What the New Testament says about God is true

[Truthseeker]

They’ll never get along. They don’t see Christ as God in the flesh like Christians do. Big big difference. Bahais have warped the essence of Christianity just like the Jehovas have.

They will not get along if they choose to not get along. It's a choice.

 

[CG Didymus]

I hope you realise there are millions of Christians that have never read the Bible. They get all they need from weekly sermons.

How many Christians do you think read the Tanakh often?

How many Disciples of Jesus and how many early beleivers do you think had read the Tanakh prior to embracing Jesus? For centuries right up to the 1800's it was not possible for the everyday beleivers to read a Bible. Also as I said above, I know many people, especially Catholics, never used to read the Bible.

Considering these observations, this arguement now used by an increasing amount of people, is a very shallow, hollow argument. The written Word is a Guide, ones heart is the key to all Truth, understanding deeds are the purpose of Faith is a gift. One does not need to read that, that is inherent in us, the Image we are made in. To bring that out if us, all we have to do is embrace Jesus and ask of Christ to make us new in the Spirit, to live the Love that is Christ, and most importantly practice the virtues and morals given to us, a thing many have forgotten in the pursuit of material wealth and comfort.

Regards Tony

But Baha'is are told to personally investigate the truth for themselves. How deep does a Baha'i go into their personal investigation before they feel like they know enough to make an informed decision? I wouldn't be surprised that for many, it's not too deep.

Like with me, I met and got involved with Baha'is before I had ever read anything in the Bible. But I heard a lot about the Bible from Baha'is. Then, when I did read it, I didn't agree with what Baha'is had told me about it. And even now, I'm learning stuff about the Bible and the Baha'i Faith all the time. It's an ongoing process. My investigation still isn't close to being done.

 

[Jimmy]

They will not get along if they choose to not get along. It's a choice.

Just as long as they don’t kill each other

 

[Truthseeker]

Just as long as they don’t kill each other

I hope we can do a lot better than that.

 

[CG Didymus]

@Trailblazer is correct in what she offers to you, though many others will not say it Trailblazer does.

The Bible is a closed book, in both the Old and New Testament you will see passages that indicate the meanings are locked and hidden until an age would come when the Books are open and the Keys given.

Daniel 12:4 "But you, Daniel, shut up the words and seal the book, until the time of the end. Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase.”

It was closed since the Message Jesus gave

Revelation 5:2 "And I saw a mighty angel proclaiming in a loud voice, “Who is worthy to break the seals and open the scroll?”

Revelation 5:4 "I wept and wept because no one was found who was worthy to open the scroll or look inside.."

I can quote many passages, but basically Baha'u'llah gave the keys ro understand all the past Holy Books, if one immerses themselves in those keys, then when we read passages of the older books, they take on new meaning, they are seen in a new light, just as the Christians will see with the writings in the Tanakh.

The old is made New, just as promised in the Bible.

Regards Tony

That is the weirdest claim I've ever heard Baha'is make. Baha'is take so little of the Bible literally, yet those verses you do.

A verse in Daniel does not shut up the whole Bible. And in Revelation? The "sealed" book gets opened and the rest of Revelation is about what was in that "sealed" scroll. And I do believe there is a verse that says not to seal it.

And... Who is this Lamb that was worthy to unseal it? Was it Jesus? The Bab? Or Baha'u'llah?

Oh, and what are the keys that Baha'u'llah gave to understand the Hindu and Buddhist Scriptures? Except maybe to do like Baha'is do with the Bible, and take anything they disagree with or can't explain as symbolic.

Oh yeah, I just remembered, I haven't found any "keys" given by Baha'u'llah about anything to do with Hinduism and Buddhism. So, do know of any? Let me know what he said.

 

[Truthseeker]

That is the weirdest claim I've ever heard Baha'is make. Baha'is take so little of the Bible literally, yet those verses you do.

A verse in Daniel does not shut up the whole Bible. And in Revelation? The "sealed" book gets opened and the rest of Revelation is about what was in that "sealed" scroll. And I do believe there is a verse that says not to seal it.

And... Who is this Lamb that was worthy to unseal it? Was it Jesus? The Bab? Or Baha'u'llah?

Oh, and what are the keys that Baha'u'llah gave to understand the Hindu and Buddhist Scriptures? Except maybe to do like Baha'is do with the Bible, and take anything they disagree with or can't explain as symbolic.

Oh yeah, I just remembered, I haven't found any "keys" given by Baha'u'llah about anything to do with Hinduism and Buddhism. So, do know of any? Let me know what he said.

This is not good, arguing in a thread where my friend @Trailblazer is trying to make bridges. That goes for you too, @TransmutingSoul. And arguing about prophecy of all things! In my opinion prophecy is not worth arguing about.

 

[CG Didymus]

The true meaning of this verse.

The "true" meaning of it? So, all others are false?

John 10:16 I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen (Not Christians). I must bring them also (Jews, Zoroastrians, Buddhists, Hindus, Muslims). They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd.

Well, I don't know how true it is. But it sure is a good Baha'i interpretation of that verse. What other verses have you quote mined?

Oh yeah, tell everyone about how he will come from mountain to mountain and from sea to sea. That's a real good one until you look at any of the translations other then the KJV.

And again, just to be fair, I do believe that Christians quote mined the Hebrew Bible and misinterpreted verses just to make them fit their religion too.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

But Baha'is are told to personally investigate the truth for themselves. How deep does a Baha'i go into their personal investigation before they feel like they know enough to make an informed decision? I wouldn't be surprised that for many, it's not too deep.

Like with me, I met and got involved with Baha'is before I had ever read anything in the Bible. But I heard a lot about the Bible from Baha'is. Then, when I did read it, I didn't agree with what Baha'is had told me about it. And even now, I'm learning stuff about the Bible and the Baha'i Faith all the time. It's an ongoing process. My investigation still isn't close to being done.

Each in their own way CG. All the best.

With God, we all all single alone and lowly.

Regards Tony

 

[Jimmy]

I hope we can do a lot better than that.

Me too

 

[Trailblazer]

With God, we all all single alone and lowly.

I guess you were thinking of the prayer below?

Indeed, with ever-increasing tests I have come to realize that I am single, alone and lowly. For me there is no support save Thee, no helper except Thee and no sustainer beside Thee. There is certainly no human on Earth who can sustain me. When people ask me how I get through it all I tell them, God. It does not matter if they are a Christian or not, God is the same.

O God! O God! This is a broken-winged bird and his flight is very slow—assist him so that he may fly toward the apex of prosperity and salvation, wing his way with the utmost joy and happiness throughout the illimitable space, raise his melody in Thy Supreme Name in all the regions, exhilarate the ears with this call, and brighten the eyes by beholding the signs of guidance.

O Lord! I am single, alone and lowly. For me there is no support save Thee, no helper except Thee and no sustainer beside Thee. Confirm me in Thy service, assist me with the cohorts of Thy angels, make me victorious in the promotion of Thy Word and suffer me to speak out Thy wisdom amongst Thy creatures. Verily, Thou art the helper of the weak and the defender of the little ones, and verily Thou art the Powerful, the Mighty and the Unconstrained.

‘Abdu’l-Bahá

https://www.bahaiprayers.io/prayer?id=227160

 

[CG Didymus]

This is not good, arguing in a thread where my friend @Trailblazer is trying to make bridges. That goes for you too, @TransmutingSoul. And arguing about prophecy of all things! In my opinion prophecy is not worth arguing about.

Bridges? She not building anything with those Christians here. And how can she when she doesn't know their Scriptures other than to tell them how they have interpreted them wrong.

This "bridge" is to say that the Christian God and the Baha'i God are both loving and kind?

And prophecy? The Baha'i claim is that Baha'u'llah has fulfilled every Bible prophecy about the coming of the Messiah/Christ. Has he? Just let it go and not look into it to see if the Baha'is can support their claims?

I've only see one Baha'i consistently try to build bridges... and that is Loverofhumanity. But how can any Baha'i build any bridge when we all know that Baha'is believe that every other religion has incorporated beliefs and practices that Baha'is say are false. The number one being the one against those Christians that believe Jesus is God.

But let's go back then and see if we can build something here. They believe the Baha'is are a false religion, and Baha'is believe Christians believe false things. Hmmm, where do we begin? Oh, yeah... the God that each of them believe is loving and kind. Okay, next step?

 

[CG Didymus]

There is but One God.

Need anything else?

Regards Tony

And in ancient times different people believed in their God and better than the Gods of others. And, before the concept of one supreme God, people believed in many Gods.

Just to say that you believe in one God doesn't mean your God is the same one "true" God that is believed by others.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

This is not good, arguing in a thread where my friend @Trailblazer is trying to make bridges. That goes for you too, @TransmutingSoul. And arguing about prophecy of all things! In my opinion prophecy is not worth arguing about.

Firstly, one is not able to control the response others will make, you will note I took the topic of bridge building out into another OP.

Sometimes when building bridges, it requires the removal of the old foundations. The new bridge being built will take old engineering concepts and incorporate them into the design.

There will always be some that Ike the old bridge better, but unfortunately, it's being replaced.

Stay well and happy, a positive bridge building response would be good, either in this or the other OP.

Regards Tony

 

[CG Didymus]

No, you don't. You believe in that Jesus that your spiritual leader presents to you.

What about the real Jesus, the one you can learn about directly from the same source your leader knew Jesus?

I don't think your "reverence" is proper in real Jesus' view.

What if at the end, as you say, the real Jesus tells you something like: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness!’ (Matt. 7:23). Oh, wait ... according to Bahais Jesus won't come back to judge anyone, so ... we're not talking about the same Jesus, right.

And how does a person show that they truly love Jesus? But, for a Baha'i, what is it that they know and love about Jesus? Like you say, it's probably what she has been told about Jesus from the Baha'i writings. Because I doubt very much she's reading and believing what the NT says about Jesus.

 

[Trailblazer]

Bridges? She not building anything with those Christians here. And how can she when she doesn't know their Scriptures other than to tell them how they have interpreted them wrong.

I was waiting for that comment. A Baha'i trying to building a bridge with a Christian is about as easy as building a bridge across the Atlantic Ocean.
But of course you always blame the Baha'is for that, never the Christians. That is patently unfair.

Then whenever a Baha'i tries to build a bridge with Christians you tear it down, but apparently you cannot help yourself so keep going.

Open your eyes. Christians have never tried to build bridges with Baha'is , and they refuse to walk over any bridges we try to build.
Open your eyes. All Christian ever do is say that Baha'u'llah is a false prophet and Jesus is the Only Way.
I do not need to produce evidence to prove that is the truth because the evidence is splattered all over this forum.

No, I do not tell Christians that they have interpreted their Scriptures wrong. I only post the Scriptures and sometimes I offer my own interpretation.

 

[Trailblazer]

And how does a person show that they truly love Jesus?

By crying out to Jesus for help, as I often do. I do not cry out to Baha'u'llah for help. I have a closer heart connection with Jesus.

 

[Trailblazer]

Firstly, one is not able to control the response others will make, you will note I took the topic of bridge building out into another OP.

With all due respect, the bridges I was trying to build have nothing to do with the Baha'i Peace Plan.
I was trying to build personal bridges between Christians and Baha'is
I should have known it would never work, but I am an eternal optimist!

 

[Trailblazer]

But, for a Baha'i, what is it that they know and love about Jesus? Like you say, it's probably what she has been told about Jesus from the Baha'i writings. Because I doubt very much she's reading and believing what the NT says about Jesus.

I missed this part.

I know about Jesus mostly from the New Testament and from conversing with Christians. I know very little about Jesus from the Baha'i Writings.
I believe the teachings of Jesus in the New Testament which is all I need to know. The miracle stories mean nothing to me.

Most of what I love about Jesus I got from the New Testament, as I can feel His Love and His Spirit shining through the verses.

I also love Jesus because of what Baha'u'llah wrote about Jesus, and I often cry when reading it.

Bahá'í Reference Library - Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, Pages 85-86

 

[CG Didymus]

Sometimes when building bridges, it requires the removal of the old foundations. The new bridge being built will take old engineering concepts and incorporate them into the design.

To build this bridge there has to be some demolition and removal. Born Again Christians aren't going to blow up their foundational beliefs to get along with and find some common ground with Baha'is.

But what are Baha'is going to demolish and remove? Probably nothing. Baha'is believe they have the absolute, infallible truth from God. Baha'is would have to do the demolition of the Christians beliefs. And Baha'is do try. Just like TB with her "Jesus said he's never coming back" quotes.

Loverofhumanity is still the only Baha'i I see trying to build bridges. No matter how nicely you put it. the other Baha'is are still saying "We right and you're wrong." But they are saying it to people who are saying the same thing to you, the Baha'is.

But you know how to get along with people you don't know. You get to know them. But it's probably not their religious beliefs that is the first or even the second or third thing you get to know about them.

Here, it's too late. Most of us know what Baha'is believe. And Baha'is know what most Christians believe. But how are Baha'is going to build a peaceful world when they can't connect with the "true believer" types of people in the other religions? Because, most Baha'is, seem to be the "true believer" types too.

 

[Eli G]

Did they give you the spiel about how everyone will be resurrected and live forever on Earth in a restored Garden of Eden, and how Jesus will rule over Earth from heaven?

Imo, those are the most absurd of their beliefs. From what I know, I think that their other beliefs are reasonable, but of course I do not know all of their beliefs.

It's completely ridiculous that as a Christian, I am expected to interpret the Bible from a Baha'i perspective.

Moreover, I find it astonishing that you claim your religious leader regarded the Bible as a crucial source of divine wisdom and Jesus as a singular Savior, yet you deem the teachings of Jesus and the Bible, like everlasting life on earth and resurrection, "absurd".

Clearly, following humans is a snare... Nonetheless, sorry to tell you that your opinion about Christian issues is irrelevant; the perspective of a Muslim about Jesus and the Bible should not concern a Christian in the slightest.

The resurrection of Jesus is a sine qua non teaching for the followers of Jesus, from the first to the last. It was a prediction of Jesus throughout his earthly ministry and it is indisputable that it was fulfilled.

Indeed, a person who says she has no reason to believe in the Bible has nothing to say about what it teaches.