Should we fear Islam?

[Gharib]

Heres my point

Bin Laden May well have read and studied the Quran. But as there's no priesthood in Islam No theological colleges no supreme authority. His word for it and the suggestion that he has, is all that makes him able to issue fatwas saying that it is acceptable to kill civilians. I suggest that anyone can call themselves learned in the Quran and interpret it to justify their actions and many do.

you have surprised me. i never thought i'd see this from you.

Al-Azhar University - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

reading the quran and the hadith does not give one the authority to issue fatwas. islamic knowledge doesn't consists of just reading the quran and hadith. those that interprete the quran their own way are the ignorant people. it is like science, it has to be peer reviewed, the best commentary and interpretation of the quran can be found in Ibn Kathirs collection.

the study of the quran is a science and so is the study of hadith. a person is not allowed to interprete the hadith nor the quran without having the historical knowledge and know the hadith and quran very well.

 

[kai]

let me ask you something, do you think that if someone who reads the quran, just reads it, is able to issue fatwas?

That seems to be the case with Bin Laden

yes he would if he spoke the true islamic teachings, he speaks ignorance so only the ignorant are following him.

I agree

yes there are formal qualifications. almost every middle eastern country has atleast one religious school like egypts Al Azhar.


he doesn't issue fawtwas, he issues ignorance, thats why only the ignorant are following him.
Iagree

to issue a fatwa one needs the aproval of the scholars, that is usually gained by studying at an islamic institution where the scholars are the teachers in other words to get a qualification. then if for some reason you issue missguiding fatwas or do un-islamic things other scholars dissaprove of them.

as i posted earlier:
Islam Online- News Section

you have surprised me. i never thought i'd see this from you.

Al-Azhar University - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

reading the quran and the hadith does not give one the authority to issue fatwas. islamic knowledge doesn't consists of just reading the quran and hadith. those that interprete the quran their own way are the ignorant people. it is like science, it has to be peer reviewed, the best commentary and interpretation of the quran can be found in Ibn Kathirs collection.

the study of the quran is a science and so is the study of hadith. a person is not allowed to interprete the hadith nor the quran without having the historical knowledge and know the hadith and quran very well.

Even Al Azhar doesnt speak for All Muslims

Bin Laden does issue Fatwas though doesnt he ? so does Ayman al-Zawahiri

 

[Gharib]

That seems to be the case with Bin Laden

it probably is, but it is not permissible in islam.

I agree

Even Al Azhar doesnt speak for All Muslims

Bin Laden does issue Fatwas though doesnt he ? so does Ayman al-Zawahiri

no it doesn't but i was explaining that we do have schools were one gets a qualification to be a scholar and issue fatwas. there are many such universities in the muslim world.

 

[kai]

it probably is, but it is not permissible in islam.


but he doeas it anyway because he considers the muslim world to in a state of Jahiliyyah






no it doesn't but i was explaining that we do have schools were one gets a qualification to be a scholar and issue fatwas. there are many such universities in the muslim world.

Yes there are many but theres no overall qualification or ratification that endorses them . you take your pick really what ever school of thought you want to support theres a maddrrassa for you.

 

[Gharib]

but he doeas it anyway because he considers the muslim world to in a state of Jahiliyyah

and surprisingly he recons that it is ok to kill innocent people.

Yes there are many but theres no overall qualification or ratification that endorses them . you take your pick really what ever school of thought you want to support theres a maddrrassa for you.

yes the universities do differ on some points, it just depends in what country you learn and what school of thought is most dominant in that area. but still scholars are in agreement on basic things such as the un-islamic teachings of osama bin laden to kill innocent people.

 

[kai]

and surprisingly he recons that it is ok to kill innocent people.



yes the universities do differ on some points, it just depends in what country you learn and what school of thought is most dominant in that area.

but still scholars are in agreement on basic things such as the un-islamic teachings of osama bin laden to kill innocent people.

well i am glad to hear that.

 

[McBell]

That depends on the credibility of the religious leader in question doesn't it , Bin Laden has a small number of followers. The correlation between the numbers of followers and his credibility are related. If he was such a learned spokesman on the Quran as he makes out, he would have a lot more followers amongst Muslims.

Credibility of the religious religious leader?
So who do religious leaders answer to?
What gives religious leaders "credibility"?
The validity of their religion perhaps?

Does that mean that once Islam outnumbers Christianity that Islam will have more "credibility"?

 

[McBell]

I don't call people like Bin Laden religious leaders, I call them misusers of religion. Only a person who practices what their religion actually teaches has the right to be called religious.

And who are you to make claims that what Bin Laden teaches is not his religion?

 

[McBell]

yes he would if he spoke the true islamic teachings, he speaks ignorance so only the ignorant are following him.

Until you talk to one of his followers, then it is you who speaks the ignorance.
So once again, right back to the round and round and round and round.....

 

[McBell]

yes there are formal qualifications. almost every middle eastern country has atleast one religious school like egypts Al Azhar.

he doesn't issue fawtwas, he issues ignorance, thats why only the ignorant are following him.

to issue a fatwa one needs the aproval of the scholars, that is usually gained by studying at an islamic institution where the scholars are the teachers in other words to get a qualification. then if for some reason you issue missguiding fatwas or do un-islamic things other scholars dissaprove of them.

as i posted earlier:
Islam Online- News Section

Classic example of ignoring the problem.

 

[McBell]

you have surprised me. i never thought i'd see this from you.

Al-Azhar University - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

reading the quran and the hadith does not give one the authority to issue fatwas. islamic knowledge doesn't consists of just reading the quran and hadith. those that interprete the quran their own way are the ignorant people. it is like science, it has to be peer reviewed, the best commentary and interpretation of the quran can be found in Ibn Kathirs collection.

the study of the quran is a science and so is the study of hadith. a person is not allowed to interprete the hadith nor the quran without having the historical knowledge and know the hadith and quran very well.

ROTFLMAO

This is just to funny.
So what is my punishment?

 

[kai]

Classic example of ignoring the problem.

which is?

 

[challupa]

Credibility of the religious religious leader?
So who do religious leaders answer to?
What gives religious leaders "credibility"?
The validity of their religion perhaps?

Does that mean that once Islam outnumbers Christianity that Islam will have more "credibility"?

Now that would be truly scary! I see people like Esalem and lava as the majority of muslims at the moment. What scares me is if this majority ever tips to the Bin Ladens of the world.

 

[McBell]

which is?

That their particular brand/sect/version/type/style/flavour/etc. of Islam is the only Islam and everything else is not Islam.

 

[Jose Fly]

Beheading Planned in Saudi Sorcery Case

(CNN) -- A Lebanese man charged with sorcery and sentenced to death in Saudi Arabia is scheduled to be beheaded on Friday, the man's lawyer said Wednesday.
May El Khansa, the attorney for Ali Hussain Sibat, told CNN that she and Sibat's family were informed about the upcoming execution. She said she heard from a source in Saudi Arabia with knowledge of the case and the proceedings that Saudi authorities "will carry out the execution."

Muslims cannot point to this and say "Oh, but that's just some fringe, radical, extremist group". This is the country of Saudi Arabia.

 

[Autodidact]

subhan allah. ok answer this question for me:

your govenrment invades a country who does not have the same weapons as your does. so now just because the invaded country doesn't have f16's are you saying they are not allowed to kill your soldiers by other weapons like using bombs for example?

Last time I heard, Muslim suicide bombers had blown up a train full of Moscovites, not a single one of them a soldier.

whats the point, she calls non-islamic practices islamic even after i have given her the correct islamic teachings.

It's so nice of Allah to have given us you as his prophet to clear up what is and is not His will.

I'm having a very hard time communicating an extremely simple concept to you. I've said it every way I can think of. I am not talking about "Islamic" in the sense of "what Allah wills." I don't know what Allah wills. All I know is what millions of Muslims believe He wills, and what they do based on that belief. The entire world calls that "Islam," and that is what I'm talking about.

I am not debating what is or is not truly "Islamic" in the sense that there is any one correct interpretation of the qur'an. I'm nuetral on that question. My only point is that millions of so-called Muslims believe it, and act on it, and kill innocent people because of it, and that matters.

Whether the qur'an commands it or not, 39 Muscovites are dead this week. And that is what I'm talking about. Should we fear that? Hell yeah!

 

[Autodidact]

mine doesn't. that of the scholars of islam does.

What about the many learned scholars of Islam who say the exact opposite?

 

[Autodidact]

there is a hierachy order in islam, those with knowledge and those without it.

So scholars who have devoted their lives to studying the qur'an, sharia and hadith, and who say the opposite of you, are therefore to be taken as authorities, rather than you?

 

[Autodidact]

That depends on the credibility of the religious leader in question doesn't it , Bin Laden has a small number of followers. The correlation between the numbers of followers and his credibility are related. If he was such a learned spokesman on the Quran as he makes out, he would have a lot more followers amongst Muslims.

Bin Laden is one of the most admired and respected Muslims in the world--among Muslims. What does that tell you?

 

[Autodidact]

the study of the quran is a science and so is the study of hadith. a person is not allowed to interprete the hadith nor the quran without having the historical knowledge and know the hadith and quran very well.

No, it's not. But then, you don't know what science is.