Science has given us this and God has given us what?

[psychoslice]

Including those who believe they shall incur eternal life in Heaven?

Yea, I think its total greed, the selfish gen I suppose.

 

[Slapstick]

Yea, I think its total greed, the selfish gen I suppose.

I bet there is a gene for being a bad-butt, psycho-reincarnate, know-it-all, egotism, gayism, straightism, lamism, and everything else you can think of that involves a personality trait so long as it doesn’t belong to god in the form of anthropomorphism.

So my question is this. Why should someone apply their own characteristics to someone or something else? Especially if they don't believe that something doesn't' exist in the first place?

 

[psychoslice]

I bet there is a gene for being a bad-butt, psycho-reincarnate, know-it-all, egotism, gayism, straightism, lamism, and everything else you can think of that involves a personality trait so long as it doesn’t belong to god in the form of anthropomorphism.

So my question is this. Why should someone apply their own characteristics to someone or something else? Especially if they don't believe that something doesn't' exist in the first place?

I think its simply because they don't believe, they have the same right as those who do believe, no one owns the rights.

 

[Mycroft]

Yea, I think its total greed, the selfish gen I suppose.

I don't find any evidence to suggest selfishness is genetic in nature.

 

[psychoslice]

I don't find any evidence to suggest selfishness is genetic in nature.

Of course it is, that's how we got to where we are today,. pushing forward to better things all the time.

 

[FearGod]

science can't give us answers about creation and the complexity of our universe.

There is 2 Probabilities,a designer or nothing did it at all.

So as we respect science then we have to use our minds to think.

We as humans are made in a scientific way,in other words there is a mind behind such design.

We have science because we have brains to think,that is what God gave us.

Excuse me to mention the quran,in which God had swore by the pen and which is our ability to learn and gain knowledge,God said to his angels that humans will do better work on earth than angels themselves even though that angels asked God why send humans to earth while we obey your words,God answered "i know what you don't know"

I think human on earth are sent for a purpose other than testing their ethics and which is exploring the universe and from the ancient times till today humans are still searching and thinking about the outer space and hence God will declare after billions of years of expanding the universe.

(Of) the day when they shall come forth, nothing concerning them remains hidden to Allah. To whom belongs the kingdom this day? To Allah, the One, the Subduer (of all). (40:16)

 

[bobhikes]

Including those who believe they shall incur eternal life in Heaven?

Yep :run:

 

[bobhikes]

What in the world. :areyoucra I don't see how that could possibly be argued.

Stress is a big factor
Quality of life, though life was shorter prove we are happier now
Technology every improvement has a negative side.

Cars for instance Kill far more people than horses or bikes, is the advantage of travel they give worth more than the lives they cost.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

In my non-dual philosophy, God and creation are not separate. God is pure being-bliss-awareness and is our core. We find bliss by identifying with our core and not our bodies; the science of Self-Realization.

So, should I take that as a 'Yes'?
My point is, perhaps your path to Inner Peace involves a notion of God. Do you think the only path to Inner Peace must mandatorily include God? Or do you accept that it's possible to find Inner Peace without a God-concept?

 

[dyanaprajna2011]

Science is provable; Christianity isn't. I'll take what can be proven over mere metaphysical speculation any day.

 

[Windwalker]

What else offers an eternal blissful life where I remain who I am?

Therein lays the crux of the entire problem. Clinging. Does Christianity actually teach you get to hold onto your self-identity, your little "me" and all the comforts and securities of that illusion? Or does it teach you have die to everything of who you are and be born again, not as this little "me", but as one who lays down their life, so they may truly know life? Is the message of Christianity narcissistic, or is that what people hope it says because they're afraid of letting go?

But to answer your question what does religion offer that science proper does not? If practiced as a path of self-transformation, it leads to peace, wisdom, and compassion - through emptying the self of all its clinging to its desires to live forever.

 

[Mycroft]

Therein lays the crux of the entire problem. Clinging. Does Christianity actually teach you get to hold onto your self-identity, your little "me" and all the comforts and securities of that illusion? Or does it teach you have die to everything of who you are and be born again, not as this little "me", but as one who lays down their life, so they may truly know life? Is the message of Christianity narcissistic, or is that what people hope it says because they're afraid of letting go?

But to answer your question what does religion offer that science proper does not? If practiced as a path of self-transformation, it leads to peace, wisdom, and compassion - through emptying the self of all its clinging to its desires to live forever.

And also, with such a promise of eternal bliss made, can any Christian action be truly selfless?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Therein lays the crux of the entire problem. Clinging. Does Christianity actually teach you get to hold onto your self-identity, your little "me" and all the comforts and securities of that illusion? Or does it teach you have die to everything of who you are and be born again, not as this little "me", but as one who lays down their life, so they may truly know life? Is the message of Christianity narcissistic, or is that what people hope it says because they're afraid of letting go?

But to answer your question what does religion offer that science proper does not? If practiced as a path of self-transformation, it leads to peace, wisdom, and compassion - through emptying the self of all its clinging to its desires to live forever.

Do you think that peace, wisdom, and compassion are unachievable without religion?

Do you think that religion helps people achieve these things more often than it hinders them?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Stress is a big factor
Quality of life, though life was shorter prove we are happier now
Technology every improvement has a negative side.

Cars for instance Kill far more people than horses or bikes, is the advantage of travel they give worth more than the lives they cost.

I'll take living indoors with heating and AC, modern medicine, books, films, video games, music, access to clean water, food, the Internet, cars, planes, and all the other wonderful gifts of modern civilization, science and technology over living a short and brutal life in the wilderness. If you hate it so badly, go live with a remote, isolated tribe. There's still some out there. Nature can be lovely - on my terms. Sure, I'll spend a day out in the country, the woods or whatever, but I'm coming back to the city.

 

[Yuusif12]

Religion gives us so much. If we didn't have it we would still be in the dark ages. And if we have faith we will go to paradise. But that means we still use science to help us in our lives now

 

[George-ananda]

So, should I take that as a 'Yes'?
My point is, perhaps your path to Inner Peace involves a notion of God. Do you think the only path to Inner Peace must mandatorily include God? Or do you accept that it's possible to find Inner Peace without a God-concept?

Yes, I think it is possible to find inner peace without a God concept. But the inner process in achieving that inner peace is actually moving them closer to their God core whether they call it God or not.

 

[FearGod]

I'll take living indoors with heating and AC, modern medicine, books, films, video games, music, access to clean water, food, the Internet, cars, planes, and all the other wonderful gifts of modern civilization, science and technology over living a short and brutal life in the wilderness. If you hate it so badly, go live with a remote, isolated tribe. There's still some out there. Nature can be lovely - on my terms. Sure, I'll spend a day out in the country, the woods or whatever, but I'm coming back to the city.

Do you mean if we have faith (religion) then we can't drive cars and enjoy our life.

Or did i understand you wrong.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Do you mean if we have faith (religion) then we can't drive cars and enjoy our life.

Or did i understand you wrong.

No. I was responding to this:

Science can produce, destroy, create and kill. It is a two edged sword not just one as most would like us to believe.

I actually argued somewhere else that today we have a harder life than the caveman because of all the so called better advances. It was a tie in the end no clear winner.

That's just a ridiculous claim to make. Yeah, our prehistoric ancestors had it so wonderful.

 

[Father Heathen]

Well we have all heard the statement in one form or fashion, right?

Science has given us medicine, and even the keypad I am typing on right now.
Where as, what we have been given by believing in God, it is often framed as, myth, fairy tales, wishful thinking, wars, dumbing down of our societies, on and on.

Familiar with everyone? I should hope so?

Some have asked of Christians, "What? Would you rather we drop science altogether and just live on what the bible tells us?"

So, I pondered that for a bit. I reasoned that if the promises of the bible are true, namely, that I will live an eternity in bliss, I'd take that everyday over a keyboard and some medicine that will keep me alive a few more days, months or years.

Science will never keep us alive forever, or end suffering, though in many cases has caused tremendous suffering.
It will of course continue to contribute useful things to the world, but when compared to the promises of the bible, the totality of all of sciences best work, still dwarf to eternal blissful life.

What say you?

I say that I prefer something that you can observe, test, experience, and rely upon over irrational, unsubstantiated, and arbitrary superstitions and empty promises that haven't delivered.

Also, why does science and god have to be opposed? Clearly science and biblical claims are at odds, but the bible was just some ancient text written by ignorant, primitive savages. If there is a god, it's through science and not dead goat herders that we gain wisdom, knowledge, and understanding of "his" universe.

So to answer your opening question: "Science has given us this and God has given us what?" It could be said that god gave us science. There we go.

For the record, as an agnostic I don't discount the possibility of some force or entity that fits the moniker of "god". However if such a thing exists I think it would be something along the lines of pantheism or deism rather than something anthropomorphic.

 

[Mycroft]

So, should I take that as a 'Yes'?
My point is, perhaps your path to Inner Peace involves a notion of God. Do you think the only path to Inner Peace must mandatorily include God? Or do you accept that it's possible to find Inner Peace without a God-concept?

Someone once asked me, 'What is it you want most in this world?' I replied that I already had what I needed most in this world: peace. A peace that few people ever truly find.

And I would say that I do have that inner peace despite being an atheist and a scientist. I have a strong sense of my own identity, I am self-sufficient, I manage my expectations and assumptions so that I avoid upset and disappointment and there are so many things that fascinate and interest me that I am never bored. Yeah, I think it's possible to obtain inner peace without a concept of God. You just have to know how to go about it.

But I don't think that a concept of God or Religion would necessarily bring inner peace either. If you're an athlete who has lost both of his legs in a car accident, and if all you want to do is run again, and can never find peace without that being restored to you, there is little religion has to offer. Praying wont grow you new legs, if it did we'd have heard about it by now. Science, however, has restored plenty of injured runners to running condition and, in this way, achieves much more than religion ever can.