who or what created god

[payak]

surely the great god can restore our sight or protect our eyess after we look at him.
he has the power to do all.

but that would be a good story to explain to people why they cannot see him in order to make believers out of them

 

[Daviso452]

it is logical to choose someone from among ourselves as a prophet than to send a different being or for example to make a dog a prophet, would anyone focus on the message of a talking dog or on the abnormal nature of a talking dog?

Moses peace be upon him asked Allah to show himself so he could see him, the mountain on which he said he would appear collapsed and turned to ruble. Moses himself fainted. one of the attributes of Allah is that he is the source of Light, he logically is brighter than the sun, (the power station where we get electricity has more energy than any home because that is the source). i will make you a challenge, look at the sun for over a minute without loosing your sight or being affected without the aid of anything protective to the eyes. if you cannot do that, then how will you possibly view Allah if he appeared?

and lastly, if he made us magically believe then life could not be a test because we would have our free will taken away since we all magically believe. and that nullifies the the the need to test us on earth and should all be put into heaven.

So your all-powerful God cannot come to earth without blinding us? That would mean there is something he cannot do, and thus is not all-powerful.

But with regards to free will, we are not as in-control as you may think. We cannot control our sexual orientation. We cannot control what we find appealing. We don't even fully control what we believe; many people, atheists and theists alike, when having a certain belief on that matter, are more likely to believe items that support it than items they don't, aka a bias.

These are all things programmed into our brain. For some reason or another, that is how our brains work. However, as we all know, we can learn to control many of these things. But it requires a tremendou amount of time and will=power.

Many people may think they have control of their lives, but most of the time they are interpreting things they sense a certain way, and thus their actions are affected by it.

I understand you will be requiring proof. I am attempting to trace exactly where this is, however if you have Itunes look up "Is free will an illusion?" and listen to the podcast episode by "Stuff to blow your mind," which is one of many podcasts made from How Stuff Works .com, a company created by the discovery channel, which, unless think they are part of some conspiracy, is an incredibly reliable source.

FYI I am sorry for having posted all that. I just didn't want you to think I pulled that out of my ***. I am unable to find the exact study at the moment, but I will when I can.

 

[Cordoba]

because he's "most awesome" and planned to fill hell with humans and djinn, huh?

that's no explanation, that's not even a nice try.

That is not the purpose of our creation

God created us to get to know Him by our free will, and to love Him as He loves us

He has prepared a place in Heaven for each human being, and it's up to each individual to decide whether they want an eternal happy life in Paradise or not

It's a free world, and it's a free choice...

 

[Cordoba]

Does this apply to ALL the words that are claimed to be gods?

The right thing to do is find out which is God's true revelation

 

[Cordoba]

The universe didn't really "start" around 13 billion years ago, more like began doing something, being that scientific theories state it always existed in a singularity or came of energy converting into mass.

This is God's description in the Qur'an of what happened at the start of the universe:

{Have those who disbelieved not considered that the heavens and the earth were a joined entity, and We separated them and made from water every living thing? Then will they not believe?} (21:30)

 

[LegionOnomaMoi]

believers always claim there must be a god, what else could have created all things.

It's turtles all the way down.

 

[rusra02]

believers always claim there must be a god, what else could have created all things.
what then created god?

And why play faith based games rather then just showing him or herself.

If god is so intelligent, surely all religions would be accepted by him as he would understand our ignorance in following the wrong one and judge us on our behaviour, not our choice of worship.

If he is so choosy about what we follow that would indicate he has a large ego that needs worshiping to satisfy him, further indicating he is imperfect.

If there is a god who kwows all it would be foolish to think we can begin to understand him, behave in a manner that never hurts or effects others and surely he should be pleased.

If we faulter common sense should tell mankind that a god of such wisdom should understand we cannot help it as we are ignorant.

Since God created us, he know best what we need to be happy. One must remember that the world we live in is not God's doing. While God created the heavens and the earth, human society with its confusion of religions, national divisions, and spirit of selfishness, hatred, and greed are really the works of Satan, the one the Bible calls "the ruler of the world." (John 14:30, 16:11) The Bible also states that "Satan...is misleading the entire inhabited earth." (Revelation 12:9) It is Satan, not God, that is the source of the lies and confusion so prevalent today. (2 Corinthians 4:4)

 

[Gharib]

surely the great god can restore our sight or protect our eyess after we look at him.
he has the power to do all.

but that would be a good story to explain to people why they cannot see him in order to make believers out of them

the believers will see God in paradise. to see him now would make everyone a believer. no one would deny Gods existence if God appeared. that would nullify the 'test' which we are undergoing.

moreover, why do you assume that God is somehow obliged to 'restore our sight' after he appears?

untill 3 days ago you didn't know about some guy under the name eselam in a religious forum called 'Religious Forums' so if someone told you about me you could have doubted me, can you doubt that i am real now that we have replied to the posts of one another?

 

[zenzero]

Friend payak,

who or what created god

God is simply a word developed by humans and used as a label for an understanding of something that is eternal and each being is part of that including you and me.
So in effect, if you understand your own self understand that you too are a part of IT.

Love & rgds

 

[Gharib]

So your all-powerful God cannot come to earth without blinding us? That would mean there is something he cannot do, and thus is not all-powerful.

lol i find your statement quite funny, how long did you think about the above before writing it?

God can do anything, i used that example to reason with you that we cannot perceive God in this human form, we have limits, everything that God has created has limits. we would not be able to see God if he appeared on earth, however, we will see him in paradise. so God can do everything, it's us who can't take/comprehend everything. is it the sun who is weak and at fault for us not being able to see it without hurting our eyes, or is it our fault?

But with regards to free will, we are not as in-control as you may think. We cannot control our sexual orientation. We cannot control what we find appealing. We don't even fully control what we believe; many people, atheists and theists alike, when having a certain belief on that matter, are more likely to believe items that support it than items they don't, aka a bias.

your statement is somewhat true, in islam we believe in the Qadr (decree) of Allah. it's something that Allah wills to happen and it will happen.

These are all things programmed into our brain. For some reason or another, that is how our brains work. However, as we all know, we can learn to control many of these things. But it requires a tremendou amount of time and will=power.

yes will power is the main thing. muslims believe that everyone is born a muslim, in the natural state of islamic monotheism what we call Fitrah

Many people may think they have control of their lives, but most of the time they are interpreting things they sense a certain way, and thus their actions are affected by it.

but the important thing is they make the choice. if you make a choice based on something that doesn't mean you had no free will in the matter, free will means making a choice. animals don't have this.

I understand you will be requiring proof. I am attempting to trace exactly where this is, however if you have Itunes look up "Is free will an illusion?" and listen to the podcast episode by "Stuff to blow your mind," which is one of many podcasts made from How Stuff Works .com, a company created by the discovery channel, which, unless think they are part of some conspiracy, is an incredibly reliable source.

no need to, i ask for proof when it is needed.

FYI I am sorry for having posted all that. I just didn't want you to think I pulled that out of my ***. I am unable to find the exact study at the moment, but I will when I can.

if you wish to discuss free will, there are quite a number of threads on that topic, i can find one and continue there is you wish.

 

[McBell]

The right thing to do is find out which is God's true revelation

Ah, so it is a guessing game.
Better hope you are right...

 

[Cordoba]

Ah, so it is a guessing game...

No, it's not guessing

It's using intellect, one of our most precious gifts, by reading, researching, comparing and deep thinking

 

[Cordoba]

Please check this answer to the question:

Who Created The Creator?

QUOTE

It is important to note here that everything in the universe has a beginning; it is because of this that everything needs a cause, whereas Allah does not have a beginning and He does not need a cause.

Einstein has shown that time is the fourth dimension contiguous with space. In other words, we live in a world that is a space-time continuum.

And as Allah is the Creator of time as well as space, He is not limited either by space or time, so He has no beginning in time. Therefore, He does not have a cause.

Also, there is enough evidence that the universe had a beginning. This can be shown from the laws of thermodynamics, the most fundamental laws of the physical sciences.

Now the question is: Is it possible to have a universe with a beginning, but without a cause?
The answer is obviously in the negative for the following reasons ....

UNQUOTE

Who Created the Creator? - Islamic Creed - counsels - OnIslam.net

 

[waitasec]

Please check this answer to the question:

Who Created The Creator?

QUOTE

It is important to note here that everything in the universe has a beginning; it is because of this that everything needs a cause, whereas Allah does not have a beginning and He does not need a cause.

Einstein has shown that time is the fourth dimension contiguous with space. In other words, we live in a world that is a space-time continuum.

And as Allah is the Creator of time as well as space, He is not limited either by space or time, so He has no beginning in time. Therefore, He does not have a cause.

Also, there is enough evidence that the universe had a beginning. This can be shown from the laws of thermodynamics, the most fundamental laws of the physical sciences.

Now the question is: Is it possible to have a universe with a beginning, but without a cause?
The answer is obviously in the negative for the following reasons ....

UNQUOTE

Who Created the Creator? - Islamic Creed - counsels - OnIslam.net

baseless claims...
all of it.

 

[Cordoba]

God is The First and He is The Last, Waitasec

That is how He describes Himself in The Qur'an, His "letter" to each one of us

Only He is Eternal

Everything else has a start and therefore has a cause which precedes it

Only an Eternal God would not have anything else that precedes Him

And He urges us in The Qur'an to read, think, reflect and use our intellect ...

 

[waitasec]

God is The First and He is The Last, Waitasec

a baseless claim...

That is how He describes Himself in The Qur'an, His "letter" to each one of us

does the rain need to explain itself,
or is it experienced empirically?

Only He is Eternal

a baseless claim

Everything else has a start and therefore has a cause which precedes it

Only an Eternal God would not have anything else that precedes Him

same can be applied to the universe

And He urges us in The Qur'an to read, think, reflect and use our intellect ...

skepticism is utilizing intellect...
especially skepticism concerning......baseless claims.

 

[Cordoba]

Too much skepticism can be counter-productive

My only advise for anyone searching for the truth in an objective way is to Read first God's final message to us, reflect, then reach an objective conclusion, whether convinced or not convinced

At the end of the day it's an individual free choice

But let it be an informed choice ...

 

[McBell]

No, it's not guessing

It's using intellect, one of our most precious gifts, by reading, researching, comparing and deep thinking

But at the end of the day, once you remove your prejudices, bias, wishful thinking, ratifications, etc. it is still nothing but a guess as to which of the thousands of claimed gods is the one true god.

You are still doing nothing more than picking your favourite and going with it.

 

[McBell]

It is important to note here that everything in the universe has a beginning;

Yet the whole point of this article to show that this statement is not true...

 

[McBell]

Too much skepticism can be counter-productive

I agree.
The problem here is that you are not giving anything but baseless claims and then using more baseless claims to support your baseless claims.

My only advise for anyone searching for the truth in an objective way is to Read first God's final message to us, reflect, then reach an objective conclusion, whether convinced or not convinced

What truth are you going to find if all you can get from the one offering the "truth" is nothing but baseless claims?

At the end of the day it's an individual free choice
But let it be an informed choice ...

It would help if you were to start informing instead of merely tossing out baseless claim after baseless claim.