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Trump 2024. Why or why not.

The Hammer

Skald
Premium Member
I don't know. All I know is what the media tells us, and the media didn't go into detail with Biden the way they did with Trump.

Just depends on what one is actively listening for.

""On November 2, 2022, Joe Biden's personal attorneys found classified documents dating to his vice presidency, some of which were top secret sensitive compartmented information, in a locked closet while packing files at the Penn Biden Center for Diplomacy and Global Engagement, a think tank where Biden worked after leaving the government in 2017.The White House notified NARA on the same day of the discovery; NARA retrieved the documents the next day and notified its inspector general, who referred the matter to the DOJ on November 4. The FBI and DOJ initiated an assessment of whether classified materials had been mishandled on November 9, notifying Biden's personal attorneys the next day.""



 

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member

I noticed that incompetence is not on your list. This list is all about personality, instead of ability. Trump can be abrasive, but that does not have anything to do with his competence. Trump is not there to entertain me, but to get the job done. The Left is way too shallow and tends to pick charisma before competence. They want a TV series President. This is why we have a mess. An actor playing the role of president is not real.
I'm sorry but this made me laugh sooooooo hard.

Dude, Trump IS the "TV series President." Good grief.
This Trump love to hate fest, reminds me of an Abraham Lincoln story. Lincoln's General staff was complaining about General Grant being a crude drunkard, who smoked cigars and drank during work. They thought he was boorish and undignified for the job, even though Grant was the best field General, winning his battles. Lincoln, in frustration said to his staff " if any of you can be half as competent as Grant, I will be buy the booze." Trump is Grant and the Left are the pretentious General Staff, complaining about personality traits while ignoring competence. Grant would help win the war and would someday become President.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
I'm sorry but this made me laugh sooooooo hard.

Dude, Trump IS the "TV series President." Good grief.
Thank you so much for that. His posts tend to be so full of ignorance that I just skip right over them. How could he even write such a thing? Well maybe, like me, he never watched The Apprentice. So called Reality TV has always been far too contrived for me.
 

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
Thank you so much for that. His posts tend to be so full of ignorance that I just skip right over them. How could he even write such a thing?
Oh, I just skim them too. For some reason, that line popped right out at me.
Well maybe, like me, he never watched The Apprentice. So called Reality TV has always been far too contrived for me.
I've seen it, unfortunately. I think that show is the main reason people think Trump is some kind of amazing business man. Because it definitely doesn't come from his actual business acumen.
 

Copernicus

Industrial Strength Linguist
Yeah that was a stupid thing to do. Biden and Pence sorta did the same thing, but the difference is Biden and Pence handed the documents over when asked, Trump tried to hide the fact that he had them. As stupid as that was, I don’t think enough harm was done to the country to cause me to prefer Biden over Trump

Neither Biden or Pence did anything "sorta" like Trump. They did not steal boxes of government records and then hide them from the government and falsely claim to be in legal possession of them. Indeed, both Biden and Pence fully cooperated with the government in making sure that any documents they might have failed to return got returned. Donald Trump did not just steal and hide those documents from legal authorities, but he shared them with people that were also not qualified to read them or be made aware of their contents. This all happened when Trump no longer even had a government clearance. Your opinion about the harm done to the government is far outweighed by the opinions of those in a position to know what harm might have been done. In reality, however, nobody really knows who the man shared that information with. I doubt that Trump himself remembers all of them.


Yeah; I know of people from Arkansas who say Bill Clinton was the same way about women when he was Governor, yet I think he was a great president.

Yes, Bill Clinton was a sexual predator, too, and, unlike Trump, he was good at his job.

He didn’t claim ALL the people crossing the border were criminals, just some of them; which is true. As far as **** hole countries remark, he said that in private; didn’t know it was gonna be repeated to the press. But let’s face it; if your country has a sub-50% literacy rate and employment rate, if there were ever anything that could be called a **** hole country, that would be it. As far as calling Covid the Chinese flue, that was stupid and divisive. He should have been better than that; unfortunately he was not. But under his governorship, the country was striving economically in spite of his stupid remarks.

Trump's xenophobic slur was made in the Whitehouse to a bipartisan group of senators. Not actually as private as the kinds of nasty slurs Nixon used to make, but only to his most trusted advisers. It still tells us that the man was highly xenophobic. This isn't about whether there are poor countries, but whether Trump's public and private comments reveal a xenophobic attitude towards foreigners and their countries.
 
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Ponder This

Well-Known Member
Are you kidding me? Did you think at all before you posted this? Most of Trump's wealth appears to be an illusion. If anyone would do anything for big money it would be Trump.
Like Trump Tower in NYC? Is it just an illusion? Did we all collectively imagine a building there?
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
Like Trump Tower in NYC? Is it just an illusion? Did we all collectively imagine a building there?
He only owns the commercial space, not the condos. Most of it is condos. But it will likely need to be sold to cover penalties, and Trump will be banned from business in New York due to fraud.

Is that why the world's dictators decided not to start wars while Trump was in office?
Who said they waited until Trump lost? Are you referring to putin invading Ukraine? Much of what putin was waiting for was new elections, and when Zelensky won he knew he didn't have a puppet, so decided to invade. This had nothing to do with Trump being president.
Did they all get warm fuzzy feelings inside and say to themselves, "Aww, he's just so likeable! What a great guy!"
They wanted Trump to be president because he would not oppose them and their criminal acts.

Are you a Trump supporter?
 

Kfox

Well-Known Member
Trump's xenophobic slur was made in the Whitehouse to a bipartisan group of senators. Not actually as private as the kinds of nasty slurs Nixon used to make, but only to his most trusted advisers. It still tells us that the man was highly xenophobic. This isn't about whether there are poor countries, but whether Trump's public and private comments reveal a xenophobic attitude towards foreigners and their countries.
No it was about poor countries. His comment was him asking how come we don't invite more immigrants from decent countries instead of all of these ***hole countries. That's not xenophobia, it's about being poor
 

Kfox

Well-Known Member
He only owns the commercial space, not the condos. Most of it is condos. But it will likely need to be sold to cover penalties, and Trump will be banned from business in New York due to fraud.
Trump doesn't own Trump Towers? Who owns it, and why did they put his name on it instead of their own?
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Trump doesn't own Trump Towers? Who owns it, and why did they put his name on it instead of their own?

It's a mixed use building, with multiple forms of
ownership of various portions. Condominium
owners have title to the space defined by their
envelope (eg, walls, ceiling, floor). The rest of
the building is owned by GMAC Commercial
Mortgage.

Use of the "Trump" name is contractual.
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Like Trump Tower in NYC? Is it just an illusion? Did we all collectively imagine a building there?
Somehow you managed to miss the point. The issue at large is not whether it exists but what Trump & Co allegedly did to inflate its worth so as to secure more loans? Doesn't his repeated dishonesty bother you?
 

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
Is that why the world's dictators decided not to start wars while Trump was in office?
I honestly cannot believe that people actually believe the nonsense that Trump claims. I mean, seriously?

What is it that you think Trump did that resulted in the "world's dictators deciding not to start wars while Trump was in office?
And remember, he almost started a war with Iran.


Did they all get warm fuzzy feelings inside and say to themselves, "Aww, he's just so likeable! What a great guy!"

How do you feel about him "falling in love" with Kim Jong Un and the two exchanging what Trump described as "love letters." Is that what you want from a President? Love affairs with brutal dictators?
Hey, maybe if Winston Churchill had just written Hitler some love letters, we could have avoided WWII altogether! :rolleyes:
 

Copernicus

Industrial Strength Linguist
No it was about poor countries. His comment was him asking how come we don't invite more immigrants from decent countries instead of all of these ***hole countries. That's not xenophobia, it's about being poor

You can't see what is in front of your nose. Trump did not refer to poor people. He referred to entire countries. His references to a judge's Mexican heritage, even though the judge was as American as Donald Trump, was also an example of xenophobia--attempting to cast aspersions on someone because of his national origin and to invite his supporters to adopt a similar perspective on people of Mexican heritage.
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
You can't see what is in front of your nose. Trump did not refer to poor people. He referred to entire countries. His references to a judge's Mexican heritage, even though the judge was as American as Donald Trump, was also an example of xenophobia--attempting to cast aspersions on someone because of his national origin and to invite his supporters to adopt a similar perspective on people of Mexican heritage.
Trump has long been a racist who's supported by other racist elements, such as the Proud Boys and Oath Keepers". Now he also is putting out anti-Semitic statements and potential programs of his by going after the "vermin", threatening the press, etc, exactly like Hitler and Mussolini did.

Matter of fact, his first wife, Ivana, said he kept NAZI materials on his bedstand and often read them before turning in.
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
While many politicians make promises about better schools, better roads, healthcare, etc., Trump makes promises to put people in mental institutions.


In a comment on his Truth Social website, Trump called Smith, former Justice Department official Andrew Weissmann and U.S. Deputy Attorney General Lisa Monaco a "team of losers and misfits" from CREW, an ethics watchdog group. He also attacked "all the rest of the Radical Left Zealots and Thugs who have been working illegally for years to 'take me down.'"


They will end up, Trump said, "suffering from a horrible disease, TRUMP DERANGEMENT SYNDROME (TDS!), in a Mental Institution by the time my next term as President is successfully completed. MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN!"

Trump's derangement is quite a syndrome.
 

wellwisher

Well-Known Member
Hard to say. In a few months it may be gone depending upon how hard he gets for committing fraud.
Thiscase of exaggerated worth could start a dangerous precedent. Let me give an example, say I go to a corner store and buy a coffee. I drink it and end up have this used paper cup. The cup has no value so it is discarded.

Now say Taylor Swift goes into the same store and buys the same coffee. Now because it has the lipstick mark of a celebrity, it can be worth $10,000. If you only look at the cup, and I claimed it is worth $10,000, you can be sued since you exaggerated the worth. There is non tangible worth connected to celebrity prestige. If you are buying a property for million and yo do not do your own research you will not stay in business long. Trump prestige was part of the value added.

Hunter Biden sold some of his paintings for good money. Part of that value was connected to his prestige, creating extra worth to collectors. If a collector got political, he could sue Hunter, since he was charge too much for just canvas and paint. But their original calculation added the prestige bonus.

The Trump brand has prestige that give value added to collectors of such things. Collectors will buy an old Trump comb that has little intrinsic value, but which has non-tangible value due to attachment to a celebrity. Letters by Abe Lincoln are worth $millions. This is due to more than just the value of the paper and ink. A stupid judgement could kill the collectors industry since lawyer will be able to argue intrinsic angle, ignoring prestige, based on this precedent.

The problem with using an injustice system docket, to define who is criminal, is if a criminal is not investigated, he is still a criminal. However, many none critical thinkers will think he must be innocent, which is why he was not investigated. In some Democrat run large cities, many criminals are set free, not due to being innocent, but due to selective choice not to prosecute. Many on the Left will interpret that as meaning he much be innocent or the law is obsolete. This is how an injustice system can selectively criminalize political opponents, and have their own crooks appear squeaky clean. Biden was not treated the same way for his classified document that he had even before Trump was President. He is not innocent, but it is sold that way simple because he benefited by selective prosecution or lack thereof.

The term Innocent is not connected to selective prosecution, when you have a corrupt injustice system. I am sure the Left knows this, but your party is too corrupt to admit it since it benefits by it. Trump has had three years to plan and knows how the game works. I look forward to his selective justice tour. Fairness requires he gets the same number of targets and ignore selective criminals. Citizen Obama has too much money for someone who worked as a public servant. We may need to bring this to court in Florida. This is how an injustice system can can cause hardship and alter public perception of crime. Trump supporters see the selective injustice and is why they are sticking with him, until they can see full justice served.
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
Thiscase of exaggerated worth could start a dangerous precedent. Let me give an example, say I go to a corner store and buy a coffee. I drink it and end up have this used paper cup. The cup has no value so it is discarded.

Now say Taylor Swift goes into the same store and buys the same coffee. Now because it has the lipstick mark of a celebrity, it can be worth $10,000. If you only look at the cup, and I claimed it is worth $10,000, you can be sued since you exaggerated the worth.
You can claim anything you want. That's not illegal.

Now if you had that cup and sold it for $10,000 and had to pay income tax on it, but you claim you only got $1000, that's fraud. And that is what Trump is in trouble doing for undervaluing his properties, and paying less tax than he owed. That's fraud.

On the flip side he is overvaluing his propertties as collateral for loans, which is also fraud. There is wiggle room in property valuation, like 10-15%. But Trump was claiming 100-200% over actual value, and this got him lower interest rates, and that is fraud. Remember, he filed for bankrupcy many times, and he was a risk. To inflate assets was a way he was able to get loans, and that is fraud, too.
 

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
Thiscase of exaggerated worth could start a dangerous precedent. Let me give an example, say I go to a corner store and buy a coffee. I drink it and end up have this used paper cup. The cup has no value so it is discarded.

Now say Taylor Swift goes into the same store and buys the same coffee. Now because it has the lipstick mark of a celebrity, it can be worth $10,000. If you only look at the cup, and I claimed it is worth $10,000, you can be sued since you exaggerated the worth. There is non tangible worth connected to celebrity prestige. If you are buying a property for million and yo do not do your own research you will not stay in business long. Trump prestige was part of the value added.

Hunter Biden sold some of his paintings for good money. Part of that value was connected to his prestige, creating extra worth to collectors. If a collector got political, he could sue Hunter, since he was charge too much for just canvas and paint. But their original calculation added the prestige bonus.

The Trump brand has prestige that give value added to collectors of such things. Collectors will buy an old Trump comb that has little intrinsic value, but which has non-tangible value due to attachment to a celebrity. Letters by Abe Lincoln are worth $millions. This is due to more than just the value of the paper and ink. A stupid judgement could kill the collectors industry since lawyer will be able to argue intrinsic angle, ignoring prestige, based on this precedent.

The problem with using an injustice system docket, to define who is criminal, is if a criminal is not investigated, he is still a criminal. However, many none critical thinkers will think he must be innocent, which is why he was not investigated. In some Democrat run large cities, many criminals are set free, not due to being innocent, but due to selective choice not to prosecute. Many on the Left will interpret that as meaning he much be innocent or the law is obsolete. This is how an injustice system can selectively criminalize political opponents, and have their own crooks appear squeaky clean. Biden was not treated the same way for his classified document that he had even before Trump was President. He is not innocent, but it is sold that way simple because he benefited by selective prosecution or lack thereof.

The term Innocent is not connected to selective prosecution, when you have a corrupt injustice system. I am sure the Left knows this, but your party is too corrupt to admit it since it benefits by it. Trump has had three years to plan and knows how the game works. I look forward to his selective justice tour. Fairness requires he gets the same number of targets and ignore selective criminals. Citizen Obama has too much money for someone who worked as a public servant. We may need to bring this to court in Florida. This is how an injustice system can can cause hardship and alter public perception of crime. Trump supporters see the selective injustice and is why they are sticking with him, until they can see full justice served.
Yeah, that's not how real estate works.

If you or I did anything like what Trump did, we'd already be facing huge fines and/or serving time in prison. The guy's a crook, man. The level of mental gymnastics you had to engage here in some attempt to defend his criminal practices is quite staggering.
 
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