The Return of Christ

[Spice]

It’s all good. You believe it’s all metaphors except for the fact that you believe in reincarnation until perfection which is cool

And I'm not so sure about the perfection part, but it feels right to me at this point in time. I still hold on to the hope of our world's perfection. Peace on Earth, Good Will Toward Men.

 

[soulsurvivor]

soulsurvivor said:
Actually, I believe the same person will come for all of them (they just call the same person different names).

Before recent times the world was not globalized, so 'God' would send different teachers to different regions. Now that we are globalized, God will send one teacher for all even though each group expects a different one by name.

Sounds good

This means you should not expect the Messiah to be necessarily named Jesus - that may not sound so good to many Christians.

 

[Jimmy]

This means you should not expect the Messiah to be necessarily named Jesus - that may not sound so good to many Christians.

I know his names not Jesus although i suppose it could be. Anyway suppose I can call him Jesus anyway. People get the point

 

[CG Didymus]

the virgin birth, IMO, represents that Jesus was truly Adam, born by God's hands, but not of woman.

Yeah, and that's what I'd expect from Baha'is... take the virgin birth story as a metaphor and not as something that literally happened.

However, I think that the gospel writers meant for it to be taken literally. They wanted Jesus to be born without the "taint" of having a human father. As I recall the Christian story has all people inheriting a sin nature because of Adam's disobedience.

 

[Spice]

Yeah, and that's what I'd expect from Baha'is... take the virgin birth story as a metaphor and not as something that literally happened.

However, I think that the gospel writers meant for it to be taken literally. They wanted Jesus to be born without the "taint" of having a human father. As I recall the Christian story has all people inheriting a sin nature because of Adam's disobedience.

Yep, that would be the Christian version, but I remember Jesus and his disciples were Jews. As I understand they don't take scriptures "literally. "

 

[Jimmy]

Yep, that would be the Christian version, but I remember Jesus and his disciples were Jews. As I understand they don't take scriptures "literally. "

Only thing That matters is how you take the scriptures in 2024

 

[CG Didymus]

Before recent times the world was not globalized, so 'God' would send different teachers to different regions. Now that we are globalized, God will send one teacher for all even though each group expects a different one by name.

And that's how Baha'is believe. Except they believe that person has already come and gone. Do you think that their prophet, Baha'u'llah, could have been that person?

I know his names not Jesus although i suppose it could be. Anyway suppose I can call him Jesus anyway. People get the point

Now it sounds like you have someone other than the Baha'is prophet in mind. If so, why don't you believe he was the return of Christ? Or... does he somehow fit into your beliefs?

 

[Ajax]

Ironically, it's one thing that Baha'is do believe about Christianity that makes me question them along with Christianity, and that is the virgin birth.

I've asked several Baha'is to comment on why an event that none of the gospel writers witnessed and only two of them even mentioned and their stories contradict each other.

But it's that the virgin birth is based on only one out-of-context verse in Isaiah chapter seven. The gospel writers use none of the other verses that talk about this boy.

For me, the story would have been way too easily made up. And the only purpose would be to make Jesus into a God, and to be literally the son of God. None of that helps the Baha'is. They need to bring him down to the level of Moses, Muhammad and their prophets, the Bab and Baha'u'llah... Which is God-like, but not God... but a "manifestation of God."

Whatever, it's all still a bunch of beliefs that must be taken on faith. But the way believers argue, it's as if they have irrefutable proof and evidence that their prophet and Scriptures are the absolute truth.

The virgin birth is almost definitely a made-up story. It is easy to understand this because it is based on a completely irrelevant story or 'prophecy' from Isaiah 7:14. This 'prophecy' is described in the text as a sign from God for King Ahaz, indicating that his two enemies will not attack him. How could this be a sign for the King to alleviate his fears if it happens centuries later? Matthew used a lot of unrelated Old Testament prophecies to create stories in order to attract Jews.

 

[Ajax]

Imo I know this life is the afterlife as do many others

The afterlife’s are infinite

Resurrection day will be the afterlife

Very confusing...Oh well, hope you put your thoughts in order.

 

[soulsurvivor]

And that's how Baha'is believe. Except they believe that person has already come and gone. Do you think that their prophet, Baha'u'llah, could have been that person?

Now it sounds like you have someone other than the Baha'is prophet in mind. If so, why don't you believe he was the return of Christ? Or... does he somehow fit into your beliefs?

Very unlikely! Baha'u'llah probably has hardly 8 to 9 million followers, far fewer than another contender - ‎Mirza Ghulam Ahmad the founder of the Ahmadis. 8 million out of 7 billion is hardly anything. The real Messiah will probably be recognized and followed by more than half of the world population. He will perform many miracles and have a great, visible impact on the world, not unlike Jesus or Krishna.

 

[Ajax]

I am not sure what the cruelty of nature has to do with the coming of a Messiah, but OK.

Because most theists still believe that physical phenomena are God's punishment for human actions and the return of a God will solve all these matters.

 

[soulsurvivor]

Because most theists still believe that physical phenomena are God's punishment for human actions and the return of a God will solve all these matters.

Physical suffering is indeed the result of one's own karma, although I wouldn't call it 'punishment' by God. It is just a natural reaction to your original action.

The return of the Messiah (he is not 'God') will not make any difference to this natural karmic mechanism - it will continue as before.

 

[wellwisher]

This question is for non-believers of the Christian faith. All Christians believe that Christ will return. When you hear them say this what do you think it really means?

I see it as connected to the evolution of human consciousness. The return of Christ will be like an updated capacity, that comes with this next aspect of human evolution.

If you look at either science or the Bible, humans were like natural animals at one time; Apes or Adam and Eve in Paradise. They were under natural instinct which are like natural or God given laws, which are designed to allow natural animals to participate in integrated eco-systems. The story of the fall from paradise, is where Adam and Eve choose externally learned knowledge over innate or internal instinct; knowledge. This is the rise of civilization and the loss of paradise and then the perversion of natural human instinct; will and choice.

Jesus is often called the second Adam. He is connected to a return to paradise; heaven. This would be a more advanced state of mind, that can still learn externally, but has that inner sense of natural instinct, that can guide one to the truth. We will still have technology, but a better world view that allows for more cooperation; family of man.

In Revelations, those with no faith or instinct, will not make the cut; update is aborted due to bugs. It might be like having an older computer, from a different era, that cannot be update without some mother board changes, which may not be an easy fix. The update stalls, while others with the proper set up, get the update. Once updated, new capacities appear needed for the future. This leaves behind the last generation and ushers in a new era of the family of man.

 

[Jimmy]

And that's how Baha'is believe. Except they believe that person has already come and gone. Do you think that their prophet, Baha'u'llah, could have been that person?

Now it sounds like you have someone other than the Baha'is prophet in mind. If so, why don't you believe he was the return of Christ? Or... does he somehow fit into your beliefs?

I’ll call him jesus to keep things simple

 

[Jimmy]

Very confusing...Oh well, hope you put your thoughts in order.

It’s clear to me. Maybe you don’t know what I believe so here it is. There’s one man on earth that makes existence possible. Existence rises and falls with his birth and death in an infinite cycle. It begins around 1980 and I’m not sure when he dies. So as you can see those confusing comments I made should be clear to you now.

 

[Jimmy]

It just reminds me of all the other old stories that tell of some divine figure returning.

Yeah but are those Devine figures considered Gods son like Jesus is? There’s a big difference between the son of God and a mere messenger or prophet.

 

[Jimmy]

Same as any dozens of other death and resurrection myths that have been told through time immemorial.

Yeah, but are those other myths considered Gods son like Jesus is? There’s a big difference between the son of God and a mere messenger or prophet.

 

[JustGeorge]

Yeah but are those Devine figures considered Gods son like Jesus is? There’s a big difference between the son of God and a mere messenger or prophet.

There's lots of sons of Gods(and goddesses) out there. Why is this one special?

 

[Ajax]

Physical suffering is indeed the result of one's own karma, although I wouldn't call it 'punishment' by God. It is just a natural reaction to your original action.

The return of the Messiah (he is not 'God') will not make any difference to this natural karmic mechanism - it will continue as before.

It’s clear to me. Maybe you don’t know what I believe so here it is. There’s one man on earth that makes existence possible. Existence rises and falls with his birth and death in an infinite cycle. It begins around 1980 and I’m not sure when he dies. So as you can see those confusing comments I made should be clear to you now.

Everyone is entitled to their beliefs and judged by them.

 

[The Hammer]

? There’s a big difference between the son of God and a mere messenger or prophet.

In most they are the actual Gods physically returning themselves. Not just a son or demigod. But A God. And even in the ones where it's a son of a God, well the son of a God is a God themselves.