What is Hell?

[smokydot]

being raised by nuns in a private church school and reading the bible a few times doesnt count?

Yes, it does. . .were you a Catholic?

 

[smokydot]

The Eastern churches teach, and I tend to believe, that Heaven and Hell are different experiences of the unadultered love of God... some experience it as bliss others as torment.

I'm more inclined to think it is torment because it is the justice of God they are experiencing, rather than his love.

 

[smokydot]

"it will be easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle..."
in the illustration of the 'rich man & Lazarus, he says: "the rich man called out to Lazarus and asked for 'drop of water' to cool his tongue because of the burning fire he was in

Thanks. But those aren't frequent ("a lot"), are they?
So they don't really characterize his words, and indicate that his words on hell were hyperbole.

 

[smokydot]

One of my neighbours is in her early 50s; she's crippled with arthritis. I'm not sure what form of arthritis she has, but she's suffered with it since she was 16 years old and had her first knee replacement when she was 19 years old.
Since then she's had 9 operations (I'm guessing to replace various joints) and she lives in constant pain. She has problems sleeping because she can't find a comfortable position to lie down in. Her hands are next to useless; gnarled balls of flesh that've locked in one position and are unmoveable. She almost lives in night dresses because getting dressed and undressed is too painful for her. Obviously she's just about housebound. The pain she experiences is unbelievable - my heart really does go out to this woman.
And to be honest, if I were her, I think I would've killed myself by now; but if there is a Hell she's well and truly in it; right up to her painful neck.
And if I thought a 'loving God' would do that to her - she's suffered since childhood - then he's one God that I want nothing to do with.

Do you know if she has faith in God and Jesus Christ?

 

[smokydot]

That's an interesting idea. Does this mean then that Hell would be an emotional state rather than a physical one? (As in, guilt, shame etc rather than hellfire).

I don't think it would be hell if it weren't both.

 

[jumpingjoy]

Do you know if she has faith in God and Jesus Christ?

Hopefully not!

 

[Friend of Bill W]

Do you know if she has faith in God and Jesus Christ?

I'm pretty sure she doesn't. But does that matter?

 

[smokydot]

I'm pretty sure she doesn't. But does that matter?

No, I was just going to have you ask her if it helped her here.

 

[outhouse]

My opinion, just because gehenna, hades and sheol were twisted into the word hell, plus a few more words used as hell, There are only a few refferences of hell in the bible and almost none are discriptive of the actual place. all we get is fire and torrment. Little can be said with certainty about hell. i see allot of speculation and i see previous myths incorporated into the christian hell, is all I see.

 

[Pegg]

Thanks. But those aren't frequent ("a lot"), are they?
So they don't really characterize his words, and indicate that his words on hell were hyperbole.

well think about this....when Jesus did speak he used the hebrew language of his day. When he said the word that we translate into 'hell' it was 'sheol'

that hebrew word doesnt mean a place of fire and torment. It means the place where the dead are buried...the grave.

So in these passages, im going to replace the english word 'hell' with the word Jesus actually used (sheol) and see if you can apply the meaning of the 'grave' to those words.

Acts 2:25-27 KJV “David speaketh concerning him [Jesus Christ], . . . Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell (SHEOL), neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.”
What was Jesus 'soul/body' not left in? Was it not the tomb his dead body was laid in after he died?

Revelation 20:13-14 KJV “The sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell (SHEOL) delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire.”
According to this verse hell is going to be destroyed and the people in it are going to come out...this is because God will resurrect those people to life.

 

[smokydot]

well think about this....when Jesus did speak he used the hebrew language of his day. When he said the word that we translate into 'hell' it was 'sheol'

Well, actually we don't know that for two reasons:
1) the NT was written in Greek, and
2) Jesus spoke Aramaic.

that hebrew word doesnt mean a place of fire and torment. It means the place where the dead are buried...the grave.
So in these passages, im going to replace the english word 'hell' with the word Jesus actually used (sheol) and see if you can apply the meaning of the 'grave' to those words.
Acts 2:25-27 KJV “David speaketh concerning him [Jesus Christ], . . . Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell (SHEOL), neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.”
What was Jesus 'soul/body' not left in? Was it not the tomb his dead body was laid in after he died?

Revelation 20:13-14 KJV “The sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell (SHEOL) delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire.”

The NT was written in Greek, not in Hebrew. There is no Sheol in the NT, and the word translated hell is Hades in the Greek, which means death/grave/pit,
it does not mean fire. That is a mistranslation of the verse in the KJV, which followed the Latin Vulgate's translation of Hades as "hell."

In the Greek hades is not hell, Gehenna is hell.
It reads, "And death and the grave were cast into the lake of fire."
That is because there will be no more death/grave/pit, for Jesus has conquered it, ended it.

According to this verse hell is going to be destroyed and the people in it are going to come out...this is because God will resurrect those people to life.

That's not what it says in the language of the NT, it says death and the grave (hades) are going to be destroyed.
The word for "hell" in the NT language is Gehenna, not hades.

 

[truseeker]

So, there are really two hells. Everyone is going to the first one which is simply the grave. Those who refuse to obey God's rules will face the second hell where they will be destroyed by fire, not left in fire for all eternity.

 

[Pegg]

Well, actually we don't know that for two reasons:
1) the NT was written in Greek, and
2) Jesus spoke Aramaic.

the common language of the day was Koine Greek & Aramaic so he likely spoke both, but there are scriptures which say he spoke in the Hebrew tongue.

Professor G. Ernest Wright in Biblical Archaeology, 1963, p. 243. states: “The language spoken by Jesus has been much debated. We have no certain way of knowing whether he could speak Greek or Latin, but in his teaching ministry he regularly used either Aramaic or the highly Aramaized popular Hebrew. When Paul addressed the mob in the Temple, it is said that he spoke Hebrew (Acts 21:40). Scholars generally have taken this to mean Aramaic, but it is quite possible that a popular Hebrew was then the common tongue among the Jews.”


The apostle Paul was said to speak in hebrew at Acts 22:2; 26:14.

Also, it is said by Eusebius and Jerome that Matthews Gospel was first written in Hebrew. So there was certainly a form of hebrew spoken in Jesus day which, as a hebrew, he would have spoke.

There is no Sheol in the NT, and the word translated hell is Hades in the Greek, which means death/grave/pit,

Sheol is the hebrew word which is translated as hell (hades is its greek equivalent) look at an english bible in the OT and you'll see it at such verses as Eccl 9:5,10 where the Douay Version renders 'sheol' as 'hell'

it does not mean fire. That is a mistranslation of the verse in the KJV, which followed the Latin Vulgate's translation of Hades as "hell."

In the Greek hades is not hell, Gehenna is hell.
It reads, "And death and the grave were cast into the lake of fire."

the lake of fire is a reference to Gehenna... that was the burning garbage dump outside the walls of jerusalem. It has nothing to do with an afterlife or a place where satan and demons dwell.

That is because there will be no more death/grave/pit, for Jesus has conquered it, ended it.
That's not what it says in the language of the NT, it says death and the grave (hades) are going to be destroyed.
The word for "hell" in the NT language is Gehenna, not hades.

hell, hades, sheol....all the same place, the grave. The only way that the grave can be destroyed is if people stop dieing. So we can understand what it means that 'death and hades/sheol/hell were thrown into the lake of fire/gehenna....it was destroyed which means it will exist no more.

 

[Pegg]

So, there are really two hells. Everyone is going to the first one which is simply the grave. Those who refuse to obey God's rules will face the second hell where they will be destroyed by fire, not left in fire for all eternity.

God does not need to use fire to destroy human life. he simply removes their life force and they expire. Fire merely 'represents' the destruction of life... just as the fires destroy things literally, death destroys life.

The first hell is the grave from which humans can be resurrected. But the second hell is for those whom God sends back to their death because they refused to obey him. No fire is necessary.

 

[smokydot]

the common language of the day was Koine Greek & Aramaic so he likely spoke both, but there are scriptures which say he spoke in the Hebrew tongue.
Professor G. Ernest Wright in Biblical Archaeology, 1963, p. 243. states: “The language spoken by Jesus has been much debated. We have no certain way of knowing whether he could speak Greek or Latin, but in his teaching ministry he regularly used either Aramaic or the highly Aramaized popular Hebrew. When Paul addressed the mob in the Temple, it is said that he spoke Hebrew (Acts 21:40). Scholars generally have taken this to mean Aramaic, but it is quite possible that a popular Hebrew was then the common tongue among the Jews.”
The apostle Paul was said to speak in hebrew at Acts 22:2; 26:14.
Also, it is said by Eusebius and Jerome that Matthews Gospel was first written in Hebrew. So there was certainly a form of hebrew spoken in Jesus day which, as a hebrew, he would have spoke.
Sheol is the hebrew word which is translated as hell (hades is its greek equivalent) look at an english bible in the OT and you'll see it at such verses as Eccl 9:5,10 where the Douay Version renders 'sheol' as 'hell'
the lake of fire is a reference to Gehenna... that was the burning garbage dump outside the walls of jerusalem. It has nothing to do with an afterlife or a place where satan and demons dwell.
[/color][/color]
hell, hades, sheol....all the same place, the grave. The only way that the grave can be destroyed is if people stop dieing. So we can understand what it means that 'death and hades/sheol/hell were thrown into the lake of fire/gehenna....it was destroyed which means it will exist no more.

No, hell is Gehenna, which is not the same place as sheol and hades.

 

[Pegg]

No, hell is Gehenna, which is not the same place as sheol and hades.

what place is gehenna?

 

[smokydot]

what place is gehenna?

The place Jesus warned of.

 

[Revoltingest]

Hell is a place where all your shortcomings & woes will be eliminated. You'll be happy & healthy, able to pursue all sorts of wonderful pursuits,
eg, intellectual, erotic, sporting, social, culinary, artistic, theatrical, gardening. You'll live forever in a rich environment with all your best
friends & no opportunity to be bored....unless you choose to be. In contrast, Heaven is ceaseless eternal unchanging compulsory worship of
the the all-needing god. I plan to rot in Hell.

 

[smokydot]

Hell is a place where all your shortcomings & woes will be eliminated. You'll be happy & healthy, able to pursue all sorts of wonderful pursuits,
eg, intellectual, erotic, sporting, social, culinary, artistic, theatrical, gardening. You'll live forever in a rich environment with all your best
friends & no opportunity to be bored....unless you choose to be. In contrast, Heaven is ceaseless eternal unchanging compulsory worship of
the the all-needing god. I plan to rot in Hell.

Check back in with us about an hour after you die.

 

[Revoltingest]

Check back in with us about an hour after you die.

You'll get an answer from me which is no less reliable than anyone else's.