Don Penguinoini
Modi.
Seems a little soft, i normally try to maybe, stick some anthrax in there, and right, its jesus who made me do this, now thats EVIL..(muahahahahaha!)
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Satan's Claws (Santa Claus): Satanic Deception
- Thread starter FFH
- Start date
Seems a little soft, i normally try to maybe, stick some anthrax in there, and right, its jesus who made me do this, now thats EVIL..(muahahahahaha!)
DeepShadow
White Crow
FFH
Veteran Member
We, of course, don't know what they do in their private lives, and it's none of our business and wouldn't matter to our salvation anyway.
If they lied to their kids about Santa, then yes, that is definitely a sin in God's eyes, in which they will be held accountable for.
No man is perfect, not even our prophets and apostles, only Jesus Christ. Men sin, Christ atones for our sins we turn from, othewise we will suffer for our own sins, as Christ has suffered.
All sins must be repented of (turned from) in order to enter into God's presence.
3 Nephi 27: 19
And no unclean thing can enter into his kingdom; therefore nothing entereth into his rest save it be those who have washed their garments in my blood, because of their faith, and the repentance of all their sins, and their faithfulness unto the end.
Do you honestly think that any man is exempt from this requirement ???
No one is exempt, the Lord made this very clear to Joseph Smith, when he gave him a taste of what hell would be like if he wasn't faithful to the Lord's commands.
We, as LDS, are held much more accountable, because we know better.
DeepShadow
White Crow
DeepShadow
White Crow
FFH, you've accused me of twisting scripture, so please enlighten me: what does Alma 12:9 actually mean? Because I take it to mean that we are to keep personal revelations personal. If the Lord tells me that, say, I'm not supposed to eat meat anymore, then that applies to me, but I have no place pushing it on others.
Please explain this scripture to me.
Please explain this scripture to me.
DeepShadow
White Crow
Yeah, I was especially impressed by the one in which President Monson said that the little girl excited about Santa Claus had the spirit of Christmas.
"As Santa Claus came by, she waved her little hand toward him. He smiled and waved back to her and to everyone else in the crowd.
The little girl grabbed the hair of that big fellow and exclaimed, “He saw me! He saw me and smiled at me! I’m so glad it’s Christmas!” That little girl had the Christmas spirit." (emphasis mine)
FFH, President Monson said this in a church magazine. Are you saying he was inspired to write those words by the spirit of Satan?
Please bear in mind, I'm not attacking your personal revelation that you should not continue this tradition. I'm attacking your presumption that you speak for the Lord to all of us.
"As Santa Claus came by, she waved her little hand toward him. He smiled and waved back to her and to everyone else in the crowd.
The little girl grabbed the hair of that big fellow and exclaimed, “He saw me! He saw me and smiled at me! I’m so glad it’s Christmas!” That little girl had the Christmas spirit." (emphasis mine)
FFH, President Monson said this in a church magazine. Are you saying he was inspired to write those words by the spirit of Satan?
Please bear in mind, I'm not attacking your personal revelation that you should not continue this tradition. I'm attacking your presumption that you speak for the Lord to all of us.
FFH
Veteran Member
Deepshadow, I'm not going to even touch your comments concerning the leaders of our church, that's just dangerous territory to venture into. I would never speak against any leader of our church. Like I said it's none of my business whether they have lied to their kids about Santa, and we don't know this much detail about their lives. No Ensign article or Conference report would discuss such a thing. I don't care if they've mentioned Santa in their talks, tell me if they've lied to their kids about Santa or not. NO ONE KNOWS this kind of detail about their lives and I could care less whether they've lied to their kids about Santa or not. All I care about is that they keep the church moving progressively forward the best they know how. That's all the Lord asks of them. The rest of this stuff will work itself out.
I'm not here to judge any leader of the church, only here to educate and share my thoughts concerning this disturbing tradition that has taken root in nearly every LDS home.
D&C 63: 17
Wherefore, I, the Lord, have said that the fearful, and the unbelieving, and all liars, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie, and the whoremonger, and the sorcerer, shall have their part in that lake which burneth with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.
"Part," meaning they will spend time paying for this particular sin, if they don't turn from it.
No one is exempt.
God is our ultimate judge of course, I'm only pointing out the destructive consequences of lying to kids about Santa, it goes against all spiritual reasoning and scriptures concerning lying.
Show me in scripture where is says it's okay to love and make a lie concerning anything.
I could never lie to a kid about a fictional character who has practically replaced God in most kid's and adult's lives.
I work with active and inactive LDS kids (teenagers). I see how they really act when outside the four walls of church. It's nothing short of shocking. You really have no clue what your kids are doing outside your home. There are a few good ones (teenagers I work with) who are just as shocked when they see how their peers really act outside of their homes and churches in real life settings. Some teenagers I work with are great examples to me of how I should act, others I cannot figure out what has made them the way they are. I work with all kinds of teenagers, most are LDS (active and inactive), a few non members have no clue about the church, even working and living among so many LDS teenagers.
We fool ourselves if we think, "All is well".
2 Nephi 28: 21
And others will he pacify, and lull them away into carnal security, that they will say: All is well in Zion; yea, Zion prospereth, all is well—and thus the devil cheateth their souls, and leadeth them away carefully down to hell.
Hell won't be permanent place for anyone, except for the devil and his angels, even the son's of perdition are redeemed from hell but are then cast into outer darkness, a hell in itself, but that doesn't mean that most will not spend some time there paying for their own unrepented sins.
No one is exempt from this.
2 Nephi 28
8 And there shall also be many which shall say: Eat, drink, and be merry; nevertheless, fear God—he will justify in committing a little sin; yea, lie a little, take the advantage of one because of his words, dig a pit for thy neighbor; there is no harm in this; and do all these things, for tomorrow we die; and if it so be that we are guilty, God will beat us with a few stripes, and at last we shall be saved in the kingdom of God.
9 Yea, and there shall be many which shall teach after this manner, false and vain and foolish doctrines, and shall be puffed up in their hearts, and shall seek deep to hide their counsels from the Lord; and their works shall be in the dark.
10 And the blood of the saints shall cry from the ground against them.
11 Yea, they have all gone out of the way; they have become corrupted.
12 Because of pride, and because of false teachers, and false doctrine, their churches have become corrupted, and their churches are lifted up; because of pride they are puffed up.
I'm not here to judge any leader of the church, only here to educate and share my thoughts concerning this disturbing tradition that has taken root in nearly every LDS home.
D&C 63: 17
Wherefore, I, the Lord, have said that the fearful, and the unbelieving, and all liars, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie, and the whoremonger, and the sorcerer, shall have their part in that lake which burneth with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.
"Part," meaning they will spend time paying for this particular sin, if they don't turn from it.
No one is exempt.
God is our ultimate judge of course, I'm only pointing out the destructive consequences of lying to kids about Santa, it goes against all spiritual reasoning and scriptures concerning lying.
Show me in scripture where is says it's okay to love and make a lie concerning anything.
I could never lie to a kid about a fictional character who has practically replaced God in most kid's and adult's lives.
I work with active and inactive LDS kids (teenagers). I see how they really act when outside the four walls of church. It's nothing short of shocking. You really have no clue what your kids are doing outside your home. There are a few good ones (teenagers I work with) who are just as shocked when they see how their peers really act outside of their homes and churches in real life settings. Some teenagers I work with are great examples to me of how I should act, others I cannot figure out what has made them the way they are. I work with all kinds of teenagers, most are LDS (active and inactive), a few non members have no clue about the church, even working and living among so many LDS teenagers.
We fool ourselves if we think, "All is well".
2 Nephi 28: 21
And others will he pacify, and lull them away into carnal security, that they will say: All is well in Zion; yea, Zion prospereth, all is well—and thus the devil cheateth their souls, and leadeth them away carefully down to hell.
Hell won't be permanent place for anyone, except for the devil and his angels, even the son's of perdition are redeemed from hell but are then cast into outer darkness, a hell in itself, but that doesn't mean that most will not spend some time there paying for their own unrepented sins.
No one is exempt from this.
2 Nephi 28
8 And there shall also be many which shall say: Eat, drink, and be merry; nevertheless, fear God—he will justify in committing a little sin; yea, lie a little, take the advantage of one because of his words, dig a pit for thy neighbor; there is no harm in this; and do all these things, for tomorrow we die; and if it so be that we are guilty, God will beat us with a few stripes, and at last we shall be saved in the kingdom of God.
9 Yea, and there shall be many which shall teach after this manner, false and vain and foolish doctrines, and shall be puffed up in their hearts, and shall seek deep to hide their counsels from the Lord; and their works shall be in the dark.
10 And the blood of the saints shall cry from the ground against them.
11 Yea, they have all gone out of the way; they have become corrupted.
12 Because of pride, and because of false teachers, and false doctrine, their churches have become corrupted, and their churches are lifted up; because of pride they are puffed up.
FFH
Veteran Member
It's simple, deductive reasoning.
There is no grey area with sin. Either it's wrong or it's right.
Either lying to kids about Santa is wrong or it's right, there is no grey area.
The Holy Ghost/Spirit of God (personal revelation) tells me this is an extremely evil tradition. I won't back down on that.
I should relate a story in which my wife and I were at an extended Christmas party.
All of my extended family on my father's side are located in Salt Lake and they would rotate between the three kid's homes (my dad and his two siblings).
This particular year it fell upon my dad's sister, who would always hire out a Santa dude to come in and give presents to the kids and ask the kids and adults what they would like for Christmas. Ugh, I hated the stupidity of it all, but put up with it, as did my wife.
Each year we would also be asked to share a particular talent of ours, if we even had one.
My wife loves to read and write. Poetry is one avenue she used to enjoy. This particular year, about 8 years ago, my wife was browsing the net and found a poem that she liked.
I begged her not to read it at this particular Christmas party, since Santa would be there and it would seem like an afront to the host (my aunt/dad's sister). I had an idea of what the consequences of her reading this particular poem might be, but I didn't know the full affect of what those consequences might be until she actually read the poem.
It was the poem I posted earlier in this thread.
'Twas the Night Before Jesus Came
My father glared at me as my wife read this poem. I'll never forget that look.
The next day we were promptly disinvited, by my father, to any further Christmas festivities that year, and as a result, my wife never wanted to be with my immediate or extended family after that day, if that's the way they felt about her and her beliefs, which we both shared.
I did not coax her to read the poem, she felt nearly compelled to read it, I couldn't stop her. Nothing I could say or do could have deterred her from reading it at that particular Christmas party. She really wanted to read it and felt it was what she should do.
Two people liked and thanked my wife for reading the poem though, my grandmother and my uncle (who has also nearly been disowned by his immediate family. He's struggled in literally every area of his life which has pretty much been devastated). "Man looks upon the outward appearance, God looks upon the heart).
My grandmother died just this last year and this particular uncle now has cancer. I saw him recently at a family reunion and the spirit flooded over me so strongly as we met for only the second time since my wife read that poem over 8 years ago. I told him not to leave, you'll get through this (cancer). He took care of my grandmother until she died last year. She went blind the last few years of her life. He tenderly took care of her as he always has.
Some cannot let go of Santa and the whole counterfeit "reason for the season," even to the point of disowning their own son and daughter-in-law.
My parents have since apologized and reinvited us to Christmas get togethers, we have yet to accept their invitations.
I won't go unless my wife agrees to go and she has never agreed to go, so we don't go. I back up my wife's decision every time. If she doesn't feel welcome or comfortable around my family then we don't go.
My parents have not seen my wife since that night she read the poem.
Is it really worth it to keep up this tradition in our homes, while Christ is pushed off to the side and put into a box to spoken about only in church ???
My wife was told, in a sacred blessing (LDS members will know what I'm talking about), to "profess Christ in all places".
She's the reason I'm so bold about professing Christ. She has no problems with proclaiming Christ to eveyone she meets.
That's interesting. The following are considered sins according to the Old Testament.
1. Working on Saturday.
2. Not killing homosexuals.
3. Eating lobster.
4. Wearing cotton/polyester.
If you can ignore these sins, why not ignore all the sins?
Some people try to get around this by claiming there is some grey areas to sin. But since you see no grey area, then I am not sure how you reconcile this.
DeepShadow
White Crow
DeepShadow
White Crow
No, you just go over their heads and preach your own personal revelation over their counsel.
Personal revelation is supposed to be personal. If the Lord wanted everyone to know this, He'd tell it through the prophet.
I respect your right to personal revelation, FFH. Why won't you respect mine?
DeepShadow
White Crow
That's wonderful! I respect your right and responsibility to choose for your family.
Do you think your choice is right for everyone?
FFH
Veteran Member
Great post !!!
I've studied, pondered and prayed about all 4 of these things extensively, even the cotton/polyseter thing and especially health issues, such as eating lobster.
I don't eat lobster, for obvious health reasons. Lobster and pork we should limit as much as possible, just for our own health benenfits.
Mixing of Fabrics
Pork, Lobster, etc.
Saturday Sabbath
Stoning for Very Serious Sins
These things were strictly observed under Old Testament law of course.
Because of Christ's sacrifice for the sins of the world, we no longer observe these laws.
The whole Saturday changed to Sunday thing is a subject that the Bible codes have also touched on. I'll start a thread posting these codes pertaining to this, which may give some insight into this.
I'm surprised you brought up the "cotton/polyester" thing. I thought I was the only one who actually pondered stuff like this. I've actually pondered not wearing cotton/poly LDS garments, but Christ's sacrifice has "fulfilled" these laws.
We are no longer bound by the strict obvservance of these laws, such as eating lobster and pork and mixing fabrics.
We also no longer are required to stone another for serious sins such as homsexuality, but we are required to obstain from homosexuality and other extremely serious sins, lying is one of them, which is classified among some of these serious sins.
I don't take lying lightly and neither does the Lord.
Eating lobster and pork is not good, but it won't keep you out of heaven and neither will wearing mixed fabrics, but homosexuality, lying will keep you out of heaven.
Working on the Sabbath is also very serious, it was worthy of stoning in Old Testament times. The Lord does not want us to work or recreate on the Sabbath. We now observe Sunday as the Sabbath. I won't get into the strict observance of which day the Sabbath is on this thread.
The Bible codes have touched on this (Sabbath changed to Sunday) and will start another thread concerning this.
blackout
Violet.
FFH
Veteran Member
These scriptures are speaking of mental and physical abuse of children,.
Is it not considered mental abuse, at least on some level, to lie to children ???
In my book it is. Those who lie to kids will be held accountable in the eternities.
These scriptures come to mind loud and clear whenever I ponder this evil tradition of lying to kids about a this fictional character, who is all but God in kids eyes who know no better than to beleive what their parents lie to them about..
Matthew 18: 6
But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
Mark 9: 42
And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
Luke 17: 2
It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones.
Rev. 18: 21
And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon (the world and it's evil/ungodly traditions) be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all.
D&C 121: 22
It had been better for them that a millstone had been hanged about their necks, and they drowned in the depth of the sea.
Is it not considered mental abuse, at least on some level, to lie to children ???
In my book it is. Those who lie to kids will be held accountable in the eternities.
These scriptures come to mind loud and clear whenever I ponder this evil tradition of lying to kids about a this fictional character, who is all but God in kids eyes who know no better than to beleive what their parents lie to them about..
Matthew 18: 6
But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
Mark 9: 42
And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
Luke 17: 2
It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones.
Rev. 18: 21
And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon (the world and it's evil/ungodly traditions) be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all.
D&C 121: 22
It had been better for them that a millstone had been hanged about their necks, and they drowned in the depth of the sea.