alceste]

Well if you **** him all night, you've already nabbed him. Are you talking about relationships? Actually, that's quite a bad move to make. The best way to get a man relationship wise is to not put out at all. If the guy doesn't want to be with you because he can't get the milk for free, you've saved yourself a lot of heartache. Spending all his money only comes AFTER you have a relationship. Stuffing your bra may work only until the bra comes off, and many perceptive guys can see that and see it as a sign of an easier target.

The analogy itself is ridiculous. Men have to work very, very hard to get women in many cases, even for so-called "Confident jerks" unless they're born into a trust fund and have natural good looks which makes their job 100x easier. Women just have to stand there to get hit on and be of reasonable attractiveness. That's called nature at work.

You are obviously living in a completely different world than I am. Healthy relationships on my planet (whether they take the form of a life long commitment or a single night of mutually satisfying debauchery) take a lot of work from everybody involved.

 

[Koldo]

You are obviously living in a completely different world than I am. Healthy relationships on my planet (whether they take the form of a life long commitment or a single night of mutually satisfying debauchery) take a lot of work from everybody involved.

Have you really read what he said?
It seems like you are talking about something completely different.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Just that there a lot out there who fit the cliche. They don't represent women in general, but they're not nonexistent, either.

I don't think it's notable enough to give any credibility to the OP's argument.

 

[Alceste]

No woman wants to be treated poorly. If she's searching for jerks, it doesn't mean that acting like a jerk will increase your chances of scoring, it means she desperately trying to complete unresolved issues with a past relationship.

Men do this too, btw. Those who have been hurt and haven't moved on will continually seek out the gold-digger, the cheating two-timer, the drunk, the *****, etc. until they get it.

Yep - it's the "damaged people seek out other damaged people" thing in action.

 

[Alceste]

Have you really read what he said?
It seems like you are talking about something completely different.

Maybe so. I did read what he said, I just can't relate to it at all. I don't come from a culture or religion that is obsessed with sexual purity. It's pretty common for women in my neck of the woods to have sex with their romantic partners. The adage "why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free" became obsolete the day unmarried women won the right to own property.

 

[Alceste]

Looks like you completely missed the context of my quote.

I said why would we want those particular girls who sleep with the guy at the party in the relationship?

Looks like you're taking my small talk pretty seriously.

Beats me. You said yourself that reasonably attractive women get constantly hit on without putting any effort into it. Doesn't sound like it makes any difference, in your opinion, whether or not they've previously slept with Roger. And, if you're not in pursuit of a relationship (with all the communication that entails), how would you even know if your target mating opportunity had already had sex with Roger?

 

[Father Heathen]

I haven't lived any place where women are shallow in the sense of preferring men who treat them badly, and I've lived in every major city in Canada, as well as parts of Ireland and the UK. I've traveled in Australia, Guatemala, Europe, and the US. So far the only place I'm aware of where a significant minority of women prefer to be treated poorly is television.

I never said they deliberately sought to be mistreated. What's with everyone misconstruing my words tonight?

As for television, media and entertainment does have an influence upon the perceptions and attitudes of the dumb, naive and impressionable youth, unfortunately.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Have you really read what he said?
It seems like you are talking about something completely different.

No. She's speaking with wisdom. Success and happiness in ANY sort of relationship - casual, professional, sexual, marital - requires mutual respect and attention.

I speak from experience, too.

 

[Father Heathen]

[youtube]F0k96hDQf7s[/youtube]
Bill Hicks - Chicks Dig Jerks - YouTube

By the late, great comedian Bill Hicks.

 

[Koldo]

No. She's speaking with wisdom. Success and happiness in ANY sort of relationship - casual, professional, sexual, marital - requires mutual respect and attention.

I speak from experience, too.

It is amazing how these conversations go in weird directions.

Let me explain: i agree with the main content of what she said and also with the main content of what he said. They are not talking about the same thing at all, which is why this is possible.

 

[Kathryn]

damn, give that man some frubals

I just did.

Speaking as a strong, independent, passionate woman, I can tell you this much - I want a man with enough testosterone coursing through his veins to come after me, pursue me, protect me, and fight for me if necessary.

Guess what - he can do all that AND be a nice guy. Really. I promise.

 

[Alceste]

I never said they deliberately sought to be mistreated. What's with everyone misconstruing my words tonight?

As for television, media and entertainment does have an influence upon the perceptions and attitudes of the dumb, naive and impressionable youth, unfortunately.

No, I suppose I thought you were defending the assertion that there is a general tendency for the majority of women to prefer "jerks" to "nice" guys. That implies to me that they are seeking mistreatment. Maybe I'm jumping to conclusions, though - in woman-speak, "jerk" is practically synonymous with "one who mistreats his girlfriend". In man-speak, I still suspect "jerk" might only mean "one who gets more women than I do".

 

[Alceste]

I just did.

Speaking as a strong, independent, passionate woman, I can tell you this much - I want a man with enough testosterone coursing through his veins to come after me, pursue me, protect me, and fight for me if necessary.

Guess what - he can do all that AND be a nice guy. Really. I promise.

So you are saying you DON'T prefer "jerks"? Join the rest of us. :flirt:

 

[Kathryn]

I agree with the exception of one small detail. I think the confident jerk can get away with having average physical fitness with the most important determinant being his weight. So long as he isn't noticably overweight, I'm talking 10 pounds over at most or maybe 15-20 if he's naturally handsome, he'll still be able very successful with the ladies, especially if can clean up well by putting on well fitting clothes and being well groomed. If that the case he can get away with not having washboard abs

How do you define "success with the ladies?"

 

[Alceste]

[youtube]F0k96hDQf7s[/youtube]
Bill Hicks - Chicks Dig Jerks - YouTube

By the late, great comedian Bill Hicks.

Yeah, he sure wasn't bitter.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

How do you define "success with the ladies?"

Personally, *I* define success with the ladies as seeing them walk away from me feeling more confident, alive, and dynamic than when we met.

But that's just me.

 

[Kathryn]

Of course you mean it in an offensive way, your making assumptions and are belittling me because you think you know better than me based on some arbitrary number you see. I'm talking about in general. I've seen older relationships be the same way. You have no basis for your statements other than your bias and pre-conceived notions about me based on age.

Maybe you should mind your own business and not make assumptions about my life, I feel like I am about to explode because of your wording. You know nothing about me.

Hey, look here, dude, I do NOT mean it in an offensive way. I was twenty years old once too - anyone over twenty has been your age and we were just as valuable a human then as we are now.

The very fact that you suddenly feel so explosively angry when I mention your age does say a lot, though, about your maturity level.

 

[Father Heathen]

I don't think it's notable enough to give any credibility to the OP's argument.

Except I wasn't trying to give credibility to the OP's argument.

So what's your point?