The Debate of God.

[Daviso452]

your theology sounds absurd already.

make some more up and let's see how ridiculous it can become.

Remember of course that most religions have sound ethical and philosophical bases to support their theology and supernatural ideas.

Thus they can help mankind in a general moral sense even if you don't believe in God.

You do realize he doesn't actually believe in that, right?

You do not need theology to have morals. It is possible to grow up without a concept of God and be incredibly moral.

 

[Tiberius]

your theology sounds absurd already.

My theology? MINE? Oh, I'm sorry. When did I say that I was a pastafarian?

make some more up and let's see how ridiculous it can become.

Seems to me that most modern religions do enough of that by themselves.

Remember of course that most religions have sound ethical and philosophical bases to support their theology and supernatural ideas.

And Pastafarianism doesn't?

Thus they can help mankind in a general moral sense even if you don't believe in God.

Yeah. Look you don't need a belief in God or membership in a religion in order to be a good person.

 

[Skeptisch]

Look you don't need a belief in God or membership in a religion in order to be a good person.

“... But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.”
Steven Weinberg

 

[shawn001]

your theology sounds absurd already.

make some more up and let's see how ridiculous it can become.

Remember of course that most religions have sound ethical and philosophical bases to support their theology and supernatural ideas.

Thus they can help mankind in a general moral sense even if you don't believe in God.

They also caused a great many wars, conflicts and abuses.

“Name me an ethical statement made or an action performed by a believer that could not have been made or performed by a non-believer.”
Christopher Hitchens

 

[Daviso452]

Oh how I wish Martin was here. This forum gets boring when he's gone.

 

[nnmartin]

And Pastafarianism doesn't?

Yes, but this is just a joke nonsense book.

Not even an attempt at anything other than humor.

So , I'd have to say then that this book has an absolute zero credit rating in this debate.

From Wikipedia:

The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster is a satirical book written by Bobby Henderson that embodies the main beliefs of the parody religion the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster or Pastafarianism.

 

[zenzero]

Friend Daviso,

The Debate of God.

*God* is simply a concept to understand that the totality of existence including us is what the word *God* signifies.
One is born in oneness with everything BUT the mind acts as Satan to keep the individual away by making it appear [illusion] that one is separate than the whole/God and only when the Mind stills is one again back in oneness and the process by which the mind is stilled is a path or way also called Religion.
So the God concept can only be realized and there is no other way to understand IT.

Love & rgds

 

[Tiberius]

Yes, but this is just a joke nonsense book.

Not even an attempt at anything other than humor.

So , I'd have to say then that this book has an absolute zero credit rating in this debate.

From Wikipedia:

And you are missing the point of it all, Martin.

 

[Daviso452]

Yes, but this is just a joke nonsense book.

Not even an attempt at anything other than humor.

So , I'd have to say then that this book has an absolute zero credit rating in this debate.

From Wikipedia:

Yes, pastafarians are there for satirical reasons, but the point is that it's a deity that no one can disprove. However, just because you can't disprove it doesn't mean it exists. That is the purpose of the flying spaghetti monster.

 

[nnmartin]

yes, but the Spaghetti monster religion has no philosophy, theology or spirituality.

Hence it is not a religion.

 

[idav]

yes, but the Spaghetti monster religion has no philosophy, theology or spirituality.

Hence it is not a religion.

Are you trying to say FSM is not real. Your blaspheme will not be tolerated, beware the wrath of flying Spaghetti Monster the ONe True Monster!!!

“Let us sing praise to the Flying Spaghetti Monster, for He is a loving God. Of His might and dominion, there is no compare; of His mercy and deliciousness, there is no equal. No other god can challenge Him; in the taste test, He is invincible. Through His pasta, He has blessed us with everlasting life, and holy is His Name. For He is the Flying Spaghetti Monster: the One, True, and Most High God, creator of man and midgit, giver of pasta, giver of sauce, from age to holy age; not created He was, but ever He lives, through the glory of spaghetti, now and forever. R'Amen.”

 

[Daviso452]

yes, but the Spaghetti monster religion has no philosophy, theology or spirituality.

Hence it is not a religion.

It's not supposed to be a religion. It's just to show that just because you can't disprove something, doesn't mean it exists.

 

[nnmartin]

well it's pointless then.

perhaps the writer sold a few copies and bought a new car but other than that it's just silly drivel.

 

[Daviso452]

well it's pointless then.

perhaps the writer sold a few copies and bought a new car but other than that it's just silly drivel.

You obviously have no idea how big it is.

But let's go back to a different topic. We did not finish our discussion on why you believe in Jesus, and I would like to continue if you would allow.

From what I recall, you agree that there is no evidence for God. However, around age 13, despite being raised in an atheist home, you felt a Guardian Angel looking out for you. Because of this, you began to develop faith in Jesus Christ. Is that a good summary?

 

[nnmartin]

I'd say that I always felt there was some kind of extra/supernatural figure out there.

from small child to adult it would have developed along the lines of fairies - imaginary friend - guardian angel - Earth Goddess - Jesus - Deistic God - Organised religious theological concepts and back to a Christo-Pagan mix as of now.

I never studied the Bible or any form of theology as a child/youth so there would have been no way of distinguishing between the religions or spiritual movements - yet it seems that there has always been some kind of 'God' figure around for me.

for various reasons - Christ makes the most sense nowadays.

 

[Daviso452]

I'd say that I always felt there was some kind of extra/supernatural figure out there.

from small child to adult it would have developed along the lines of fairies - imaginary friend - guardian angel - Earth Goddess - Jesus - Deistic God - Organised religious theological concepts and back to a Christo-Pagan mix as of now.

I never studied the Bible or any form of theology as a child/youth so there would have been no way of distinguishing between the religions or spiritual movements - yet it seems that there has always been some kind of 'God' figure around for me.

for various reasons - Christ makes the most sense nowadays.

I heard this study a while back:
Children are born believers in God, academic claims - Telegraph
and
Why we are born to believe in God: It's wired into the brain, says psychologist | Mail Online
Basically, children are born with a predisposition to believe in God. Neither of these gives an explanation though. Why do you think, Martin?

The way I see it, it was an evolutionary necessity. The human race has had the concept of supernatural figures since the dawn of our existence. In order to be accepted into the tribe, the individual had to believe in the religion of the tribe. Otherwise they would be cast out and hated, which is apparent in many ancient cultures, and has survived through to this day in many parts of the world, including the united states.

To go against the group would be next to suicidal, so our brains were programmed to have that disposition in order to better survive.

 

[Tiberius]

well it's pointless then.

No it isn't. The point is that people of every religion likewise believe in something that has no evidence for it and is unfalsifiable.

 

[Daviso452]

No it isn't. The point is that people of every religion likewise believe in something that has no evidence for it and is unfalsifiable.

What he and I both said.

 

[nnmartin]

I am sure we could easily prove that the Spaghetti Monster, Pastafarian religion was nonsense though.

for a start we can actually see and test spaghetti for real in a laboratory - you can't do that with a God.

 

[nnmartin]

The way I see it, it was an evolutionary necessity. The human race has had the concept of supernatural figures since the dawn of our existence. In order to be accepted into the tribe, the individual had to believe in the religion of the tribe.

I'll have a look at those links in due course.

but for now the first thing that comes to mind is 'why did the first tribe have a supernatural belief' - that doesn't fit in with the psychological evolution theory that you seem to be making.

How do you explain that one?