BucephalusBB
ABACABB
What I meant to say is that evil does not need to exist if God didn't want to create it. Yet either he did, or there is no such thing as good or bad.
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if God is all love where does evil come from?
- Thread starter hoojah
- Start date
Heneni
Miss Independent
And what I mean, is that if the bible says god keeps on turning evil into good, then he cant be too happy with evil. And when he created everything he said....it is GOOD.
So lets think about this....God created everything and calls it GOOD, and then...
God creates evil....doesnt like it and god turns it into good
God creates more evil....god turns it into good
God creates evil.....god turns it into good....
No hang on a minute...god did not create evil......
Kcnorwood
Well-Known Member
Heneni
Miss Independent
Jeremiah
Well-Known Member
“That's assuming evil indeed exists” – Methylatedghosts
You better bet your fleshy back end it exists. To name a few evils. Day time soaps that is evil. Peyton Manning that is evil. Flinging live kittens into on coming traffic that is evil. Eating half a steak while others starve to death that is evil. Babies born addicted to crack that is evil. Watching a loved one die that is evil. Beating your kids that is evil. War that is evil. Classify it and define it however you want but evil does exits. Recognizing the problem exists is the first step to amending it.
“What makes a volcanic eruption an "act of god"? Why can't it just be?”
Sure I am keen with that. I just want to understand why this so called benevolent god is so lazy in aiding with the easing of suffering. If he really is an almighty being than why do people have to be needlessly burned to death?
“Besides, it's not God who's building cities at the base of volcanoes or near tectonic plate junctions, or even underneath the clouds, where it might rain and flood the area”
Ya! I mean the settlers of past ages had all the marvels of modern science at their fingertips. Why the heck they didn’t use them is beyond me. Also why all the little children don’t just move is also beyond me.
There are greater evils than natural disaster. Cancer will kill a staggering number of people with brutality beyond description before and if we ever find a cure. No matter where you live or who you are.
“or is that brave?”
Brave? As if an almighty being ever has anything to fear.
“Why did you lie for the first time, or why did you nick a cookie out of the cookie jar without mom and dads approval? Did somebody pull you aside and teach you?”
My mom and dad who used words, patience and understanding to correct me. Not death, sickness and dismemberment.
“Did god teach satan to be evil, or did he just do that by himself”
Are you seriously implying that Satan is or was ever out of the control of an almighty being? If an almighty god did exist nothing would be out of its control. Is Satan so powerful that Almighty God can do nothing to stop him from terrorizing his children? I thought nothing could oppose the will of an almighty god. If that is so then the only reason for Satan to exist as Satan exists is because Almighty God wants it to be so. An almighty god could snap its fingers and *Poof* a good or a dead Satan. So then why did Almighty God knowingly unleash this horror on us than just let if run amok? Is God all-powerful or not?
“Everyone wants the GREAT stuff without having to pay the price. These same things are what made this incredibly beautiful world so incredibly beautiful.”
Be sure to lets the people of New Orleans know that while they suffered greatly they now have a beautiful junk pile to live in. But let’s get real are you really telling me that an almighty god needs to kill people so the we can have pretty stuff to look at?
“No earthquakes? That means no Rockies. No Volcanoes? Say good bye to Hawaii! These aren't EVIL: they are essential parts of our ecosystem. Remember the fires in Florida a few years ago? They are attributed to man trying to prevent fire for SO LONG. It appears that fires are an essential part of our ecosystem.”
Yes I agree God is not all-powerful. I mean an all-powerful god could achieve the same end without the suffering.
---------
Either God is not all-powerful or God in not benevolent.
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Jeremiah
Well-Known Member
[Pray] Dear Lord in heaven who is so generous. I wish to offer my thanks for the many greatness thou has bestowed upon us lowly humans. I wish to give thanks for giving us the ability to war. Boy that was such a smart move Lord. The A-Bomb being one of my favorites Lord and I am so glad that you let your children keep such a fun toy. I also wish to give thanks for the violent and uncaring ways of nature it makes me feel so safe Lord. But O Lord who is so heavenly and good most of all I wish to gives thanks for cancer Lord. For it truly is a sadistic and as of yet unstoppable wide spread cause of enormous suffering. O LORD CANCER IS JUST SO GRAND! THANKS FOR SUCH A GREAT GIFT. [/Pray]
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Kcnorwood
Well-Known Member
I think it's funny how you some of you want to make Isaiah 45:7 sound more cryptic then it really is. Here's the thing God said that he created everything which would include good & evil. NOw you think he didn't then you need to take it up with him after all the bible it's supposed to be the words of God. Now if your one of those who pick & choose what to believe out of the bible, then somehow I'm sure you have already wormed your way out of it.
Scuba Pete
Le plongeur avec attitude...
Just look at how much BETTER they handled it this time. It is survival of the fittest after all.
Everyone dies. Are you suggesting that death disproves God? How droll.
Then we agree on nothing, and you have shown that you are merely adept at twisting words.
Jeremiah
Well-Known Member
I am not the one who thinks Katrina was a good thing.
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gnomon
Well-Known Member
So many simple answers.
Evil does not exist. Most people just equivocate it with bad anyway. Silly humans.
God created evil, God is evil, God needs evil....any religious version that requires a God abiding evil for whatever cosmological purpose that any temporal mind claims they know needs a good dose of haldol.
Third, and easist is.......what God?
AK4
Well-Known Member
No. People these just like to twist peoples words. READ THE WORDS I PUT----LUCIFER IS A HOAX,
I didnt say satan
Jeremiah
Well-Known Member
In this context evil = bad is the same as bad = evil. It's the same concept either way just different labels. In fact if you look in a thesaurus you'll see evil listed under bad and vice versa. For it's intended purposes here they both mean the same thing.
gnomon
Well-Known Member
AK4
Well-Known Member
If what Jeremiah posted is not right then i guess white=black and black=white and up=down and down=up.
Scuba Pete
Le plongeur avec attitude...
That's a non sequitur. You keep talking about logic but you never seem to produce any. In fact, you assume a LOT and produce nothing to support your premise. It's amazing how you just keep pulling thread after thread off topic just to preach your religion of atheism. Evangelism is not allowed here.
It appears that you use logic in order to deal with your insecurity about death.
gnomon
Well-Known Member
That or people could bother learning something for once and try to understand what the concept of supernatural evil entails with trying to associate with God, or a supernatural good.
On the way to learning that, they can stop by and understand the concept of equivocation.
And then maybe then can understand the asinine intellect it takes to equivocate the concept of a force of evil in the universe to that of trying to explain why puppies have to die.
Then they can dig deeper and realize that the society that brought forth those religious concepts fully understood the concept of suffering and they can also realize that the Bible deals directly with the concept of human suffering, human suffering is not evil and perhaps they can actually hold an intelligent discussion for once.
Flip through a thesaurus.
edit: Of course, I am an atheist so my comments can just be dismissed.
methylatedghosts
Can't brain. Has dumb.
Some people love daytime soaps.
Some people think flinging live kittens is fun
Some people don't mind eating half a steak.
Anything that you call evil will have a person calling it not evil. Hitler thought killing a whole lot of people was "good". Many people agreed. Many people disagreed. How can anyone say it was one or the other way, and be certain that they're right.
We have all the tools we need to make an informed decision about living in a place without volcanoes, or without earthquakes or without flooding. How do you know that those tools weren't god-inspired? Wouldn't that count as "helping out"? You see - people ask god for many things, but the reply is either ignored, misunderstood, or people just simply don't listen out for a reply. Some people go so far as to get a reply, but then disagree with it and do their own things anyway. But people are living on volcano bases and along fault lines, and these people have plenty information regarding natural disasters - yet they still remain and then blame god for not helping out when they get struck by an earthquake. Stupidity, if you ask me.
You'd have thought people would be smart enought to learn after the first eruption. My point is that it doesn't matter where you go, there are dangerous weather things, or volcanoes or earthquakes that might happen.
I had no idea that cancer could be "evil"
AK4
Well-Known Member
That or people could bother learning something for once and try to understand what the concept of supernatural evil entails with trying to associate with God, or a supernatural good.
On the way to learning that, they can stop by and understand the concept of equivocation.
And then maybe then can understand the asinine intellect it takes to equivocate the concept of a force of evil in the universe to that of trying to explain why puppies have to die.
Then they can dig deeper and realize that the society that brought forth those religious concepts fully understood the concept of suffering and they can also realize that the Bible deals directly with the concept of human suffering, human suffering is not evil and perhaps they can actually hold an intelligent discussion for once.
Flip through a thesaurus.
edit: Of course, I am an atheist so my comments can just be dismissed.
Or then maybe they can understand the asinine intellect it takes to equivocate the concept of evolution and the like --that life just sprouted out of nothing, without an intelligent being keeping everything within laws and such that cant be broken. That somehow since an almight being is not seen right now doesnt exist, like how mankind could see atoms back in history so atoms didnt exist either.
Then they can dig deeper and realize that the society of scientists like Darwin is maybe on to something where things just mutated and mutated til we are where we at today and somehow everything mutated to the good side and no one and no animal ended up with a eyeball on their foot. Then they can realize that with their science "bibles" they can have an intelligence that can never prove ANYTHING THAT TAKE GOD OUT OF THE EQUATION. But it makes them feel they can have an intelligent coversation with someone who knows you cant take GOD OF OUT ANYTHING, but what they dont realize is God doesnt mind this. It was his purpose for them to be this way and thats why He...
Ro 11:8 ....gave them a spirit of stupor, eyes so that they could not see and ears so that they could not hear, to this very day."
---ps I am believer so what i say to you, you can dismiss.
Jeremiah
Well-Known Member
“Some people love daytime soaps”
The soaps was intended to be a joke.
“Some people think flinging live kittens is fun”
Regardless of what some people think that does not make throwing kittens into traffic right. Do you really approve of this action?
“Hitler thought killing a whole lot of people was "good". Many people agreed. Many people disagreed. How can anyone say it was one or the other way, and be certain that they're right.”
“Hitler thought”
I would never base my understanding of morality on what “Hitler thought”.
“Many people agreed. Many people disagreed. How can anyone say it was one or the other way, and be certain that they're right.”
People can be quite stupid from time to time. I agree there however that does not place them on the side of being morally good. It only makes them human and acceptable to error. Simply because the terrorist of 9 – 11 thought they were in the just that does not make their attack a good deed. To be morally good compliance with and compassion for other souls is needed. The ability to recognize between what is good and what is evil rest in out ability to reason combined with our capacity for compassion. And while morality may not always be black and white that does not mean it is non existent.
“We have all the tools we need to make an informed decision about living in a place without volcanoes, or without earthquakes or without flooding. How do you know that those tools weren't god-inspired? Wouldn't that count as "helping out"? You see - people ask god for many things, but the reply is either ignored, misunderstood, or people just simply don't listen out for a reply. Some people go so far as to get a reply, but then disagree with it and do their own things anyway. But people are living on volcano bases and along fault lines, and these people have plenty information regarding natural disasters - yet they still remain and then blame god for not helping out when they get struck by an earthquake. Stupidity, if you ask me.”
“We have all the tools we need to make an informed decision about living in a place”
We have some tools now but that was not always the case.
“How do you know that those tools weren't god-inspired?”
How do you know they were God inspired?
“Wouldn't that count as "helping out"?”
Well gee it was so nice of him to be so speedy about it.
“You see - people ask god for many things, but the reply is either ignored, misunderstood, or people just simply don't listen out for a reply”
Or perhaps there simply are no gods listening and everything we have achieved has been by our own hands.
“But people are living on volcano bases and along fault lines, and these people have plenty information regarding natural disasters - yet they still remain and then blame god for not helping out when they get struck by an earthquake. Stupidity, if you ask me.”
Not everyone has the means to move. Remember the children? Beside nowhere is completely safe from Mother Nature.
“I had no idea that cancer could be "evil"”
It is even more evil than the AK-47.
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