Transgenderism

[Treasure Hunter]

Saved born again believers KNOW they are saved…


These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God. 1 John 5:13

You are correct, but this needs a new thread.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

I’ve read numerous accounts by those who have transitioned, then detransitioned. In every case the person said they struggled with other issues, such as; anxieties, autism, ADHD, OCD, depression, self-cutting, eating disorders, and others which were not addressed by counselors or medical personnel during their transition process. Instead, they were sped through to hormone treatment and then surgeries.

Transgender Detransitioners Got Poor Care When Transitioning

Over 50% of transgender people who transitioned but then regretted their decision and detransitioned felt they did not receive adequate assessment beforehand. Many had experienced internalized homophobia.

www.medscape.com

Maybe they are gender fluid. Surgery seems awfully permanent when you have masc days and fem days.

 

[Apostle John]

It really doesn't. Again, most social animals have members within the group that do not breed. Evolution does not require all members of a species to breed in order to proceed apace.

And in genetics, inheritable traits are passed down recessive or via epigenetic non-activation all the time. It's why disorders which are genetic and cause sterility like PCOS survived to this day.

Homosexuality, if it has genetuc or epigenetic components, could easily be passed by non-homosexual people.

But more likely has to do with mother and fetal endocrine function, which is why 2nd, 3rd and 4th children are more likely to be gay than firstborns. In which case there is nothing to be selected against genetically.

There are plenty of non-human animals which have been observed in a same-sex long term pairing, monogamous and even child fostering. Even in diverse groups.

Again, can't recommend Biological Exhuberance enough. It goes into exhaustive detail about homosexuality in non-human animals with pages and pages of detailed references.

Absolutely none of that has anything to do with the theory of evolution.

 

[Jainarayan]

Whatever causes homosexuality it didn’t come after millions of years of reproduction supposed by any evolution theory.

You don’t understand how evolution works. Why hasn’t Down syndrome, clearly having a genetic basis, been eradicated? Why? Because it’s genetic, not hereditary. There is a difference. Heredity is genetic but not everything genetic is hereditary. Very very few persons with Down syndrome reproduce. By your logic Down syndrome should not exist. But it does. It’s a mutation on the 21st chromosome. And for some reason it keeps happening. Evolution does not have a goal, it does not “select”.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

I understand people have feelings about their biology or gender which are influenced by their thoughts/mind/ brains and there’s a wide range to those thoughts. Nevertheless, I don’t see how altering one’s physical body and health with strong hormones or cutting off or removing healthy body parts is really helpful, wise, or a healthy thing to do in the long run.

I use strong hormones and had a breast reduction surgery, because not doing it would cause more problems and distress. You only know what's healthy or helpful for yourself, not them.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

Absolutely none of that has anything to do with the theory of evolution.

Literally all of it does lol.

 

[Jainarayan]

Absolutely none of that has anything to do with the theory of evolution.

According to you, because you don’t understand how evolution works.

 

[InChrist]

What is the difference between a procedure that is simply a "procedure", and a procedure that is "trying to change one's innate biological person or what it means to be human"?

I don't see how gender affirming therapy or surgery is in any way more "changing to changes one's innate biology" or "what it means to be human" any more than plastic surgery, glasses, pacemakers or any other procedure. What's the difference?

The things you’ve listed, like plastic surgery, glasses, etc. are cosmetic or aids to help with physical ailments. Basically, transition surgeries are like those, being only cosmetic, since they can’t actually change a person’s genetics. So why should these be advocated when sex change is physically impossible and frequently does not provide the long-term wholeness and happiness that people seek? Besides the long term detrimental health consequences?

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

Like when people think that they are saved.

Exactly. I thought I'd re-post what I wrote on a similar topic in another thread (see here) because I thought it was a appropriate response to your post.

But then, we have Jesus' parable about the sheep and goats, which clearly indicates that the sheep were rewarded with eternal life by Jesus for their works and the goats were condemned to eternal damnation by Jesus because they failed to do good deeds, such as feed the poor, take care of the sick, and visit prisoners. The popular theme of Christianity is "God loves you," but if you disobey him and sin against him, then he will send you to hell to be tortured, and you'll suffer for all eternity. However, if you repent of your sins and accept Jesus as your savior, then God will forgive you, and you're safe. But there's a catch. There is a loophole in this seemingly hopeful biblical promise: you could still be stripped of your salvation and be cast into hell if you don't follow God's will. Jesus' parable of the sheep and the goats (Matthew 25:31–46) and his clear warning: "Not everyone who says to me, "Lord, Lord," will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven" (Matthew 7:21) demonstrate that even though you repented and were forgiven of your sins, you could still go to hell if you don't toe the line exactly the way God wants you to, and herein lies another conflicting message in the Bible, because Romans 10:9–13 says that if someone declares with their mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believes in their heart that God raised Jesus from the dead, they will be saved. The verse claims that whoever calls on Jesus' name will be saved, but his warnings of not doing God's will indicate otherwise.

And Ephesians 2:8–9 states, "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast." However, in Matthew 7:21, Jesus stated, "Not everyone who says to me, "Lord, Lord," will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father, who is in heaven," and his parable of the sheep and goats in Matthew 25:31–46 states the "sheep" were rewarded with eternal life for their good works of feeding the hungry, giving water to people who are thirsty, inviting in a stranger, clothing the needy, and visiting the sick or people in prison. However, the "goats" in this parable were lambasted by Jesus for not feeding the hungry, giving water to people who were thirsty, inviting in strangers, clothing the needy, and not visiting the sick or people in prison. Jesus cursed them and sent them to eternal damnation. The "goats" in the parable lacked the good works to be rewarded with eternal life, despite the fact that they were Christians who accepted Jesus as their lord and savior.

 

[InChrist]

You are correct, but this needs a new thread.

True, there’s a lot of off topic, diversional stuff going on.

 

[Treasure Hunter]

True, there’s a lot of off topic, diversional stuff going on.

Salvation in Christianity

The idea that “I am saved” is different than “I will be saved”. Christians are to strongly identify with the Kingdom by identifying with the former. Still, the question that should follow: If I am saved, then why am I not in the Kingdom of Heaven? Someone cannot be saved from a flood while...

www.religiousforums.com

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

Eve was made female amd didnt become male, so no she wasn't trans.

Maybe I am thinking of Native American versions, where the sex split is a bit more overt.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

Maybe I am thinking of Native American versions, where the sex split is a bit more overt.

Google "Two-Spirit" for more information on the Native American version.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

The Bible calls it sin and offers the solution called repentance; meaning to change and stop the sin behavior, in this case the disrespect, abuse, or men not treating women as equals created by God

Why do people act like God hasn’t had an opinion since 33 CE? Why can’t He have more sense NOW? What is the point of praying if you don’t think God is active in the 21st century?

 

[InChrist]

Why do people act like God hasn’t had an opinion since 33 CE? Why can’t He have more sense NOW? What is the point of praying if you don’t think God is active in the 21st century?

Probably because God’s views are eternal and unchanging and He has fully revealed His “opinions” with all the information necessary and finalized His revelation in the Person of Jesus Christ…


God, who at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, has in these last days spoken to us by His Son …
Hebrews 1:1-2

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

Saved born again believers KNOW they are saved

That's the kind of comment that has to be translated, since you are using a different definition of "know" than I do. They don't know that they are saved. They just have no doubt. That's different, and by design. Such certitude in the absence of sufficient evidence to justify belief is considered a virtue in Christianity and encouraged, but for me, knowledge is the set of demonstrably correct ideas one holds - not firmly held, faith-based beliefs.

Okay, you have some different qualities or features for a guy and/or features that seem female. But what’s wrong that or with being the unique individual person you are in the male body you were born with as it is?

There's nothing wrong with her being the person she wants to be notwithstanding the Abrahamic religions' and their "knowledge" that she has a problem because their god says so. Why would she want to conform to the irrational beliefs of a religion? To please its god?

I don’t see how altering one’s physical body and health with strong hormones or cutting off or removing healthy body parts is really helpful, wise, or a healthy thing to do in the long run.

If you're male, were you circumcised? If you're female, have you ever required an estrogen supplement? If you are either, have you ever had a cataract removed and an artificial lens implanted?

Absolutely none of that has anything to do with the theory of evolution.

You don't know what biological evolution or the scientific theory that outlines its mechanism are, which undermines your apparent purpose of teaching others what evolution cannot do. Why would they listen to you when they can see right off of the bat that they already know more than you do about the topic?

One wonders what the purpose of the creationist apologist really is if he is so indifferent to be being counterproductive regarding what seems to be his purpose. If your purpose is something else, then this behavior might make sense. Maybe you like to play martyr. Maybe you're motivated by scripture that praises those who are rejected defending Christ and want to be one. Does this activity make you feel good, or is it unpleasant to you? I don't expect an answer, but you might consider the question yourself to decide whether the effect you are having is what you want or the opposite.

Also, ask yourself what your purpose is in trying to discredit evolutionary theory. Is in defense of the god of the Christian Bible as creator of the tree of life according to scripture? Are you trying to restore that hypothesis to a more credible level by undermining what you perceive as its chief rival? If so, you're too late. Go ahead and falsify the theory if you can. What do you suppose would replace it? I'm pretty sure that I know, and it's nothing that supports Christianity.

 

[TLK Valentine]

The Bible calls it sin and offers the solution called repentance; meaning to change and stop the sin behavior, in this case the disrespect, abuse, or men not treating women as equals created by God.

"Equals" in all things, including positions of authority in His Church?

 

[metis]

But that level of homosexuality shows the evolution theory is suspect.

Very much the contrary as it shows that genetic mismatches can and sometimes do occur. Random genetic drift is one of the forces that drives evolution.

I believe what the Bible says. Satan always consults God and asks His permission before doing anything.

Then God ultimately causes evil?

A Jewish commentary may well solve this problem, as it has it that God created the world to be "good" but not "perfect", thus we can help make it better or worse. If it was perfect, we would have no free will but only be God's puppets.

 

[InChrist]

"Equals" in all things, including positions of authority in His Church?

Equal does not mean all exactly the same. Different roles or positions do not equate inequality. Christ Himself demonstrated this. Plus, when you look at real life all people are of equal value from presidents to trash collectors, farmers to chefs, kids to adults, etc.

 

[InChrist]

There's nothing wrong with her being the person she wants to be notwithstanding the Abrahamic religions' and their "knowledge" that she has a problem because their god says so. Why would she want to conform to the irrational beliefs of a religion? To please its god?

If you're male, were you circumcised? If you're female, have you ever required an estrogen supplement? If you are either, have you ever had a cataract removed and an artificial lens implanted?

If an adult wants to transition and attempt altering their physical body with hormones and surgeries that is their choice. I really don’t expect non-believers to care or consider what God thinks. I am concerned about the trend and movement being pushed on kids.

I’m not male; so not circumcised. I am female, but haven’t had estrogen supplements. No cataract surgery or lens implants either.