Students Are Pushing Back Against Gender Ideology In Their Schools

[We Never Know]

Does a flag, a piece of cloth, feel pain when you burn it? Does it get it's feelings hurt if you call it by something else that it isn't? Nope. It has no feelings.

Pronouns, on the other hand, are used to address human beings. Can you hurt a human being's feelings and disrespect them by using improper pronouns to address them? Absolutely you can.

Get it?

"Pronouns, on the other hand, are used to address human beings. Can you hurt a human being's feelings and disrespect them by using improper pronouns to address them? Absolutely you can."

I use pronouns to address people. Them, they, that(person).

 

[Guitar's Cry]

I would have a conversation with them. But I would enter that conversation with the acknowledgment that he/she are not only gender references but biological references also. Now if this person were convinced I were a biological female that presents as a male I would understand they referred to me as female due to my biology rather than my gender; at which case I would explain to them that not only is my gender male, but also my biology.

I appreciate the civil approach! But what if they kept doing it?

That there may be a biological aspect to pronouns doesn't really matter when addressing people outside of a lab. Science depersonalizes when it needs to, so a purely scientific approach may use pronouns as it relates to biology. But that's not how pronouns work in the social realm.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

No, what I wrote is quite true. The facial or other expressions don't change the definition or classification. Abnormal expression of an individual with characteristics usually found in members of the other gender doesn't negate the classification.

...in a lab, where things like genetics, hormones, and physiology can be tested and classified. Biology loves messy classification. Check out taxonomy sometime.

In the social sphere, gender expression has always been tied to appearance and not biology. This appears based on innate response mechanisms and how these are expressed in culture and not genetics directly.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Again; if I address someone as a male because they look like a male, but they tell me they are female, I will assume they are and address them as female. It usually ends there.

So, you're judging by outward appearance; how they present themselves. Otherwise known as gender expression.
You're not actually judging them by their biological makeup then, because in actuality, you have no idea what that is, unless you've done a genital inspection and a DNA test or something.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Does a pronoun, a word, feel pain when its not used? Does it get it's feelings hurt if you call it by something else that it isn't? Nope. It has no feelings.

Human beings do. We're talking about pronouns when used to address human beings.

 

[SkepticThinker]

"Pronouns, on the other hand, are used to address human beings. Can you hurt a human being's feelings and disrespect them by using improper pronouns to address them? Absolutely you can."

I use pronouns to address people. Them, they, that(person).

So, you get it, or no?

 

[Kfox]

I appreciate the civil approach! But what if they kept doing it?

How do I know they keep doing it, unless somebody else tells me? Ya see; the only pronouns someone will use in reference to me when talking to me is "you" or "your"; this idea that someone is going to refer to me as a she when talking to me is not how the English language works. So if someone mis-genders me, they only way they can do it is if they are talking to someone else about me, thus I am not a part of the conversation. Now if Billy keeps running to me telling me that Jane keeps referring to me as a she when he talks to her, I will tell Billy that I don't wanna hear about it.

 

[Kfox]

So, you're judging by outward appearance; how they present themselves. Otherwise known as gender expression.
You're not actually judging them by their biological makeup then, because in actuality, you have no idea what that is, unless you've done a genital inspection and a DNA test or something.

I agree.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Yeah; I'm sure they're used to it.

So? It's rude, it's mean, it does take a psychological toll andit has no proper place within civilized behavior.

 

[Shaul]

...in a lab, where things like genetics, hormones, and physiology can be tested and classified. Biology loves messy classification. Check out taxonomy sometime.

In the social sphere, gender expression has always been tied to appearance and not biology. This appears based on innate response mechanisms and how these are expressed in culture and not genetics directly.

No, not just in a lab. Everywhere. There are many who want there to be ambiguity. They desire that ambiguity to use as a wedge for their own purposes. They are wrong to do so.

 

[fantome profane]

No, not just in a lab. Everywhere. There are many who want there to be ambiguity. They desire that ambiguity to use as a wedge for their own purposes. They are wrong to do so.

There are many who want to live in a world of black and white. They are unable to deal with the possibility that there exists shades of grey, and just thinking about the colours of the rainbow causes such people to flee in panic. And there are politicians who use their fear for political gain. They are wrong to do so.

 

[Shaul]

There are many who want to live in a world of black and white. They are unable to deal with the possibility that there exists shades of grey, and just thinking about the colours of the rainbow causes such people to flee in panic. And there are politicians who use their fear for political gain. They are wrong to do so.

There are grey areas in life, but some things are simply "black or white". Whether a person has a Y chromosome is either true or false. It has no grey area. A person with a Y chromosome is a male.

 

[fantome profane]

There are grey areas in life, but some things are simply "black or white". Whether a person has a Y chromosome is either true or false. It has no grey area. A person with a Y chromosome is a male.

There is more to being a man than just being male. And more to being a woman than just being female.

 

[Shaul]

There is more to being a man than just being male. And more to being a woman than just being female.

Go try to milk a bovine that has a Y chromosome and see how well that works.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

Go try to milk a bovine that has a Y chromosome and see how well that works.

It's really trivially easy to find examples of lactating males, since you don't need more than an unusual amount of prolactin. And while it is unusual, it isn't a straight binary of Y chromosome = no milk, XX = has milk.

Trans women have been nursing for quite a long time, too. Yes, Trans Women Can Breastfeed — Here's How

 

[fantome profane]

Go try to milk a bovine that has a Y chromosome and see how well that works.

That's a lot of bull and you know it.

 

[Kfox]

So? It's rude, it's mean, it does take a psychological toll andit has no proper place within civilized behavior.

You are wrong. If somebody looks like the opposite sex, they know it! And for someone to accidentally speak to them as if they were the sex the appear to be, this is called being human. It is perfectly normal to speak to a person who looks like a man, as if they were a man

 

[Kfox]

There is more to being a man than just being male. And more to being a woman than just being female.

What more is there?

 

[Guitar's Cry]

How do I know they keep doing it, unless somebody else tells me? Ya see; the only pronouns someone will use in reference to me when talking to me is "you" or "your"; this idea that someone is going to refer to me as a she when talking to me is not how the English language works. So if someone mis-genders me, they only way they can do it is if they are talking to someone else about me, thus I am not a part of the conversation. Now if Billy keeps running to me telling me that Jane keeps referring to me as a she when he talks to her, I will tell Billy that I don't wanna hear about it.

You've never had a conversation between two people in which they've referred to you?

 

[Guitar's Cry]

No, not just in a lab. Everywhere. There are many who want there to be ambiguity. They desire that ambiguity to use as a wedge for their own purposes. They are wrong to do so.

Outside of a lab, it is impractical and rude. I would suggest those who insist on attaching pronouns to genetics are either being pendantic or have their own political agenda.