Richard Dawkins hasn't read the Quran yet.

[Caladan]

I just presented Duke as an example and you can see how that affected you and the others.

No. You have been using Duke's video consistently when discussing the evils of Jews. Long before this thread, please be honest.
In fact, only three days ago you posted one of David Duke's videos in this thread: http://www.religiousforums.com/foru...tics/156548-al-qaida-terrorism-lebanon-5.html

I said from the beginning that it is childish to accuse one religion as being evil.

And yet you copy past passages from the Talmud that present Jews as evil conspirators on regular basis, how does that work for you? What is it, double standards? Hypocrisy? Or simply general dishonesty?

So I don't agree that any religion is evil and even atheism can't be described as evil, that is silly and I am wondering how an educated person (as Dawkins)speaks in such a stupid way.

Given, Dawkins' academic credentials are in biology and not the history of Islam, however he is far more constructive since he is criticizing real events in his country and around the world, events which are debated daily and which everyone including Dawkins have an opinion about. When Dawkins would have an in depth debate about the Qur'an itself with an academic I would make sure to double check his arguments.

 

[FearGod]

No. You have been using Duke's video consistently when discussing the evils of Jews. Long before this thread, please be honest.
In fact, only three days ago you posted one of David Duke's videos in this thread: http://www.religiousforums.com/foru...tics/156548-al-qaida-terrorism-lebanon-5.html
And yet you copy past passages from the Talmud that present Jews as evil conspirators on regular basis, how does that work for you? What is it, double standards? Hypocrisy? Or simply general dishonesty?

Yes I posted Duke's video and passages from the Talmud but I said that isn't a reason to say Judaism is evil.

Given, Dawkins' academic credentials are in biology and not the history of Islam, however he is far more constructive since he is criticizing real events in his country and around the world, events which are debated daily and which everyone including Dawkins have an opinion about. When Dawkins would have an in depth debate about the Qur'an itself with an academic I would make sure to double check his arguments.

Do you agree with him that Islam is evil ?
yes or No

 

[Caladan]

Yes I posted Duke's video and passages from the Talmud but I said that isn't a reason to say Judaism is evil.

Uh huh. The irony of the sentence above is astounding.

Do you agree with him that Islam is evil ?
yes or No

This isn't the title nor course of debate, do not stray off topic.

 

[FearGod]

Uh huh. The irony of the sentence above is astounding.

Your comment is astounding. :sarcastic

This isn't the title nor course of debate, do not stray off topic.

Oh Sorry, Staff ... your forgiveness :bow:
I promise to keep on topic

My question is about the OP

Do you agree with Dawkin that Islam is evil without reading the quran in depth or I may add is it rational to accuse one religion or belief to be satanic?

Hope my question is on topic now and if not then you can delete it or neglect it.

 

[Caladan]

Your comment is astounding. :sarcastic

Only to the untrained eye.

Oh Sorry, Staff ... your forgiveness :bow:
I promise to keep on topic

How very dramatic. :clap

My question is about the OP

Do you agree with Dawkin that Islam is evil without reading the quran in depth or I may add is it rational to accuse one religion or belief to be satanic?

Lets review your conduct since joining this forum.
You consistently and repeatedly displayed Jews as evil by copy pasting passages which were taken out of context from the Talmud.
You post videos by anti-Semitic white supremacists as a source about the global evils of Jews.
You obviously have never set and read the Talmud thoroughly in the comfort of your home or in a library, yet you blindly quote mine 'evil' passages from it regularly.

So in fact you have been blaming Jews for various evils in many threads without actually reading their texts by yourself. Not only that but you quote mine a Jewish text from Late Antiquity as if it had any relevant to debates about contemporary politics, which clearly demonstrates your mentality that whatever the issue is Jews have an ancient inheritance of evil which taints anything they may be involved in.
And then you have the audacity to lecture people about Richard Dawkins, the Qur'an, and Muslims.
Answer to your own standards first.

 

[FearGod]

Only to the untrained eye.

That was the reason for using :sarcastic

How very dramatic. :clap

Better if with frubals

Lets review your conduct since joining this forum.
You consistently and repeatedly displayed Jews as evil by copy pasting passages which were taken out of context from the Talmud.
You post videos by anti-Semitic white supremacists as a source about the global evils of Jews.
You obviously have never set and read the Talmud thoroughly in the comfort of your home or in a library, yet you blindly quote mine 'evil' passages from it regularly.

I have repeated it multiple times that I sourced Duke as an example to understand that if one person said Jews are evils or Muslims are evils, Judaism is evil or Islam is evil without fully understanding their beliefs then it is a silly and disgusting decision, but you are insisting to understand my point as if I am accusing Judaism as evil, please read my posts carefully to understand my point for my comparison.

Also English is my 2nd language which maybe was a reason that you and the others misunderstood my points and views, but I am trying hardly to improve it and I hope this forum will help me to gain some skills in this wonderful language.

So in fact you have been blaming Jews for various evils in many threads without actually reading their texts by yourself. Not only that but you quote mine a Jewish text from Late Antiquity as if it had any relevant to debates about contemporary politics, which clearly demonstrates your mentality that whatever the issue is Jews have an ancient inheritance of evil which taints anything they may be involved in.
And then you have the audacity to lecture people about Richard Dawkins, the Qur'an, and Muslims.
Answer to your own standards first.

WOW, i am here to accuse the Jews of being evils in many threads. :areyoucra
I am afraid you are planning for infraction or restriction and searching for a reason for that, but I said it frankly that I don't accuse any belief to be an evil whatever their belief is. i do respect every ones belief.

I replied a question by Sees and I said that ((To say one religion is evil looks to me childish and unscientific))

 

[Caladan]

I have repeated it multiple times that I sourced Duke as an example to understand that if one person said Jews are evils or Muslims are evils, Judaism is evil or Islam is evil without fully understanding their beliefs then it is a silly and disgusting decision, but you are insisting to understand my point as if I am accusing Judaism as evil, please read my posts carefully to understand my point for my comparison.

Your words in this very thread:

Why he didn't say Judaism is the greatest evil and the Talmud teachings is a great evidence for it.

Then you went on to quote mine the Talmud. You have used this tactic many times before, copy pasting passages from the Talmud. Not as an example of bad criticism of Judaism, but as proof of the evil ideology Jews supposedly follow.

 

[FearGod]

Your words in this very thread:

Why he didn't say Judaism is the greatest evil and the Talmud teachings is a great evidence for it.

Please note that I said "Why he didn't say"

So I am only referring to the Talmud's teachings as a reason to accuse ones belief which I made it clear to be a childish decision to accuse ones belief because some phrases in the Talmud or for ones opinion as Duke in my example.

So your anger and some others proves my point that it is silly to accuse ones belief to be evil without fully understanding their religion.

So,yes I agree that Dukes and Dawkens were absolutely wrong for accusing Islam and Judaism as a result of reading one statement in the Talmud or in the quran.

I don't ask you to defend Islam as you defend Judaism but for me I insist that no religion whatsoever is evil, i regard it to be rudeness.

Then you went on to quote mine the Talmud. You have used this tactic many times before, copy pasting passages from the Talmud. Not as an example of bad criticism of Judaism, but as proof of the evil ideology Jews supposedly follow.

Still not getting my point.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

I don't ask you to defend Islam as you defend Judaism but for me I insist that no religion whatsoever is evil, i regard it to be rudeness.

Taking both Islam and Judaism out of the picture for a moment, why do you think that no religion can be evil?

 

[Looncall]

I don't ask you to defend Islam as you defend Judaism but for me I insist that no religion whatsoever is evil, i regard it to be rudeness.

Do you think that human sacrifice is ok if it is part of a religion?

Do you really think that all, or any, religions should get a free pass regardless of the harm they cause?

 

[FearGod]

Taking both Islam and Judaism out of the picture for a moment, why do you think that no religion can be evil?

Evil is Evil, it isn't a religion, a system or a culture.

The religion is one for one community but you can see bad and good among the same community regardless of religion.

So I don't think it is wise to accuse one community or religion as Evil.

 

[FearGod]

Do you think that human sacrifice is ok if it is part of a religion?

There is no religion asking for human sacrifice and if there is one then i'll say that religion is a b***sh**.

Do you really think that all, or any, religions should get a free pass regardless of the harm they cause?

As I said it isn't the religion to be blamed but it depends on individuals.

God won't punish us according to what is our society but according to each one of us.

For example let me assume that my country law permits me to kill without any punishment then is that enough reason for me to kill.

So it depends on individuals and not religion or society, culture ..etc.

It isn't sort of blind faith, that is kind of nonsense, for example if my religion asked me to jump from a high mountain then should I do so.

In few words bad and good is in us as individuals and not to blame a whole religion or society for it.

 

[Triumphant_Loser]

There is no religion asking for human sacrifice and if there is one then i'll say that religion is a b***sh**.

100. "O my Lord! Grant me a righteous (son)!"
101. So We gave him the good news of a forbearing son.
102. Then, when (the son) reached (the age of) (serious) work with him, he said: "O my son! I have seen in a vision that I offer thee in sacrifice: now see what is thy view!" (The son) said: "O my father! Do as thou art commanded: thou will find me, if Allah so wills, one of the steadfast!"
103. So when they had both submitted (to Allah), and he had laid him prostrate on his forehead (for sacrifice)
Quran~37:100-103

 

[Godobeyer]

No. It isn't.

Islam is a religion.

Qur'an is a book.

Those are completely two different things.

it's not big deal
there is no different for me , if he pre-judging Quran or he pre-judging Islam , that's same for me .

? That sentence doesn't make sense.

If you make that poor comparison, then you are "prejudging" Dawkins with not reading his books. It has to go both ways. You can't eat the cake and have it too.

Awwwwwwwwww , I repeat this thread is about his comment in twitter , not about the credibilty of his books .

even he is good book writer (maybe he is an ideal person for somebody), he not suppose to had bad prejudge in anything.

 

[FearGod]

100. "O my Lord! Grant me a righteous (son)!"
101. So We gave him the good news of a forbearing son.
102. Then, when (the son) reached (the age of) (serious) work with him, he said: "O my son! I have seen in a vision that I offer thee in sacrifice: now see what is thy view!" (The son) said: "O my father! Do as thou art commanded: thou will find me, if Allah so wills, one of the steadfast!"
103. So when they had both submitted (to Allah), and he had laid him prostrate on his forehead (for sacrifice)
Quran~37:100-103

That is a prophet and not me, if I saw such vision for a million times I won't do it.

So what we understand from this verse, did we understand that we should kill our sons if we saw a dream.

God as a creator is showing us that he can order us to sacrifice one of whom we love, but he isn't that kind of God but he is a merciful one asking us for good deeds and not for bad ones.

That test is made for us to realize that God doesn't ask us for hardship but to do good things and he sent for us the cattles as a sacrifice instead which is a blessing of him.

Thus do We reward the good. (37:110)

 

[McBell]

That is a prophet and not me, if I saw such vision for a million times I won't do it.

So what we understand from this verse, did we understand that we should kill our sons if we saw a dream.

God as a creator is showing us that he can order us to sacrifice one of whom we love, but he isn't that kind of God but he is a merciful one asking us for good deeds and not for bad ones.

That test is made for us to realize that God doesn't ask us for hardship but to do good things and he sent for us the cattles as a sacrifice instead which is a blessing of him.

Thus do We reward the good. (37:110)

Kinda difficult to take you seriously now.

 

[Triumphant_Loser]

That is a prophet and not me, if I saw such vision for a million times I won't do it.

So what we understand from this verse, did we understand that we should kill our sons if we saw a dream.

God as a creator is showing us that he can order us to sacrifice one of whom we love, but he isn't that kind of God but he is a merciful one asking us for good deeds and not for bad ones.

That test is made for us to realize that God doesn't ask us for hardship but to do good things and he sent for us the cattles as a sacrifice instead which is a blessing of him.

Thus do We reward the good. (37:110)

I thought you said that any religion having to do with human sacrifice is bull-s***? Or do you just conveniently make an exception for your own religion just like everyone else does?

 

[Ouroboros]

it's not big deal
there is no different for me , if he pre-judging Quran or he pre-judging Islam , that's same for me .

Then Dakwins belief and Dawkins books are the same. You pre-judging Dawkins books or you pre-judging Dawkins, must be the same thing too, and should be the same to you.

Awwwwwwwwww , I repeat this thread is about his comment in twitter , not about the credibilty of his books .

And Dawkins is making a comment about something he's argued before in his books (because he's said these things in the past), and he's not arguing the credibility of the Qur'an.

even he is good book writer (maybe he is an ideal person for somebody), he not suppose to had bad prejudge in anything.

Even if you're a good person (maybe you're an ideal person for somebody), but you can't judge if someone is supposed to prejudge anything, especially not when you're prejuding someone by saying he or she can't prejudge. It's double standard. Perhaps you don't mind keeping a double standard, but at least admit that you do. I'm okay with someone being a hypocrite, as long as they admit that they are. I know I can be a bigot at times, but I try to see it and understand why I do. Honesty to anyone starts with honesty to yourself.

 

[FearGod]

I thought you said that any religion having to do with human sacrifice is bull-s***? Or do you just conveniently make an exception for your own religion just like everyone else does?

I'll agree with you if in a case that God let him sacrificed his own son, but he didn't.

That is the problem that we get one verse and make out of it a big issue.

Do you think such stories isn't weird even to the prophets themselves but that is indeed what had happened and then you have to think the way you wish.

You may think of it that God is awful or merciful.

For example the following verse looks weird even to the prophets themselves.

He is God, the Creator, the Maker, the Shaper. To Him belong the Names Most Beautiful. All that is in the heavens and the earth magnifies Him; He is the All-mighty, the All-wise. (59:24)

How everything in earth magnifies him ?

What about the inanimate ?

The prophets know that an inanimate can't talk or think and they know that people will think that they are fooling them by saying such a thing, so why do you think there is such a verse which I think that the prophets themselves can't explain it to the believers.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

it's not big deal
there is no different for me , if he pre-judging Quran or he pre-judging Islam , that's same for me .

So if somebody knows the effects of Islam, then they understand the Quran?

Awwwwwwwwww , I repeat this thread is about his comment in twitter , not about the credibilty of his books .

even he is good book writer (maybe he is an ideal person for somebody), he not suppose to had bad prejudge in anything.

The thread is about Dawkins' opinions about Islam. One short tweet can only give a small, imperfect glimpse into his opinion.

It's hypocritical to say that he needs to read the Quran to understand Islam, but you can understand his views from reading one 140-character tweet.