Many many Chariot wheels found at bottom of Red sea.

[walt]

There is no proof nor objective evidence for the many conflicting beliefs in God from the human perspective of the existence or nature of God.

Exactly see what I told you, these conversations go absolutely nowhere, sorry to waste your time.

 

[shunyadragon]

Why not? You have failed again to explain your comments.

So how many times would it take to show you other specific sets of three words:

Like: "And the earth shall hear the corn, and the wine, and the oil; and they shall hear Jezreel".

And show you their overlap with what I have been previously showing.

Observe the corn:

Like the Cattle and the Corn are as one:
"The seven good kine are seven years; and the seven good ears are seven years: the dream is one".

Just as the Corn is as the sand of the Sea:
"And Joseph gathered corn as the sand of the sea, very much, until he left numbering; for it was without number".

Corn - Oil - Wine
Red - Purple - Blue
Sea - River - Stream
Cattle - Goat - Sheep
Brass - Silver - Gold

Above you can see corn is overlapping what I have been showing you in bold. It is another verification of the simple fact.

Are you really not able to understand the speech of overlapping sets of threes? It is very simple.

Consider if you cant even hear the words being said then everything you could ever show to disprove the words would be irrelevant. All your evidence would be useless and you would have to rethink the words from square one.

So how many times will it take to show you the overlapping sets of words are not just coincidence and are in the direction of author intent?

As many times as anyone wanted to play the game, but not coherent nor meaningful for the subject of the thread.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

It seems like on this forum you can't even use the word [ the ] without a debate?

If someone claims something, others expect that person to back it up with evidence and logical reasoning in an attempt to convince them of the validity of the claim.

I bought a black 1969 Dodge Charger RT/SE is a claim. It is one of the greatest muscle cars ever made. Another claim.

I could produce evidence that I bought the car by showing it was offered for sale. Pictures of the car including me. A title. The VIN. All that would be convincing evidence I bought the car and that can be shared.

For the second claim, I could show the popularity of the particular model, original sales figures, the estimated numbers of the car still operating, current resale figures, current values, performance statistics in comparison to similar models from the same era and so forth. All evidence that can be shared and demonstrating the validity of my claim. This one could have counter claims expressing the superiority of other models. Of course, in my opinion they would likely be wrong.

When it comes to belief, even if one has claims of personal experiences, these can only be discussed and not demonstrated. How do you share with a person that doesn't already believe what you alone feel you experienced? That's the conundrum and the difficulty with religious claims. Unless you already believe and are willing to accept another believers claims on faith, there isn't really anything there to examine either.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

I have been on this forum for over 6 months, You and I both know that these conversations go absolutely nowhere!

That is often true, but they are not completely empty either. I have learned a lot here.

 

[walt]

If someone claims something, others expect that person to back it up with evidence and logical reasoning in an attempt to convince them of the validity of the claim.

I bought a black 1969 Dodge Charger RT/SE is a claim. It is one of the greatest muscle cars ever made. Another claim.

I could produce evidence that I bought the car by showing it was offered for sale. Pictures of the car including me. A title. The VIN. All that would be convincing evidence I bought the car and that can be shared.

For the second claim, I could show the popularity of the particular model, original sales figures, the estimate numbers of the car still operating, current resale figures, current values, performance statistics in comparison to similar models from the same era and so forth. All evidence that can be shared and demonstrating the validity of my claim. This one could have counter claims expressing the superiority of other models. Of course, in my opinion they would likely be wrong.

When it comes to belief, even if one has claims of personal experiences, these can only be discussed and not demonstrated. How do you share with a person that doesn't already believe what you alone feel you experienced? That's the conundrum and the difficulty with religious claims. Unless you already believe and are willing to accept another believers claims on faith, there isn't really anything there to examine either.

God is spoken about in the Bible over 8,000 times, and I have to debate about God. The sky is blue and I'm not going to debate about that either.

 

[walt]

That is often true, but they are not completely empty either. I have learned a lot here.

I see you're point really I do, I just don't like all the endless debating.

 

[shunyadragon]

If someone claims something, others expect that person to back it up with evidence and logical reasoning in an attempt to convince them of the validity of the claim.

I bought a black 1969 Dodge Charger RT/SE is a claim. It is one of the greatest muscle cars ever made. Another claim.

I had to cut the wheel well to change the spark plugs and put in a removable panel., Have fun.

I prefer the 2025 Ford Mustang Dark Horse it handles better.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Sorry I see your point, but I don't want to debate on every little word. There is so many words in the Bible if I debate each little word, wouldn't it take forever to learn anything?

I agree. Sometimes it is the significance of particular words that make them worth debating, while others don't bear that. But yes, I understand that having everything picked apart can be tiresome and cumbersome.

The Bible is a book that must be interpreted and everyone or group that is interested in it has their own interpretations. Many consider their particular interpretation to be definitive. I don't agree with that position and haven't seen anyone demonstrate it sufficiently or soundly.

Don't get discouraged. You don't have to address everything that is fired at you. Often there is something to be learned by just listening or in this case reading. I'm no saint when it comes to this and I have also been the victim of it. Most often by those claiming to be as Christian as I. In many I believe they think they are true Christians and I am not and all based on their chosen ideology and interpretations.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

God is spoken about in the Bible over 8,000 times, and I have to debate about God. The sky is blue and I'm not going to debate about that either.

If it were me, I would state my position based on faith and belief and not worry about word counts or what others believe about my belief. I tend to involve myself in arguments over material issues in large part and it is often easy to see who doesn't really have a clue in those.

I can't show people that believe in Thor that he doesn't exist. I accept that they believe and leave it at that. If I found it worthwhile to express my beliefs I would. Though often I find those that demand to know appear to be demanding explanation with bad intent.

 

[walt]

I agree. Sometimes it is the significance of particular words that make them worth debating, while others don't bear that. But yes, I understand that having everything picked apart can be tiresome and cumbersome.

The Bible is a book that must be interpreted and everyone or group that is interested in it has their own interpretations. Many consider their particular interpretation to be definitive. I don't agree with that position and haven't seen anyone demonstrate it sufficiently or soundly.

Don't get discouraged. You don't have to address everything that is fired at you. Often there is something to be learned by just listening or in this case reading. I'm no saint when it comes to this and I have also been the victim of it. Most often by those claiming to be as Christian as I. In many I believe they think they are true Christians and I am not and all based on their chosen ideology and interpretations.

Thanks for the advice I listen to every word, My take on interpretation is a little different, I feel some scriptures are superior to others, Please let me explain.

Jesus says his disciples are granted understanding, and Jesus will speak to them about all things in private.

Jesus says but to everyone else I speak in parables and those seeing they will not see and though hearing they will not hear and understand.

I use every word Jesus speaks to help guide me to understand other things he says which are harder to understand.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

I see you're point really I do, I just don't like all the endless debating.

There are discussion only areas or DIR's. Have you tried those? You have to be careful discussion only threads. I know I do. Sometimes I jump in without checking to find out. You don't want to debate in those per the rules. You may find them worthwhile. There may be like-minded people there and you may find more appealing conversations.

I don't know where you are from, but in the US, we have a long history of very vigorous debating. Sometimes it is fruitful. Sometimes frustrating. Sometime thought provoking. Sometimes it goes no where. It is a gamble in that sense.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Thanks for the advice I listen to every word, My take on interpretation is a little different, I feel some scriptures are superior to others, Please let me explain.

Jesus says his disciples are granted understanding, and Jesus will speak to them about all things in private.

Jesus says but to everyone else I speak in parables and those seeing they will not see and though hearing they will not hear and understand.

I use every word Jesus speaks to help guide me to understand other things he says which are harder to understand.

Thank you for sharing your methods of interpretation. I am not an expert in the Bible by any means. Merely another pilgrim trying find his way. Personally, I think a lot of it was written at a time when we were less informed and that has to be taken into account. Like explaining to a child that touching the stove will hurt without going into the details of the physics of ovens or biology of pain perception. If that makes any sense.

 

[walt]

Also some scriptures If you look at 100 different translations the meaning remains the same, I believe these scriptures are revealing the original teaching.

Some scriptures are translated 10 different ways like John 1:18 or John 1:1

 

[walt]

Could I ask you a question?

 

[YoursTrue]

Man buzz off. I was real mean to the last old man who tried this bs on me so I’m trying not to be mean again.

I will just say that I will outlive you and I bet you will be worried on your death bed, wondering if the heaven you believe in is real or not. You will think perhaps there is nothing waiting for me after death. And you will not be able to assuage the fear of nothingness. What lies after death? I dunno, but I know you are going to find out first old man. When that time comes, I wonder if you will feel the fear that you are trying to subject me to.

just curious since you mentioned fear that the poster is trying to subject you to. What fear is that, did the poster say what fear that is?

 

[walt]

Would you be interested to see if interpretations is really an issue?

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Could I ask you a question?

If that is directed at me, you can ask. I'll consider it. I won't tell you I will answer no matter what. I may have questions of my own.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Would you be interested to see if interpretations is really an issue?

I believe they are. And I believe that different doctrines confound the issue. I have experienced that from among others claiming to be Christian and steadfast in their personal belief that they are the one true Christians and all others are not. I can't make that judgement. I only have the word of others to go on and don't speak for God as some seem to imply they might.

 

[walt]

I believe they are. And I believe that different doctrines confound the issue. I have experienced that from among others claiming to be Christian and steadfast in their personal belief that they are the one true Christians and all others are not. I can't make that judgement. I only have the word of others to go on and don't speak for God as some seem to imply they might.

I would like to give it a try If you are up for it, You pick the Bible subject and we will both look up scriptures we feel explain the Bible subject.

For example you find 10 scriptures and I find 10 scriptures.........Then we custom form a belief a belief according to what all 20 scriptures say.

None of our own ideas at first, Just keep it simple scriptural.......We take a little bit from all 20 scriptures to form a belief that is 100% scriptural and 0% our own ideas.

 

[WonderingWorrier]

As many times as anyone wanted to play the game, but not coherent nor meaningful for the subject of the thread.

I am explaining the subject of the Red Sea. Please try to listen.

The subject is also proof of the Exodus. I can show the Exodus works the same way like this:

Here is a set of three words:
"For they were departed from Rephidim, and were come to the desert of Sinai, and had pitched in the wilderness; and there Israel camped before the mount".

Desert - Wilderness - Mountain

Which overlaps with what I have previously shown:

Desert - Wilderness - Mountain
Corn - Oil - Wine
Red - Purple - Blue
Sea - River - Stream
Cattle - Goat - Sheep
Brass - Silver - Gold

Like the Bible mentions the desert of the sea.
The burden of the desert of the sea. As whirlwinds in the south pass through; so it cometh from the desert, from a terrible land.

Look:

Desert - Wilderness - Mountain
Corn - Oil - Wine
Red - Purple - Blue
Sea - River - Stream
Cattle - Goat - Sheep
Brass - Silver - Gold

And the Cattle in the Desert.
"Also he built towers in the desert, and digged many wells: for he had much cattle, both in the low country, and in the plains: husbandmen also, and vine dressers in the mountains, and in Carmel: for he loved husbandry".

Look:

Desert - Wilderness - Mountain
Corn - Oil - Wine
Red - Purple - Blue
Sea - River - Stream
Cattle - Goat - Sheep
Brass - Silver - Gold


There are cattle in the desert, just as there are grape vines in the mountains.
"Also he built towers in the desert, and digged many wells: for he had much cattle, both in the low country, and in the plains: husbandmen also, and vine dressers in the mountains, and in Carmel: for he loved husbandry".

Look:

Desert - Wilderness - Mountain
Corn - Oil - Wine
Red - Purple - Blue
Sea - River - Stream
Cattle - Goat - Sheep
Brass - Silver - Gold

Do you still think that is not coherent or meaningful to the subject of the thread?
Finding any physical evidence of the exodus is irrelevant if you cant even hear what you are looking for.


Edit:
As I have already shown corn in the desert, and wine in the mountains I should probably also show the oil in the wilderness:

"I will plant in the wilderness the cedar, the ****tah tree, and the myrtle, and the oil tree; I will set in the desert the fir tree, and the pine, and the box tree together".

So you can see the full overlap is verifiable. The corn, the oil, and the wine with the desert, the wilderness and the mountain.

Desert - Wilderness - Mountain
Corn - Oil - Wine