Where are the people?

[Aupmanyav]

The Baha'i Faith is not like all the other religions since we have the Covenant of Baha'u'llah that prevents fragmentation of the religion.
None of the older religions have such a Covenant.

Dictatorial, Abrahamic religions are like that, Islam and Bahai more so. Those who do not agree are purged from Bahai Community.

At the time of Shoghi's death, ".. all living male descendants of Baháʼu'lláh had been declared Covenant-breakers by either ʻAbdu'l-Bahá or Shoghi Effendi, leaving no suitable living candidates."

Shoghi Effendi - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Not like Hinduism or Buddhism which give one a lot of freedom, even to the extent that one can be an atheist.

 

[ppp]

Alternate logic to what? To your logic, which is only what you consider logical.
Their own personal truth? You mean as opposed to your own personal truth?
This is all about Ego.

Only according to you who claims to have their own type of logic. Logic is the name for a set of processes that was discovered, codified and tested long, long before I ever existed. A process whose reliability is demonstrated every minute of every day all over the world. A process that you depend on every minute of your every day, even while you are denying being bound by it. You can shout to the top of the hills about my ego, but between the two of us, I am on the only one not claiming to be special. That is all you.

Quote me saying that or stop making a straw man.

My providing a quote would only matter if you deferred to boring old syllogistic logic. But you are above all that. You have your own logic. Remember?

That is just an excuse for avoiding what I said.

You didn't say it. You copy and pasted what someone else said.
Use your own brain processes.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

This is preaching, proselytization, TransmutingSoul; and it is against the Forum rules. Not every one believes in your God or your prophet.
We have thousands of Gods, Goddesses and sages.

Go jump in the lake.

 

[danieldemol]

Go jump in the lake.

So much for unity in my view

 

[Trailblazer]

So much for unity in my view

'Unity in your view' is for Baha'is to take all the false accusations and denigration from people on this thread.
That's not unity.

Go ahead, jump on the band wagon. The only person you humiliate is yourself.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Go jump in the lake.

I am not a very good swimmer. I won't. I like to keep my feet on ground rather than in clouds.

 

[danieldemol]

'Unity in your view' is for Baha'is to take all the false accusations and denigration from people on this thread.

To the contrary, *if* someone makes false accusations against you then you should refute them. Telling them to go jump in the lake is hardly refutation in my view.

That's not unity.

Neither is accusing me of your strawmen in my view.

Go ahead, jump on the band wagon. The only person you humiliate is yourself.

I dont feel humiliated in the slightest

 

[Audie]

Sure. According to people with alternate logic and their own personal truth.

I will remind you that you explicitly said that without your religious beliefs that it would not happen.

As for the rest of your posts, I will never read your cut and pastes or anything that resembles cut and pastes. It is slack. Do you own work.

After I get the idea, more about someone's
cult and its alternate reality is not something
I want to hear.

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

Go jump in the lake.

That offended you? He told you that you were violating forum rules proselytizing, and he was quite polite about it.

I never object to proselytizing. If the Baha'i didn't attempt to promote their religion here, I would still know almost nothing about it. This is how we learn that Baha'ism inherited the Abrahamic homophobia and other sexual restrictions. It here we see how this religion claims to be unifying as it rejects other religions' doctrines like they reject Baha'ism. Here we see the words of the prophet that are thought by adherents to be a wise blueprint for man's future and evidence of a deity. And it is through them that we see the clannish, defensive posturing of its members as they routinely complain about being attacked, and your comment above. You apparently felt attacked. Maybe you see this as a personal attack as well.

 

[Audie]

It has always been God’s purpose to usher in, in ways only God can bring about, the Great, Golden Age of a long-divided, a long-afflicted humanity.

Religious beliefs do not make anything happen. God ushered it in and people will make it happen by bringing it about.

Logic, " alternate" or otherwise has little
merit when it's based on premises you
make up.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Never before have more done as much for as many. More people live secure lives of relative leisure and abundance than ever in history, and the religions played no part in advancing the human condition. That's humanism's legacy, which gave us science and the modern, liberal, secular, social democracy. In the meantime, the religions say, "Love one another" and do nothing - like yours.

Then you've got your work cut out for you spreading the word, but good luck with that. I've seen much of it here, and it's been ineffective at attracting people. We mostly see it leading to division here.

Then why go to the Baha'i faith for answers? If I have any opinions in common with that religion (or any other), it's coincidence.

Just like all of the religions. They're divisive. They fragment. When do you see them doing the opposite? I invited a few Baha'i here on RF to join the humanists, but got no takers. We've already got multiple secular organizations and governments promoting humanist values and ideals such as the United Nations, NATO, the Western social democracy's governments, Greenpeace, Doctors Without Borders, and the like. The Baha'i can join us. Why haven't they yet? Not enough religion in humanism?

What you say is so true. There has been so much progress made by some wonderful people. But there’s a long way to go in accomplishing things like cleaning the environment and atmosphere and establishing world peace and it requires the cooperation of all humanity if we would accomplish these goals. The more of us working together towards these goals will hasten the day of their realisation. Until enough of us humans come together, the problems and suffering will continue.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Only according to you who claims to have their own type of logic.

Ah, you misunderstand Trilblazer, PPP. Trailblazer has no use of logic. See my signature.

The more of us working together towards these goals will hasten the day of their realisation. Until enough of us humans come together, the problems and suffering will continue.

That will not happen unless we abandon our religious anthems. The sound is too loud and jarring.

 

[Trailblazer]

I am not a very good swimmer. I won't. I like to keep my feet on ground rather than in clouds.

You can walk on the ground but I prefer to have my head in the clouds, thinking of lofty things.

 

[Trailblazer]

That offended you? He told you that you were violating forum rules proselytizing, and he was quite polite about it.

With all due respect, it is the job of the staff to tell people when they are violating forum rules, and they do their job well.
There was nothing polite about what he said, it was snarky. When the staff points out a rule violation, they are polite.

@Aupmanyav said: Not every one believes in your God or your prophet.

So what? Not everyone believes in anyone else's God or prophet, or their atheist beliefs, but they still post about them on this forum.

 

[ppp]

Ah, you misunderstand Trilblazer, PPP. Trailblazer has no use of logic. See my signature.

I know. She is just inconsistent in admitting it.

 

[Trailblazer]

After I get the idea, more about someone's
cult and its alternate reality is not something
I want to hear.

The don't read posts on a religious forum.
Problem solved.

 

[Trailblazer]

Trailblazer has no use of logic.

God speaks, so we had better believe Him.

 

[Trailblazer]

I know. She is just inconsistent in admitting it.

Don't you have anything better to do than look at what 'you believe' are the faults of others?
But thanks for reminding me why I am a Baha'i. I am so grateful to atheists for that.

26: O SON OF BEING! How couldst thou forget thine own faults and busy thyself with the faults of others? Whoso doeth this is accursed of Me.

27: O SON OF MAN! Breathe not the sins of others so long as thou art thyself a sinner. Shouldst thou transgress this command, accursed wouldst thou be, and to this I bear witness.
The Hidden Words of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 10

66: O EMIGRANTS! The tongue I have designed for the mention of Me, defile it not with detraction. If the fire of self overcome you, remember your own faults and not the faults of My creatures, inasmuch as every one of you knoweth his own self better than he knoweth others.
The Hidden Words of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 45

 

[Truthseeker]

So much for unity in my view

Baha'is are imperfect, like all humans. He shouldn't have said that in response.

 

[CG Didymus]

I would offer that it is the Lesser Peace that is built upon a political unity.

Thanks for clarifying that.

The Most Great Peace I see Baha’u’llah has given a vision of is of a distant time in the future when the peoples of the world will live together in peace and unity as members of one faith. Only then will Universal justice be established based on adherence to the law of God. It is then that a new civilization based on spiritual values will come into being, this is what I see as the Most Great Peace.

And yes, this is what Baha'is believe the future holds. But other religions have a slightly different view. But it seems obvious that the world is having some problems that is forcing people to change their beliefs and behavior.

I think they Baha'i views are necessary and are important to be included in the conversation/debate, but Baha'is too often say it in a way that comes off as the Baha'is have the only way and the real truth. And that's probably what Baha'is do believe. But by saying it in such a way, you know, it's going to upset some of us and get us to respond in a negative way... In other words, cause disunity.

So, I still say, it's up to the Baha'is, if they believe in unity, to find ways to create unity between yourselves and those of us that don't believe like you.