Right_Path
Member
Agree
This is wrong....God never regrets any of his acts...it is all calculated with perfection.
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Why did God send Satan to us instead of hell.
- Thread starter Greatest I am
- Start date
Agree
This is wrong....God never regrets any of his acts...it is all calculated with perfection.
Right_Path
Member
How about that:
Quran: Surah HUD
11-32 'They said: "O Noah! You have disputed with us and much have you prolonged the dispute with us, now bring upon us what you threaten us with, if you are of the truthful."
11-33 'He said: "Only God will bring it (the punishment) on you, if He will, and then you will escape not
11-36 'And it was inspired to Noah: "None of your people will believe except those who have believed already. So be not sad because of what they used to do.
11-37 "And construct the ship under Our Eyes and with Our Inspiration, and address Me not on behalf of those who did wrong; they are surely to be drowned."
11-38 And as he was constructing the ship, whenever the chiefs of his people passed by him, they made a mockery of him. He said: "If you mock at us, so do we mock at you likewise for your mocking.
11-40 (So it was) till then there came Our Command and the oven gushed forth (water like fountains from the earth). We said: "Embark therein, of each kind two (male and female), and your family, except him against whom the Word has already gone forth, and those who believe. And none believed with him, except a few."
11-41And he (Noah ) said: "Embark therein, in the Name of Allah will be its moving course and its resting anchorage. Surely, my Lord is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful."
11-42So it (the ship) sailed with them amidst the waves like mountains, and Noah called out to his son, who had separated himself (apart), "O my son! Embark with us and be not with the disbelievers."
11-43 The son replied: "I will betake myself to a mountain, it will save me from the water." Noah said: "This day there is no saviour from the Decree of Allah except him on whom He has mercy." And a wave came in between them, so he (the son) was among the drowned.
11-44 And it was said: "O earth! Swallow up your water, and O sky! Withhold (your rain)." And the water was diminished (made to subside) and the Decree (of Allah) was fulfilled (i.e. the destruction of the people of Nooh (Noah). And it (the ship) rested on Mount Judi, and it was said: "Away with the people who are Zalimoon (polytheists and wrong-doing)!"
11-45 And Noah called upon his Lord and said, "O my Lord! Verily, my son is of my family! And certainly, Your Promise is true, and You are the Most Just of the judges."
11-46 He said: "O Noah! Surely, he is not of your family; verily, his work is unrighteous, so ask not of Me that of which you have no knowledge! I admonish you, lest you be one of the ignorants."
11-47 [Noah] said, "My Lord, I seek refuge in You from asking that of which I have no knowledge. And unless You forgive me and have mercy upon me, I will be among the losers."
Quran: Surah HUD
11-32 'They said: "O Noah! You have disputed with us and much have you prolonged the dispute with us, now bring upon us what you threaten us with, if you are of the truthful."
11-33 'He said: "Only God will bring it (the punishment) on you, if He will, and then you will escape not
11-36 'And it was inspired to Noah: "None of your people will believe except those who have believed already. So be not sad because of what they used to do.
11-37 "And construct the ship under Our Eyes and with Our Inspiration, and address Me not on behalf of those who did wrong; they are surely to be drowned."
11-38 And as he was constructing the ship, whenever the chiefs of his people passed by him, they made a mockery of him. He said: "If you mock at us, so do we mock at you likewise for your mocking.
11-40 (So it was) till then there came Our Command and the oven gushed forth (water like fountains from the earth). We said: "Embark therein, of each kind two (male and female), and your family, except him against whom the Word has already gone forth, and those who believe. And none believed with him, except a few."
11-41And he (Noah ) said: "Embark therein, in the Name of Allah will be its moving course and its resting anchorage. Surely, my Lord is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful."
11-42So it (the ship) sailed with them amidst the waves like mountains, and Noah called out to his son, who had separated himself (apart), "O my son! Embark with us and be not with the disbelievers."
11-43 The son replied: "I will betake myself to a mountain, it will save me from the water." Noah said: "This day there is no saviour from the Decree of Allah except him on whom He has mercy." And a wave came in between them, so he (the son) was among the drowned.
11-44 And it was said: "O earth! Swallow up your water, and O sky! Withhold (your rain)." And the water was diminished (made to subside) and the Decree (of Allah) was fulfilled (i.e. the destruction of the people of Nooh (Noah). And it (the ship) rested on Mount Judi, and it was said: "Away with the people who are Zalimoon (polytheists and wrong-doing)!"
11-45 And Noah called upon his Lord and said, "O my Lord! Verily, my son is of my family! And certainly, Your Promise is true, and You are the Most Just of the judges."
11-46 He said: "O Noah! Surely, he is not of your family; verily, his work is unrighteous, so ask not of Me that of which you have no knowledge! I admonish you, lest you be one of the ignorants."
11-47 [Noah] said, "My Lord, I seek refuge in You from asking that of which I have no knowledge. And unless You forgive me and have mercy upon me, I will be among the losers."
lilithu
The Devil's Advocate
Genesis 8:21
And the LORD smelled the sweet savour; and the LORD said in His heart: "Never again will I curse the ground because of man, even though every inclination of his heart is evil from childhood. And never again will I destroy all living creatures, as I have done.
Right_Path
Member
The Quran's perception of God is much more convincing:
Because God DID cursed the ground because of man after Noah's flood, in fact it did happened in our generation.
17-17
We have destroyed many generations after the time of Noah. Your Lord is All knowing and Well Aware of the sins of His servants
and because a true God never regrets any of his acts
Greatest I am
Well-Known Member
liliuth
To show that the earth was full of evil God used the flood.
I think that to use a more evil force, genocide, than what the evil humans had used to that point says that God is more evil than His victims. Any that try to use genocide today are vilified. How can you justify one in the past who would use it. Justice, not likely. His justice is more where the penalty fits the crime. Not a drastic overreaction that makes Him look like a genocidal maniac.
If God's ratio of good souls was millions of good and 8 evil, I could see His use of genocide.
To think that He could only get 8 good out of millions is just stupid and shows God killing off a bad batch. He is the creator of batches. Did He get the formula wrong?
Will end times see Him with the same ratio or will He do better then?
Regards
DL
To show that the earth was full of evil God used the flood.
I think that to use a more evil force, genocide, than what the evil humans had used to that point says that God is more evil than His victims. Any that try to use genocide today are vilified. How can you justify one in the past who would use it. Justice, not likely. His justice is more where the penalty fits the crime. Not a drastic overreaction that makes Him look like a genocidal maniac.
If God's ratio of good souls was millions of good and 8 evil, I could see His use of genocide.
To think that He could only get 8 good out of millions is just stupid and shows God killing off a bad batch. He is the creator of batches. Did He get the formula wrong?
Will end times see Him with the same ratio or will He do better then?
Regards
DL
Last edited:
Greatest I am
Well-Known Member
Again, I say, you are talking about an anthropomorphic God loaded with human attributes and feelings. God is incorporeal and pure spirit. Even if there was a Flood, God would have nothing to do with the death of children and babies. Many children and babies were buried alive when the Vesuvius exploded. Suppose you blame God for that? Not a chance! Blamed for that tragedy were all those who had chosen to live in the immediacies of the Vulcano. They just happened to be on the wrong place at the wrong time.
Ben
We agree that God is not corporeal. God is a cosmic consciousness that we join at death.
He does not interfere with humans unless asked and only to the point of communication. No miracles.
No killing.
I find it strange that those who believe in a loving God could ever believe that He would take the label of genocidal maniac.
Gods attributes though are pure human attributes otherwise the term to be as Gods, knowing good and evil would not apply. It does. God is made of us.
Regards
DL
Greatest I am
Well-Known Member
I agree.
Strange how some can think that God would open the earth as a brothel for His angels and then send a flood to kill off all the issue of woman and angels.
Rather stupid of God to send angels to us instead of hell in the first place. It makes God look like a blundering fool.
God is not and does noyt screw up.
Regards
DL
Greatest I am
Well-Known Member
If we are only evil from childhood, then how does God justify killing babies in the flood. They would be good not evil. God killing good babies! Say it isn't so.
Can God not produce at least one good soul and nature without fornicating with a married woman? Bestiality.
Regards
DL
Regards
DL
Ben Masada
Well-Known Member
My views about God's attributes differ from yours that they are integrated parts of His essence. Eternal with Him. Absolute as He is.
When man was Biblically created in His image, the meaning of that special creation opposite to the irrational animals and other things, is that man would be granted a share in God's attributes in relative terms, temporarily within his span of life.
You give off the impression that human attributes have extended unto God when the truth is the other way around. In other words, we are made of God. The Psalmist had the same idea, and so had Jesus. See Psalm 82:6 and John 10:34.
Ben :clap
Greatest I am
Well-Known Member
As I said, man decides what are God's attributes.
You do the same by saying God is absolute.
Animals, even the lower ones do not act in an irrational ways.
If they do, please give an example.
Regards
DL
Ben Masada
Well-Known Member
There are only two modalities of being what one is: Absolute in itself or relative to somethinng. Since we all are relative to something, by intelligent deduction, only God is Absolute.
Irrational ways are ways acted upon without thinking or considering as a result of a mental process. That's a thing of man. Animals do their "thinking" instinctively.
Ben
Heneni
Miss Independent
Like any of us would know what rational behaviour for an animal is. But anyway....whales who strand themselves on the beach.
Ben Masada
Well-Known Member
Greatest I am
Well-Known Member
There are only two modalities of being what one is: Absolute in itself or relative to somethinng. Since we all are relative to something, by intelligent deduction, only God is Absolute.
Irrational ways are ways acted upon without thinking or considering as a result of a mental process. That's a thing of man. Animals do their "thinking" instinctively.
Ben
Better.
Man also has instincts that He can ignore if he wishes. Lower animals seem to be able to do the same.
To me, absolute means never changing.
If we have any value to God as souls, then we should change God as we reach heaven. If not then we are not part of Him at any time.
Scripture days that we have caused God to do things to us. Sodom, the flood etc.
It seems that your absolute God is effected by us and changes.
In fact, if in the beginning God was alone, then when He added all we see, He evolved.
How can He be absolute, never changing and yet evolving?
Regards
DL
Greatest I am
Well-Known Member
Do you think that they know that they are stranding themselves before the fact or is it more likely that they were feeding and became stranded?
Regards
DL
Heneni
Miss Independent
Its more likely that sonar activity in the ocean is intervering with their navigation system which makes them beach. Others think it is a form of suicide. What is the point you are trying to make though?
Heneni
Greatest I am
Well-Known Member
I do not think that instincts include a wish that leads to suicide. Perhaps only man can do such a thing.
Regards
DL
Heneni
Miss Independent
Perhaps now is a good time to explain your equations to us more fully. If someone does not get your equations, they cannot debate with you about it. Instead everything people say is simply disgarded. If you wanted to make a point and have us think about it, why dont you elaborate on the equations you have used several times in your thread. That way we can have an open debate, instead of falling around between one post and the next.
You started this thread asking...why did god send satan to us instead of to hell. To me that is not an issue, because i believe earth is hell. But still im interested in your equations if you would take the time to explain them fully.
Heneni
You started this thread asking...why did god send satan to us instead of to hell. To me that is not an issue, because i believe earth is hell. But still im interested in your equations if you would take the time to explain them fully.
Heneni
Ben Masada
Well-Known Member
Men don't have instincts; men have intuition. Instinct is an attribute of the irrational.
Regarding being absolute something that never changes, that's God alright.
There is no heaven to reach and change God. You are being too anthropomorphic about God. God is incorporeal. No one or nothing causes God to do things for us.
A Bible reader needs some Philosophical training to be able to understand when a text in the Bible is allegorical or literal. Allegories must be interpreted metaphorically.
My absolute God does not change, neither evolve. According to Jesus in John 4:24,
God is pure Spirit and the only way to relate to God is in spirit.
Ben
zenzero
Its only a Label
Friend Greatest I am,
God never send Satan.
It is us humans who gave birth to god and satan came by default.
God is a concept developed by humans and like a magnet which has two poles similarly there is another pole of god which is satan.
Like even if a magnet is cut to pieces the two poles north and south remains similarly till god IS satan too IS.
Love & rgds
God never send Satan.
It is us humans who gave birth to god and satan came by default.
God is a concept developed by humans and like a magnet which has two poles similarly there is another pole of god which is satan.
Like even if a magnet is cut to pieces the two poles north and south remains similarly till god IS satan too IS.
Love & rgds