Return of Christ

[InChrist]

The breaking off of the different groups shows that they had problems with Paul. And of course we have verses telling us so.


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There are no verses that say the apostles had problems with Paul. Maybe those who were false teachers, deviating from the gospel, had problems and split off into different groups, but not the apostles.

 

[Desert Snake]

You think you can make up your own tradition? and then call me out for actually using the texts?


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Huh? The idea that Jesus is God is the traditional belief of Christianity. You are the one presenting 'your own version' of Christianity, not me.

What do you think the trinity is? Why do you think it's called 'monotheism'?
What do you think Oneness Doctrine is?


And yet you claim to know so much about Christianity. Something isn't adding up here.

 

[Call_of_the_Wild]

Nothing you have said, changes a single thing that I have said.

You are right, nothing I said changes just a "single" thing you said...what I said changes EVERYTHING you said.

We have verses proving they didn't trust him.

Wrong. We have verses stating that they didn't trust him AT FIRST. Big difference.

Acts 9:26-28
"When he (Paul) came to Jersalem, he tried to join the disciples, but they were all afraid of him, not believing he was really a disciples. BUT Barnabas took him and brought him to the APOSTLES. He told them how Saul on his journey had seen the Lord and that the Lord and spoken to him, and how in Damascus he had preached fearlessly in the name of Jesus. So Paul stayed with them and moved about freely in Jersalem, speaking bodly in the name of the Lord."

Now, what part of that don't you understand? At first, they didn't believe he was a disciple, and they were judging him based on his past..but they eventually believed and accepted him, because his actions spoke for itself.

What part of that don't you understand, Ingle?

And I'm guessing with good reason.

Yeah, there was a good reason they didn't believe him at first. He was a former Christian skeptic and persecuter. Again, for the third time, what part of that don't you understand?

 

[Call_of_the_Wild]

There are no verses that say the apostles had problems with Paul. Maybe those who were false teachers, deviating from the gospel, had problems and split off into different groups, but not the apostles.

Exactly. I'd like her to show me a verse after Acts 9:30 at which the apostles had problems with Paul.

 

[sojourner]

I think it is becoming clear that God's kingdom is coming to earth soon and many of the biblical signs for the return of Jesus Christ to are in place and others are rapidly continuing to occur. Does anyone else sense the nearness of His return?


For He is coming, for He is coming to judge the earth. He shall judge the world with righteousness, And the peoples with His truth. Psalm 96:13


lBirth Pangs - ABC's of Prophecy

I think it's becoming clearer that God's kingdom is already present, but not in the people, places, or institutions, particularly, where we've been led to think.

 

[InChrist]

I think it's becoming clearer that God's kingdom is already present, but not in the people, places, or institutions, particularly, where we've been led to think.

I believe in the literal kingdom of God, where Jesus is Kings of Kings and will be ruling this world from Jerusalem, Israel. I don't believe this kingdom is present on the earth at this time, except of course in a spiritual sense in the hearts and minds of those who are born again and belong to Jesus Christ. So I continue to pray as Jesus instructed His disciples... Our Father in heaven, Hallowed be Your name. Your kingdom come... Matthew 6:9

 

[sojourner]

I believe in the literal kingdom of God, where Jesus is Kings of Kings and will be ruling this world from Jerusalem, Israel. I don't believe this kingdom is present on the earth at this time, except of course in a spiritual sense in the hearts and minds of those who are born again and belong to Jesus Christ. So I continue to pray as Jesus instructed His disciples... Our Father in heaven, Hallowed be Your name. Your kingdom come... Matthew 6:9

This is dispensationalism and imperialism at its pinnacle.

 

[Ingledsva]

You think you can make up your own tradition? and then call me out for actually using the texts?

Huh? The idea that Jesus is God is the traditional belief of Christianity. You are the one presenting 'your own version' of Christianity, not me.

What do you think the trinity is? Why do you think it's called 'monotheism'?
What do you think Oneness Doctrine is?


And yet you claim to know so much about Christianity. Something isn't adding up here.

Actually the Bible doesn't say Jesus is God, or that there is a trinity.

Jesus as God is later tradition. It does not have to be believed.

A "Christian" can just follow the Christian Bible, and assume Jesus is the awaited Messiah.

Obviously - even today - not all Christian denominations believe Jesus is God.



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[Ingledsva]

You are right, nothing I said changes just a "single" thing you said...what I said changes EVERYTHING you said.



Wrong. We have verses stating that they didn't trust him AT FIRST. Big difference.

Acts 9:26-28
"When he (Paul) came to Jersalem, he tried to join the disciples, but they were all afraid of him, not believing he was really a disciples. BUT Barnabas took him and brought him to the APOSTLES. He told them how Saul on his journey had seen the Lord and that the Lord and spoken to him, and how in Damascus he had preached fearlessly in the name of Jesus. So Paul stayed with them and moved about freely in Jersalem, speaking bodly in the name of the Lord."

Now, what part of that don't you understand? At first, they didn't believe he was a disciple, and they were judging him based on his past..but they eventually believed and accepted him, because his actions spoke for itself.

What part of that don't you understand, Ingle?



Yeah, there was a good reason they didn't believe him at first. He was a former Christian skeptic and persecuter. Again, for the third time, what part of that don't you understand?

What part of break-away groups don't you understand?



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[InChrist]

This is dispensationalism and imperialism at its pinnacle.

Call it whatever you like, I call it biblical...

Then the seventh angel sounded: And there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, and He shall reign forever and ever!” Revelation 11:15

 

[Pegg]

It was Paul who stood up, on a fake vision, in the name of Christ; and the Christians who do everything and pray "in the name of Jesus" or "through Jesus Christ our Lord," or "In the Name of Christ" and so on and so forth.

Hence Paul is the seed of Anti-Christ and modern Christianity- a full blown and full bloomed mythical tree on creeds invented by Paul and the Church and its priests is the Anti-Christ, Jesus talked about.

Of course one could differ with me with or without reasons and arguments.

Regards

the apostles of Jesus did not view Paul that way. They knew that Pauls vision on the road to damascus was true because Christ also appeared to the disciple Ananias to tell him about it and he sent him to Paul.

How the Apostles felt about Paul is quite clearly seen from the things they wrote about him, ie:

2 Peter 3:15 Furthermore, consider the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote you according to the wisdom given him, 16 speaking about these things as he does in all his letters. However, some things in them are hard to understand, and these things the ignorant and unstable are twisting, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.

 

[Pegg]

Is it ok to disagree with Paul?
Or must Paul be accepted as infallible ?

I don't think Paul was bad per say. I think he did what he thought was right. I just don't agree with some of his ideals.

So say a person agrees with Jesus but finds reason to disagree with some of Paul's teachings, would that person still receive salvation.

I think I agree though, Paul elevates Jesus to divinity. Eliminate Paul and Jesus becomes a Rabbi.

Paul calls Jesus the 'son of God'

That is exactly what all the Apostles said of Jesus. Do you have any scriptures from Pauls writings which you think Paul deifies Jesus?

 

[Pegg]

LOL! I think if the disciples questioned what the "follower's of Jesus killer" who grabbed control - "with a supposed vision on the road," - was teaching, - so can others then, and today.



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what a strange comment ???

Why do you think Paul is Jesus killer?

 

[Pegg]

LOL! And where does that say they agreed with him?


They are astonished that the creep chasing them is claiming a vision giving him control.


Winning over Damascus Jews doesn't mean he fooled the disciples.


A few verses later we get this -


Act 9:26 And when Saul was come to Jerusalem, he assayed to join himself to the disciples: but they were all afraid of him, and believed not that he was a disciple.


Act 9:29 And he spake boldly in the name of the Lord Jesus, and disputed against the Grecians: but they went about to slay him.

Act 9:30 Which when the brethren knew, they brought him down to Caesarea, and sent him forth to Tarsus.



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you are taking these verses way out of context.

Act 9:26 was just after his conversion and the disciples in Judah didnt know about it so were rightly afraid of him. He was formerly the persecutor of them.... but if you keep going in that passage you see that they did accept him and took them in among themselves.

Acts 9:26 'On arriving in Jerusalem, he made efforts to join the disciples, but they were all afraid of him, because they did not believe he was a disciple. 27 So Bar′na·bas came to his aid and led him to the apostles, and he told them in detail how on the road he had seen the Lord, and that he had spoken to him, and how in Damascus he had spoken boldly in the name of Jesus. 28 So he remained with them, moving about freely in Jerusalem, speaking boldly in the name of the Lord.

29 He was talking and disputing with the Greek-speaking Jews, but these made attempts to do away with him.

30 When the brothers found out about this, they brought him down to Caes·a·re′a and sent him off to Tarsus.

It was the jews who were trying to kill Paul, and it was the Christians who protected him by getting him out of Jerusalem and of to Tarsus safely.

 

[Pegg]

The "Hellenists" That tried to KILL him, - are the converts among the Jews who had returned to Judea.


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a christian would not have tried to kill anyone. Being a christian meant to put down your sword and follow Christ in the spirit of love.

It was the Jews who were trying to kill him, not the christians.

 

[Ingledsva]

a christian would not have tried to kill anyone. Being a christian meant to put down your sword and follow Christ in the spirit of love.

It was the Jews who were trying to kill him, not the christians.

This group was Christian.



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[psychoslice]

The second coming of the Christ has already happened in my life, it was realizing that my true self is in fact is the Christ, just as everyone else's self is.

 

[Ingledsva]

LOL! I think if the disciples questioned what the "follower's of Jesus killer" who grabbed control - "with a supposed vision on the road," - was teaching, - so can others then, and today.

what a strange comment ???

Why do you think Paul is Jesus killer?

No-no-no! "FOLLOWERS" of Jesus killer.


As Saul he tracked down abused , imprisoned, and killed Christians, before his supposed "vision" on the road - and take over of the Christian group.



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[Pegg]

This group was Christian.



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no, they were jews according to the biblical account.

Vs 29 He was talking and disputing with the Greek-speaking Jews, but these made attempts to do away with him.

 

[Pegg]

No-no-no! "FOLLOWERS" of Jesus killer.


As Saul he tracked down abused , imprisoned, and killed Christians, before his supposed "vision" on the road - and take over of the Christian group.



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Yes, he did persecute christians. But he didnt kill Jesus.