The Return of Christ

[Jimmy]

Call him who you like. I call him Jesus in my real life. But I know the truth, which I share only online.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

I think it's true. The reason is both Quran and hadiths say the same thing. As well, I believe the Gospels are over all sublime and the word of God.

There is no verse in Quran that says Jesus will come down from Sky.

Qur'an is the first and most important guidance for Muslims.

It would be worthy to think, if Jesus comes down from sky to earth, why such an important, Miraculous and astonishing event is not in the Quran.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

وَقَوْلِهِمْ إِنَّا قَتَلْنَا الْمَسِيحَ عِيسَى ابْنَ مَرْيَمَ رَسُولَ اللَّهِ وَمَا قَتَلُوهُ وَمَا صَلَبُوهُ وَلَٰكِنْ شُبِّهَ لَهُمْ ۚ وَإِنَّ الَّذِينَ اخْتَلَفُوا فِيهِ لَفِي شَكٍّ مِنْهُ ۚ مَا لَهُمْ بِهِ مِنْ عِلْمٍ إِلَّا اتِّبَاعَ الظَّنِّ ۚ وَمَا قَتَلُوهُ يَقِينًا | and for their saying, ‘We killed the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, the apostle of Allah’—though they did not kill him nor did they crucify him, but so it was made to appear to them. Indeed those who differ concerning him are surely in doubt about him: they do not have any knowledge of that beyond following conjectures, and certainly, they did not kill him. | An-Nisaa : 157

وَإِنْ مِنْ أَهْلِ الْكِتَابِ إِلَّا لَيُؤْمِنَنَّ بِهِ قَبْلَ مَوْتِهِ ۖ وَيَوْمَ الْقِيَامَةِ يَكُونُ عَلَيْهِمْ شَهِيدًا | And there is none among the People of the Book but will surely believe in him before his death; and on the Day of Resurrection, he will be a witness on them. | An-Nisaa : 159


وَلَمَّا ضُرِبَ ابْنُ مَرْيَمَ مَثَلًا إِذَا قَوْمُكَ مِنْهُ يَصِدُّونَ | When the Son of Mary was cited as an example, behold, your people raise an outcry. | Az-Zukhruf : 57

وَقَالُوا أَآلِهَتُنَا خَيْرٌ أَمْ هُوَ ۚ مَا ضَرَبُوهُ لَكَ إِلَّا جَدَلًا ۚ بَلْ هُمْ قَوْمٌ خَصِمُونَ | They say, ‘Are our gods better or he?’ They cite him to you only for the sake of contention. Indeed, they are a contentious lot. | Az-Zukhruf : 58

إِنْ هُوَ إِلَّا عَبْدٌ أَنْعَمْنَا عَلَيْهِ وَجَعَلْنَاهُ مَثَلًا لِبَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ | He was just a servant whom We favored and made him an exemplar for the Children of Israel. | Az-Zukhruf : 59

وَلَوْ نَشَاءُ لَجَعَلْنَا مِنْكُمْ مَلَائِكَةً فِي الْأَرْضِ يَخْلُفُونَ | Had We wished We would have set angels from you on the earth as successors/authorities/representatives. | Az-Zukhruf : 60

وَإِنَّهُ لَعِلْمٌ لِلسَّاعَةِ فَلَا تَمْتَرُنَّ بِهَا وَاتَّبِعُونِ ۚ هَٰذَا صِرَاطٌ مُسْتَقِيمٌ | And ‘Indeed he is a portent of the Hour; so do not doubt it and follow me. This is a straight path. | Az-Zukhruf : 61


In Surah Nisa the context is about his death and says in fact, all people of the book will believe in him before his death and this shows "not killed nor crucified" is not talking about him being spiritually alive while physically dead.

In Surah Zukhruf, it's in context of not exaggerating the station of Isa (a). Those who God favored per Quran are the chosen ones, and not to make further than that in station. Then emphasizes he is not Angel either but will be a sign of the hour, which means he will come back.

And putting the two set of verses together is also helpful in contextualizing in each other meaning.

The hadiths also are numerous in that Jesus (a) will pray behind Imam Mahdi (a) and this is found in both Sunni and Shia sources.

These verses do not say, Jesus comes down from sky.
It says, Jesus will be Resurrected, which is a spiritual and metaphor expression.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

You believe Angels to be humans

that's what the Quran says, if one reads it carefully.

and day of judgment to be the period of Baha'allah Prophethood.

But even beside the Baha'i Scriptures, the Quran is clear, what it means by " the earth shall shine with the light of its Lord" and "Dead shall rise". Moreover, there are so many Hadithes in Shia sources that says, Day of Resurrection, Last Day, Promised Day all means, Rise of the Qaim.
do you see how conveniently you ignore these?

It makes no sense.

It is understandable that it would not make sense to you. You are after seeing Miracles. The Qaim now is alive and is over 1000 years, and Jesus is alive in sky, and is over 2000 years old.

 

[Regiomontanus]

Jesus spoke of his second coming several times in the Bible.

His second coming is mentioned by several authors in the NT.



1. Matthew 24:29-31:
• “Immediately after the distress of those days ‘the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.’ Then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. And then all the peoples of the earth will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory. And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.”
2. Mark 13:24-27:
• “But in those days, following that distress, ‘the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.’ At that time people will see the Son of Man coming in clouds with great power and glory. And he will send his angels and gather his elect from the four winds, from the ends of the earth to the ends of the heavens.”
3. Luke 21:25-28:
• “There will be signs in the sun, moon and stars. On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity at the roaring and tossing of the sea. People will faint from terror, apprehensive of what is coming on the world, for the heavenly bodies will be shaken. At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near.”

Acts of the Apostles

4. Acts 1:10-11:
• “They were looking intently up into the sky as he was going, when suddenly two men dressed in white stood beside them. ‘Men of Galilee,’ they said, ‘why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven.’”

Pauline Epistles

5. 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17:
• “For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.”
6. 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10:
• “This will happen when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven in blazing fire with his powerful angels. He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might on the day he comes to be glorified in his holy people and to be marveled at among all those who have believed. This includes you, because you believed our testimony to you.”

General Epistles

7. Hebrews 9:28:
• “So Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.”
8. James 5:7-8:
• “Be patient, then, brothers and sisters, until the Lord’s coming. See how the farmer waits for the land to yield its valuable crop, patiently waiting for the autumn and spring rains. You too, be patient and stand firm, because the Lord’s coming is near.”
9. 1 Peter 4:7:
• “The end of all things is near. Therefore be alert and of sober mind so that you may pray.”

Revelation

10. Revelation 1:7:
• “Look, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him; and all peoples on earth will mourn because of him. So shall it be! Amen.”
11. Revelation 22:12:
• “Look, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to each person according to what they have done.”

 

[F1fan]

This question is for non-believers of the Christian faith. All Christians believe that Christ will return. When you hear them say this what do you think it really means?

Christians have been believing the End Times with Christ's return will come in their time since this idea was promoted by the church. Everyone wants to think they are special and in a special time. Alas it never comes. The funny thing is that these believers die off, but tell the next generation the same stories and THEY think it will be them. No wonder Islam is growing and Christianity is losing members. At some point the next generation begins to smell a rat.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Yet, Quran says for Mohammad (s) to say he does not claim to be an Angel. Same with Nuh (a) saying it "I do not say I am an Angel". And many places showing disbelievers are contending why not Angels brought down with Mohammad (s) and replies.

Yap, Muhammad said, He is a human like others, yet, Quran says, He is better than any other human and a role Model for all.
In the other hand, Quran says, Muhammad did many Sins past and Present, and Allah told Him to ask for forgiveness.
If you take everything literally in the Quran, you will see many contradictions. Now, you conveniently justify anything you like, and make Quran say whatever you want.
I hope it is clear to you what I am saying.

Just because a verse says, Jesus said he is not Angel, it does not mean, He is not. Just as, if a verse says, Muhammad is a Sinner, it does not mean, He really was a sinner. You have to be able to see the wisdom of each verse and understand it within the whole Quran, rather than a verse in isolation.

 

[Jimmy]

Christians have been believing the End Times with Christ's return will come in their time since this idea was promoted by the church. Everyone wants to think they are special and in a special time. Alas it never comes. The funny thing is that these believers die off, but tell the next generation the same stories and THEY think it will be them. No wonder Islam is growing and Christianity is losing members. At some point the next generation begins to smell a rat.

You have no clue what Christianity is about imo.

 

[F1fan]

You have no clue what Christianity is about imo.

Nor do Christians, so my impression and opinion is no less valid.

Just look at the massivle disagreements among Christians, yet you accuse me of having no clue? At least I understand enough to not be a believer.

 

[Jimmy]

Nor do Christians, so my impression and opinion is no less valid.

Just look at the massivle disagreements among Christians, yet you accuse me of having no clue? At least I understand enough to not be a believer.

They all agree Jesus is comin back

 

[F1fan]

They all agree Jesus is comin back

Just that one of many hundreds of ideas? What unity. And guess what, they are all unified in being incorrect. Is that what Christianity stands for, being incorrect since 325?

 

[Jimmy]

Just that one of many hundreds of ideas? What unity. And guess what, they are all unified in being incorrect. Is that what Christianity stands for, being incorrect since 325?

That’s a pretty important idea. Ya think??? Like I said, you don’t have a clue as to what Christianity is about. You should probably refrain from talking about it.

 

[F1fan]

That’s a pretty important idea. Ya think???

No it isn't. It is assigned meaning because of tradition, not because it's true.

Like I said, you don’t have a clue as to what Christianity is about.

And as I said, neither do the many diverse Christians who disagree with each other. That's odd don't you think? Not even Chriist's return is factual. It's a failed promise to many millions of Christians.

You should probably refrain from talking about it.

No, as long as Christians bring it up, and try to force these ideas on nonbelievers, it will be discussed and exposed as untrue.

 

[Jimmy]

No it isn't. It is assigned meaning because of tradition, not because it's true.

And as I said, neither do the many diverse Christians who disagree with each other. That's odd don't you think? Not even Chriist's return is factual. It's a failed promise to many millions of Christians.

No, as long as Chrostians bring it up, and try to force these ideas on nonbelievers, it will be discussed and exposed as untrue.

lol have fun exposing the truth.

 

[Jimmy]

Jesus said

I am the bread of life.
I am the light of the world.
I am the resurrection and the life.
I am the way, the truth, and the life.

Um… sounds like god to me.

 

[Trailblazer]

Jesus said

I am the bread of life.
I am the light of the world.
I am the resurrection and the life.
I am the way, the truth, and the life.

Um… sounds like god to me.

All of that sounds like Jesus to me, none of it sounds like God.

 

[Link]

You have to be able to see the wisdom of each verse and understand it within the whole Quran, rather than a verse in isolation.

I agree with this part, which, I believe Bahais don't do with respect to Quran. It's part of what makes it evident and clear that your religion is false.

 

[Jimmy]

All of that sounds like Jesus to me, none of it sounds like God.

No? Hmm. That’s cool

 

[Jimmy]

Ask yourself a question. Is there a soul on earth that the earth couldn’t go on without?

 

[Trailblazer]

Ask yourself a question. Is there a soul on earth that the earth could go on without?

No, I don't think so.