Who caused Satan or the devil rebel

[Monk Of Reason]

People who have adopted true Christianity - including former criminals - ' put on ', so to speak, a new peaceful personality. So, in that sense true Christianity brings peace.
When people oppose one becoming Christian, then they are disrupting peace. That is why Matthew 10 vs 34-36 mentions people close to you who oppose you cause division.
Even Jesus, at first, was thought ' mad ' - John 10 v 20 - by some relatives.
Often what they oppose is what Jesus said to say to do at Matthew 24 v 14 that God's kingdom would be preached internationally before the end comes of all badness on earth. They often oppose such preaching work - Matthew 10 vs 16-23 - so it is especially painful when family members or loved ones reject what Jesus taught.

I've seen a lot of people who "change" because of Christianity. It usually never lasts. But don't feel bad it usually never lasts when people "change". But when they do its usually for profound reasons after hitting rock bottom. Many people change but there is nothing singling out Christianity as being more efficient or even efficient in the first place of changing people's lives from terrible to good.

Isn't a God involved in religion. Yet, isn't Buddhism supposed to be enlightenment without God ?

The root of biblical law [ such as the former Constitution of the Mosaic Law for ancient Israel ] is Not rooted in conscience, but the root Source of biblical law is the God of the Bible.

And that does not make it superior. In fact it makes it inferior as the bible is yet to be substanciated.

One can Not repent for sinning against God's spirit - Hebrews 6 vs 4-6; Matthew 12 v 32 - whereas a person can repent from murder, rape, torture, etc. And is instructed to absolutely do so at 2nd Peter 3 v 9. Repent so as not to perish - be destroyed .

Yeah. See what I mean? fishy...

The fruitage of God's spirit - Galatians 5 vs 22,23 - does exist because it's aspects are:
love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faith, mildness and self-control, and against such things there is no law. Who was ever arrested for keeping those existing qualities ?

Who said anything about being arrested?

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I've seen a lot of people who "change" because of Christianity. It usually never lasts. But don't feel bad it usually never lasts when people "change". But when they do its usually for profound reasons after hitting rock bottom. Many people change but there is nothing singling out Christianity as being more efficient or even efficient in the first place of changing people's lives from terrible to good.
And that does not make it superior. In fact it makes it inferior as the bible is yet to be substantiated.
Yeah. See what I mean? fishy...
Who said anything about being arrested?

Not about being arrested, but that there is No law against Galatians 5:22,23
Who was ever arrested for cultivating those qualities? Not going to happen.

Genuine ' wheat ' Christianity usually does last. It is the fake ' weed/tares ' Christians who do Not last. Jesus cautioned at Matthew 24:13 to ' endure to the end ' if one wants to win or finish the race of eternal life. So, we either endure being faithful til one's death, or endure today until the coming ' time of separation ' on earth of Matthew 25:31,32
So, change and enduring as a ' wheat ' Christian is more than just changing for the better.
Anyone can be a neighborly good Samaritan coming to the aid of another in times of trouble.

The Bible will be more than substantiated because soon mankind will hear the cry of ' Peace and Security ' from the powers that be, and that is, so to speak, a final signal, or precursor to the coming great tribulation of Revelation 7:14; 1st Thessalonian 5:2,3

 

[J0stories]

Oh I am well aware that you are not a Christian.The fact of the matter is that Lucifer is not satan's name.You and many others are incorrect.Whether you accept it or not,you are still incorrect.

Isn't that somewhat presumptive? The idea of 'satan' or however you wish to name the concept was taken fro older myths, as was your own precepts for the bible. The bible is merely a retelling of Sumerian, Persian, Egyptian and other stories, such as the story of Gilgamesh, Horus and his parents, catal huyuk and more. I have no issue with One's faith, and I am a studied theologian, but you speak as though you are the only one who is correct on these matters. Almost all these matters are up for debate. None are factual.

 

[Monk Of Reason]

Not about being arrested, but that there is No law against Galatians 5:22,23
Who was ever arrested for cultivating those qualities? Not going to happen.

Genuine ' wheat ' Christianity usually does last. It is the fake ' weed/tares ' Christians who do Not last. Jesus cautioned at Matthew 24:13 to ' endure to the end ' if one wants to win or finish the race of eternal life. So, we either endure being faithful til one's death, or endure today until the coming ' time of separation ' on earth of Matthew 25:31,32
So, change and enduring as a ' wheat ' Christian is more than just changing for the better.
Anyone can be a neighborly good Samaritan coming to the aid of another in times of trouble.

The Bible will be more than substantiated because soon mankind will hear the cry of ' Peace and Security ' from the powers that be, and that is, so to speak, a final signal, or precursor to the coming great tribulation of Revelation 7:14; 1st Thessalonian 5:2,3

I still view it as a cop out. If it is successful due to individuals then it was god but if it failed then they weren't true Christians to begin with. From the point of scrutiny and skepticism there is no where near enough evidence to say that Christianity has any real measurable gain in these "changes" expect perhaps as a popular medium for certain changes to be made but the medium itself didn't seem to make a difference and in some cases can be identified as an inhibitor of these changes. But that is a discussion for another day.

If you want to stick to the idea that the bible will some day be fully accepted then by all means. Just know that it doesn't amount to any kind of argument till it actually happens which in my belief probably will never happen.

 

[Thief]

I was building off the belief/position/idea (maybe mostly Baptist, Pentecostal, and Catholic, though I'm not really sure who teaches it and who doesn't) that we (even those of us in modern times) killed Jesus.

Try working from the notion....let the dead bury the dead.

The Carpenter died for cause of a bad argument circling around Him.
The argument remains.

It now circles around you (as you brought it forward)

 

[Thief]

A God is not worthy if he cannot hate everyone the theist hates.

Regards
DL

Not sure where you are going with this.

Worthy to whom?.....you?
Justified by His hatred dealt on others?.....with you as an exception?

Lines drawn are the result of a skillful reasoning.

Please continue.

 

[Nada]

Isn't that somewhat presumptive? The idea of 'satan' or however you wish to name the concept was taken fro older myths, as was your own precepts for the bible. The bible is merely a retelling of Sumerian, Persian, Egyptian and other stories, such as the story of Gilgamesh, Horus and his parents, catal huyuk and more. I have no issue with One's faith, and I am a studied theologian, but you speak as though you are the only one who is correct on these matters. Almost all these matters are up for debate. None are factual.

Actually you have it backwards.All of the stories were taken from the holy scriptures.When the incident at Babel happened,that is when all the languages were confused,and the people spread throughout the rest of the known world.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I still view it as a cop out. If it is successful due to individuals then it was god but if it failed then they weren't true Christians to begin with. From the point of scrutiny and skepticism there is no where near enough evidence to say that Christianity has any real measurable gain in these "changes" expect perhaps as a popular medium for certain changes to be made but the medium itself didn't seem to make a difference and in some cases can be identified as an inhibitor of these changes. But that is a discussion for another day.
If you want to stick to the idea that the bible will some day be fully accepted then by all means. Just know that it doesn't amount to any kind of argument till it actually happens which in my belief probably will never happen.

Christianity [ genuine Christianity ] has real measurable gain ' changes ' in that non-Christians can be neighborly good Samaritans in doing fine works of heart, whereas genuine ' wheat ' Christians will do the same ' spiritual work ' which Jesus did at Luke 4:43.
Jesus focused and centered his teaching and preaching on the spreading of the good news of God's kingdom. Jesus gave that same ' spiritual work ' assignment to modern-day followers to spread the good news of God's kingdom on an international scale as mentioned at Matthew 24:14; Acts 1:8.

Never happen under this system of things will the Bible be fully accepted.
It's under Jesus' coming 1000-year kingdom reign over earth when the Bible will be fully accepted because Jesus, as king [ or ruler ] of God's kingdom, will usher in global Peace on earth among men of goodwill. The wicked will be gone forever - Rev. 19:11,15; Isaiah 11:3,4 - the words from Jesus' mouth will rid the earth of all wickedness. Any who want to bring ruin to earth will be brought to ruin. - Rev. 11:18 B.

We are nearing the coming ' time of separation' on earth when the humble ' sheep'-like people will be separated from the haughty ' goat'-like people. The humble people can remain alive on earth and continue living on earth right into the start of Jesus' millennium-long day of bringing benefits to earth. Benefits such as seeing the return of the Genesis ' tree of life ' for all of earth's nations as mentioned at Rev. 22:2.

 

[J0stories]

Actually you have it backwards.All of the stories were taken from the holy scriptures.When the incident at Babel happened,that is when all the languages were confused,and the people spread throughout the rest of the known world.

Sorry but you are mistaken here. The stories you claim are all taken from older myths and legends, even a cursory study of theology, a real study, would prove that to anyone willing to have an open mind. If you have not studied all the world's faiths, or at least the majority, you will see the clear collolaries that exist in all faiths. Christianity stole so much from other older faiths. I see that that is something you may find unpalatable, but I suggest you read Karen king, a history of God, or perhaps some of the things written by Matthew fox or Bart erham.

 

[Nada]

Sorry but you are mistaken here. The stories you claim are all taken from older myths and legends, even a cursory study of theology, a real study, would prove that to anyone willing to have an open mind. If you have not studied all the world's faiths, or at least the majority, you will see the clear collolaries that exist in all faiths. Christianity stole so much from other older faiths. I see that that is something you may find unpalatable, but I suggest you read Karen king, a history of God, or perhaps some of the things written by Matthew fox or Bart erham.

Actually you have it backwards.It is all the religions in the world that have taken all the stories from the Holy scriptures in the OT.When Jehovah God confused the languages in the great city of Babylon all the people went their different ways.All the people left from one region near modern day Iraq.They all went in different directions from there.To the north,south east and west.So over the years old stories that were learned early on by these people were later told in their own languages and told over and over again.It became their own and the culture of these people carried on.All the different people all over the world have the same stories and tell them according to the way they are.It all came from the same source in the beginning when Babylon sinned against God.

That is why you have the same great flood story all over the world.It all came from the one same source.It has now been spread by all the people who left Babylon and spread throughout the entire world.

Do not get confused with all the speculation on dates.Some people and scientist are funny.They will say it is between 100,000 and 20 million years old.Lol...

 

[J0stories]

Actually you have it backwards.It is all the religions in the world that have taken all the stories from the Holy scriptures in the OT.When Jehovah God confused the languages in the great city of Babylon all the people went their different ways.All the people left from one region near modern day Iraq.They all went in different directions from there.To the north,south east and west.So over the years old stories that were learned early on by these people were later told in their own languages and told over and over again.It became their own and the culture of these people carried on.All the different people all over the world have the same stories and tell them according to the way they are.It all came from the same source in the beginning when Babylon sinned against God.

That is why you have the same great flood story all over the world.It all came from the one same source.It has now been spread by all the people who left Babylon and spread throughout the entire world.

Do not get confused with all the speculation on dates.Some people and scientist are funny.They will say it is between 100,000 and 20 million years old.Lol...

Sorry but I refuse to argue with someone who repeats the same thing over and over. There is NO proof that the stories came from your book, yet there is lots that it came from older sources. Do have a nice night.

 

[Nada]

Sorry but I refuse to argue with someone who repeats the same thing over and over. There is NO proof that the stories came from your book, yet there is lots that it came from older sources. Do have a nice night.

Oh..I had no idea you were arguing.Did I miss something? Lol.. One comment is arguing? Lol..
Thats so sweet.I will have a nice night.Thank you.You have one as well.

 

[Monk Of Reason]

Christianity [ genuine Christianity ] has real measurable gain ' changes ' in that non-Christians can be neighborly good Samaritans in doing fine works of heart, whereas genuine ' wheat ' Christians will do the same ' spiritual work ' which Jesus did at Luke 4:43.
Jesus focused and centered his teaching and preaching on the spreading of the good news of God's kingdom. Jesus gave that same ' spiritual work ' assignment to modern-day followers to spread the good news of God's kingdom on an international scale as mentioned at Matthew 24:14; Acts 1:8.

Never happen under this system of things will the Bible be fully accepted.
It's under Jesus' coming 1000-year kingdom reign over earth when the Bible will be fully accepted because Jesus, as king [ or ruler ] of God's kingdom, will usher in global Peace on earth among men of goodwill. The wicked will be gone forever - Rev. 19:11,15; Isaiah 11:3,4 - the words from Jesus' mouth will rid the earth of all wickedness. Any who want to bring ruin to earth will be brought to ruin. - Rev. 11:18 B.

We are nearing the coming ' time of separation' on earth when the humble ' sheep'-like people will be separated from the haughty ' goat'-like people. The humble people can remain alive on earth and continue living on earth right into the start of Jesus' millennium-long day of bringing benefits to earth. Benefits such as seeing the return of the Genesis ' tree of life ' for all of earth's nations as mentioned at Rev. 22:2.

That is your belief on the subject. It isn't fact. And part of the problem of "true Christianity" and any measurable change is that if there isn't measurable change then it wasn't considered "true Christianity". If I was doing free throws in basketball and I only ever counted the baskets I made as "real throws" or "a real try" because all of the ones that I missed I did on purpose or wasn't seriously trying then my "real free throw" rate would be 100%.

 

[Smart_Guy]

Shouldn't the question be "what" caused Satan to rebel?

 

[J0stories]

Oh..I had no idea you were arguing.Did I miss something? Lol.. One comment is arguing? Lol..
Thats so sweet.I will have a nice night.Thank you.You have one as well.

No, but you were baiting and that requires a prevaricating nature I do not have. You can believe whatever you like but it was my impression that this was a discussion board, as in differing points of view. You seem to have but one with no desire to listen to other POV.

 

[Nada]

Shouldn't the question be "what" caused Satan to rebel?

Selfishness and pride.

 

[Nada]

No, but you were baiting and that requires a prevaricating nature I do not have. You can believe whatever you like but it was my impression that this was a discussion board, as in differing points of view. You seem to have but one with no desire to listen to other POV.

Baiting? Come on now...... Your assumptions have nothing to do with the truth.
I have one desire you say? Wow,you have it all figured out huh.

 

[Smart_Guy]

Selfishness and pride.

I'd say extreme arrogance and pride

 

[URAVIP2ME]

That is your belief on the subject. It isn't fact. And part of the problem of "true Christianity" and any measurable change is that if there isn't measurable change then it wasn't considered "true Christianity". If I was doing free throws in basketball and I only ever counted the baskets I made as "real throws" or "a real try" because all of the ones that I missed I did on purpose or wasn't seriously trying then my "real free throw" rate would be 100%.

' measurable change ' ? Was there measurable change in Jesus' day ?
One person calculated that out of all the people Jesus reached that only 1% became his follower. If a person was running for office and only received 1% of the votes would there be measurable change, of course not.

We are Not talking about quantity but quality.
Being on the narrow path of Matthew chapter 7.
Jesus separated people into genuine ' wheat ' Christians and fake ' weed/tares' Christians.
Jesus separates people into humble ' sheep' or as haughty ' goats ' at Matthew 25 vs 31,32.
So, we do Not look at the world scene for measurable change, but individuals that fall into the category following Jesus 'new' commandment of John 13 vs 34,35 to change to have the same self-sacrificing love for others as Jesus had.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Shouldn't the question be "what" caused Satan to rebel?

Good point ^above ^ as to what caused or baited Satan to rebel.

James 1:14,15 helps shed light on what caused Satan to rebel.

Starting with verse 13 it mentions that when under trial, lot no one say: "I am being tried by God". For with evil things God can not be tried, nor does He Himself try anyone.(14) But each one is tried by being drawn out and enticed by his own desire. (15) Then the desire, when it has become fertile, gives birth to sin; in turn sin, when it has been carried out, brings forth death.