Why are there still Monkeys?

[idav]

I didn't claim this.

It was a questioI to see what you claim. It can be both, sometimes one, sometimes another. Determined from the beginning while allowing the freedom of choice, not just in humans but in nature there is a sort of volition, choice which is random to us. Else you are saying god just makes it appear random.

 

[FearGod]

You should pay better attention to and heed your signature....

If you can convince me then i'll be more than happy to support your ideas.

 

[FearGod]

It was a questioI to see what you claim. It can be both, sometimes one, sometimes another. Determined from the beginning while allowing the freedom of choice, not just in humans but in nature there is a sort of volition, choice which is random to us. Else you are saying god just makes it appear random.

Do you mean that things including us whether if were already predetermined or randomly occurred.

 

[idav]

Do you mean that things including us whether if were already predetermined or randomly occurred.

Yes because at the micro level, what we are bulit of, is inherently probablistic.

 

[FearGod]

Yes because at the micro level, what we are bulit of, is inherently probablistic.

Yes of course, we don't choose what we want to be.

Do you think it works if we can choose what we want to be ?

100% will choose to be the boss or the king.
100% will choose to be the richest one in this world.
100% will choose to be the prettiest in this world.

So at the end everyone has to sleep and to ask the others to work because everyone is the king.

 

[idav]

Yes of course, we don't choose what we want to be.

Do you think it works if we can choose what we want to be ?

100% will choose to be the boss or the king.
100% will choose to be the richest one in this world.
100% will choose to be the prettiest in this world.

So at the end everyone has to sleep and to ask the others to work because everyone is the king.

That is beside the point. Your talking battle of wills there, complicates the probablistic system just as the forces of nature do. Doesnt change the fundamental probalistic nature of the underlying reality which is timeless and omnipresent.

 

[Koldo]

Because in science, we think, we plan, we observe, we measure, we design, we use trial and error ..etc.

What is the science of natural selection other than method of stupidity.

What do you mean by science of 'natural selection'?
Do you mean that natural selection has not been observed?

 

[Parsimony]

FearGod, can you summarize what the process of natural selection is according to scientists? I'm wondering just how well you understand it. If I was to ask a scientist how natural selection works, what would he/she tell me?

 

[AndromedaRXJ]

Honestly I prefer to consider apes as a subset of monkeys, particularly Old World Monkeys. This would include humans of course. You're all monkeys. Get over it.

 

[FearGod]

FearGod, can you summarize what the process of natural selection is according to scientists? I'm wondering just how well you understand it. If I was to ask a scientist how natural selection works, what would he/she tell me?

According to Darwin's theory it says that the organisms which better adapted to the environment will have better chances to survive and to transfer the genetic characteristics to the succeeding generations.

 

[FearGod]

What do you mean by science of 'natural selection'?
Do you mean that natural selection has not been observed?

Did you observe a chimp evolving to human, we still have chimps and monkeys

[youtube]fiJdfCiWo4I[/youtube]
A Question That Atheist/Evolutionist Couldn't Answer - YouTube

 

[idea]

Yes because at the micro level, what we are bulit of, is inherently probablistic.

this viewpoint is changing..
Have We Been Interpreting Quantum Mechanics Wrong This Whole Time? | Science | WIRED

 

[ruffen]

I can't understand your point.

Do you want God to create us as to be completely identical.

The same height, the same face, the same sound, the same hair ...etc.

What is your point ?

My point is that the variation we see in any population of animals, including humans, even from the same parents, is proof for the randomness you deny happens.

 

[fantome profane]

They just won't die...

Some day we shall all take that last train to Clarksville.

 

[ruffen]

According to Darwin's theory it says that the organisms which better adapted to the environment will have better chances to survive and to transfer the genetic characteristics to the succeeding generations.

You forgot the part where any population of organisms will have variations among individuals. This variation is due to the inherent randomness that occurs in splicing of DNA from mother and father, and random mutations in that DNA.

Without this element of randomness and variation, all individuals within the population would be identical, and none of them would have an advantage over the others.

 

[ruffen]

FearGod, you should study the case of bacteria that become resistent to antibiotics. This is a real true phenomenon and a huge problem for many diseases in many parts of the world.

Within a population of bacteria inside a person, some are more resistent to antibiotics, and some are less resistent. When that person gets sick from these bacteria, the sickness is treated with antibiotics. Let's say that 99% of the bacteria die from the antibiotics, but 1% has a natural resistence due to their genetical composition, so they survive. The next generation will have a much higher percentage of resistent bacteria. So the population has become more resistent to antibiotics.

And because many people in many countries use antibiotics way too often for diseases the body istelf could easily cure, multi-resistent bacteria cultures are popping up more often, and this is a big problem for public health.

This is evolution! This is the very process you deny is real. And this process requires natural variations in the DNA of individuals within a population.

Is multi-resistent bacteria not happening? Is it a design from a malevolent God? Or is it a natural process?

Also, did you know that we humans have been breeding dogs, cattle, horses, sheep, plants, fruits, crops etc. for millennia in order to take advantage of random variations among individuals and select those that suit our needs best? It is not natural selection, but man-made selection, but the random variation is the same.

 

[FearGod]

You forgot the part where any population of organisms will have variations among individuals. This variation is due to the inherent randomness that occurs in splicing of DNA from mother and father, and random mutations in that DNA.

Without this element of randomness and variation, all individuals within the population would be identical, and none of them would have an advantage over the others.

That is evolution and not natural selection

 

[idav]

this viewpoint is changing..
Have We Been Interpreting Quantum Mechanics Wrong This Whole Time? | Science | WIRED

The interpretation can change but you cant change probability aspect because the particles give evidence of going through both slits, which is what begins the whe roller coaster ride of finding how the heck it does that. Thanks for the link that's fascinating stuff.

 

[ruffen]

That is evolution and not natural selection

Evolution is short-hand for "evolution by random mutation and natural selection".

That's the process. Evolution requires the following:
- randomness - random mutations and variations within a population
- differentiated probability of producing offspring due to those variations (non-random natural selection)
- heredity - these variations must be genetically transferred to the next generation so they don't die with that one individual, but continue to exist

 

[ruffen]

This should really not be that difficult to understand. Which parts do you doubt?