Why do Christians accuse other religions of believing in false prophets?

[dybmh]

it is generally agreed by Everyone that matters .. that there is no other way to translate this passage .. Abe did not call his God YHWH

Of course there is another way to translate the passage. Lacking punctuation, there's at least two ways to tranlsate it: a statement or a question.

Hello? Anybody home?

So the question is then .. what did Abe Call his God ? what was the name ? Quazi fortunately the passage half tells us .. giving an Epiphet .. rather than a direct name -- but the name is in the Epiphet .. so is all good .. and coincidently the name Given is the most likely of the Gods that Abe would worship .. or anyone would worship if they were going to choose to worship only one .. and wanted that one God to be the "Most High" El Elyon .. or others such as El Supreme .. Psalms 82 refers to the Sons of the Supreme one..

No, it doesn't say "supreme one" that's false. Mistranslatation.

You still haven't brought any actual evidence of Abe calling God "EL" or any version of "EL". Why is that? Or any evidence of these 1000s of redactions. Why is that?

"And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, by the name of " El who Suffices , but by my name "Yahweh" not I was known to them".
https://www.scripture4all.org/OnlineInterlinear/OTpdf/exo6.pdf

BUZZZZZZZ! You're own source disputes this translation. You added "by the name of EL..." why can't you correct your errors?

Then we have Abe and MelchiZedek worshiping the God most High And we are told that MelchiZedek is not only King but Priest of "El Olium"

No.... when Abe is with Malchi-Tzedek he uses the name YHWH. And who is El Olium? Are you making up gods again? Last time you you thought for certain it was Zedek, tuned out to Sydyk. So who is El Olium?

which means "EL Supreme" -- which gives us much more info on the identity ..

OMG, you poor thing. Elyon. It's amatuer hour in the RF debate forum. You're trying to say El-Elyon. This came from your bogus PDF didn't it? Let's see...



Yup. LOLLOL, I told you that pdf was bogus. You sound like a total fool El-Oilun, good grief. You know, I'm only telling you thins because I have pity on you. If you want to pretned like you know things, it's El-Elyon. The Oh-sound is long. And technically it's Ail-Elyon. Here, I'll zoom in for you.


OK, can you see the difference in the dots. Two dots is a long Ay sound, like made, or played, or going on a tirade. Get it? Then the three dots is a short Eh sound like Fred, or said, or cleft. OK? So what you're tying to say is not El-Oliun. That's wrooooooong. And funny. I wonder how many people you've said this to trying to sound smart?

Anyway, use Biblehub, it's better. I told you before. Look.

See that? They at least get the pronounciation correct. And you'll also notice if you look carefully, there is a difference between Ail and Elyon on the first syllable. It's a small detail, but important.

"El who suffices"

And where does that word "suffices" come from? How do you know that's correct? You misquoted your own source. You completely botched pronouning Elyon because you tursted that bogus source. And now you're trusting it with a translation and I doubt you have any idea how it came up with that choice.

Who is that ? (Modern Scholarship claimes El is the God of Abraham for a number of reasons.. but let us pretend not to know) .. It is an epiphet for a God who Suffices .. We have another epiphet thou as well .. When El Shaddai introduces himself to Abe ..

But there's no evidence for it. So these scholars are just guessing. And since the DH has collapsed, but you can't wrap your mind around that fact, you're still working off of OLD data.

 

[dybmh]

The problem for nay-sayers .. is that if all these epiphets are not referring to EL --- then what is the name of the God being Referred to .. and it is not YHWH .. cause Abe did not know his God buy that name .. so .. if not EL .. what is the name of Abe's God .. ---- and it matters not what the nay sayers reply .. because it is not YHWH ..

Sure it is. it's YHWH. You're ignoring all the data except for the english, which you cannot sem to quote properly to begin with. So its the whole Tanach from beginning to end says it's YHWH. There's not a single place where Abe talks to EL using that name, and you are choosing to die on the hill of a failed translation of Exodus 6:3.

Why?

How about you bring these modern scholars? Huh? Why not do that for us? Not a blog, not a youtube, but an actual scholar who addresses the language issues that have been presented?

 

[dybmh]

Quite the idiotic nonsense .. Friend .. One moment, please... gives you direct translation from Hebrew to English --- has absolutely nothing to do with me being smart ..

Genesis 14:18 .. The God Abe and MelchiZedek Worship .. the Hebrew Script is translated into Hebrew as - L Al Olium which is renderd in English as El Supreme rendered by the KJV as "Most High God"

The Hebrew Text is from the Leningrad Codex -- What does your translation have.. for this passage smarty Pants

You are still hurting over the fact that the name of Abe's God is Not YHWH .. and your calling YHWH a liar.

Ummmm, Oilun is not a translation, it's a transliteration.

This is kinda weird, cause in the other post you used Elyon correctly, and here you're using Oliun. I mean you really really don;t know anything about this language do you?

Your PDFs from scripture4all.org are garbage. You need new sources. I alreadu offered them to you a while ago. I did it again here.

And no I'm not hurting about Exodus 6:3, you can't seem to get it translated correctly. Even copying it from the PDF is too much for you.

Abe knew the name YHWH. And until you can produce any of these magical holy scholars to which you are faithfully adhered, then all you have is one mistranslated verse compared to what? 30 others that have Abe using the name YHWH.

 

[dybmh]

The Hebrew word comes from the Canaanite God representing rightousness .. the Hebrew Language decends from Canaanite.

Sorry friend but what you are saying is scripturally and linguistically way way ignorant of the subject matter -- Zedek is a Canaanite - Phoenician God .... when attached as the name of a King .. thats how things worked in the days of Old MelchiZedek is a Canaanite King .. not a Hebrew King .. his name is the name of the Canaanite God Zedek -- Twin Gods of Righteousness and Justice .. and you were given references .

BUZZZZZZZ, wrong again. Hee. This is fun. Canaanite was deciphered using the Hebrew bible, not the other way around. Any similarities are coming from Hebrew. Again, DO SOME RESEARCH.

And lookie-lookie, it's your own source blooging aboot it.

Deciphering the Ugaritic Language

The ancient city of Ugarit was located on the north coast of the Mediterranean Sea, in a place known today by its Arabic name Ras Shamra. Because Ugarit was an international harbor, the city had a …

claudemariottini.com

Here's the full article. You'll see that they used Hebrew to decode the canaanite language. So No. All that is known about the canaanite language comes from Hebrew. And that's why ther seems to be all these similarities. But that's due to the way the language was decoded.

But you wouldn't know that. And your bloogy youtobbers won't tell you either.

Cracking the Ugaritic Code

Forward reader Raffi Bilek has some questions about Ugaritic, the ancient Semitic language, closely related to biblical Hebrew, that was unearthed in archaeological excavations begun in the late 1920s at the ancient site of Ugarit, along the Syrian coast north of Latakia. Mr. Bilek asks: “How do...

forward.com

 

[Sargonski]

Ummmm, Oilun is not a translation, it's a transliteration.

This is kinda weird, cause in the other post you used Elyon correctly, and here you're using Oliun. I mean you really really don;t know anything about this language do you?

Your PDFs from scripture4all.org are garbage. You need new sources. I alreadu offered them to you a while ago. I did it again here.

And no I'm not hurting about Exodus 6:3, you can't seem to get it translated correctly. Even copying it from the PDF is too much for you.

Abe knew the name YHWH. And until you can produce any of these magical holy scholars to which you are faithfully adhered, then all you have is one mistranslated verse compared to what? 30 others that have Abe using the name YHWH.

I gave you the correct Translation El Supreme --- and gave you the source .. and the Source Bible. .. and a link to the highly reputable translation site that has been around for decades

YOu running around crying NO NO NO .. Mistranslation .. without bothering to provide any support for claim .. failing even to state what the translation should be .. is not an argument for anything .. a complete fail ..

The God of Abraham was El Supreme .. the Most High El Elyon .. or Al Elyon .. makes Absolutely no difference ..

but what how are you wishing to translate this passage .. and from what Bible .. and do provide link like I did. This should be a chuckle.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

The Hebrew word comes from the Canaanite God representing rightousness .. the Hebrew Language decends from Canaanite.

Sorry friend but what you are saying is scripturally and linguistically way way ignorant of the subject matter -- Zedek is a Canaanite - Phoenician God .... when attached as the name of a King .. thats how things worked in the days of Old MelchiZedek is a Canaanite King .. not a Hebrew King .. his name is the name of the Canaanite God Zedek -- Twin Gods of Righteousness and Justice .. and you were given references .

In other words you got nothing. No verse in Genesis that identifies a god named zedek. Got it. I began by asking you for your source for this idea, and so far you have supplied zippity do dah. Quite frankly, I'm tired of you making things up out of whole cloth, and then smearing the person you are talking to by calling them ignorant. I won't be replying to you in the future. You are not worth the effort.

 

[dybmh]

I gave you the correct Translation El Supreme

No... you've made multiple mistakes, and it's hilarious watching you pretend to be schoolarly and smart.

The error you made translating supreme was in Psalm 82. It does not say supreme one. The word "one is not in the verse,
The other error you made is adding the words "in the name of El ..." "in the name of" does not exist in the original Hebrew. Those words are added. AND, your own crappy PDF gets this correct. You put a link to it, but you don't copy their translation correctly.

And this ignores th El Oliun. OMG, that's just precious. You should do a google search for Oliun. It's so funny that you didn't think to do that.

--- and gave you the source .. and the Source Bible.

"The Source Bible" huh? No.... you gave me scriptures4all.org, and the PDFs you keep using are from the scriptures4all foundation. Here's the google search results for "The Source Bible", care to direct me to the one that you're actually taking about?

Link

.. and a link to the highly reputable translation site that has been around for decades

Reputable? By who's standards? I found errors on the first day, and it obviously doesn't transliterate properly.

Look at the one verse we're talking about. The very first word, is past tense. But your souce has it as present tense. Why is that?

You mentioned the leningrad codex, but.... That's not a translation. You lose again. You don't even know where your translation is coming from. And even if you did, you can't seem to copy and paste it correctly. You'd never know if it makes a mistake. And then you try to sound smart by using faulty transliterations, and you sound like a hack.

YOu running around crying NO NO NO .. Mistranslation .. without bothering to provide any support for claim .. failing even to state what the translation should be .. is not an argument for anything .. a complete fail ..

I brought multiple sources supoprting me. And I brought an actual peer reviewed paper on it. Here I'll attach it again.

The God of Abraham was El Supreme .. the Most High El Elyon .. or Al Elyon .. makes Absolutely no difference ..

Sure it does. Ail is not the same as El. I know it's hard for YOU to tell the difference because your standards are so low. But Dan and Don are two different names.

Also, the most supreme god for Abe was YHWH. And until you bring any actual evidence of Abe using EL, youve lost. It's all just wishing in one hand and farting in the other.

but what how are you wishing to translate this passage .. and from what Bible .. and do provide link like I did. This should be a chuckle.

Ya know what? The NIV isn't too bad on this one:

​

"I appeared to Abraham, to Isaac and to Jacob as God Almighty, but by my name the LORD I did not make myself fully known to them."​

There it is. The name was known, but they didn't fully know YHWH.

 

[Brian2]

Well Kudo's for picking up the ball .. as some are fumbling this question horribly. And yes .. it is generally agreed by Everyone that matters .. that there is no other way to translate this passage .. Abe did not call his God YHWH

So the question is then .. what did Abe Call his God ? what was the name ? Quazi fortunately the passage half tells us .. giving an Epiphet .. rather than a direct name -- but the name is in the Epiphet .. so is all good .. and coincidently the name Given is the most likely of the Gods that Abe would worship .. or anyone would worship if they were going to choose to worship only one .. and wanted that one God to be the "Most High" El Elyon .. or others such as El Supreme .. Psalms 82 refers to the Sons of the Supreme one..

"And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, by the name of " El who Suffices , but by my name "Yahweh" not I was known to them".
https://www.scripture4all.org/OnlineInterlinear/OTpdf/exo6.pdf

"El who suffices"

Who is that ? (Modern Scholarship claimes El is the God of Abraham for a number of reasons.. but let us pretend not to know) .. It is an epiphet for a God who Suffices .. We have another epiphet thou as well .. When El Shaddai introduces himself to Abe ..

Then we have Abe and MelchiZedek worshiping the God most High And we are told that MelchiZedek is not only King but Priest of "El Olium"
which means "EL Supreme" -- which gives us much more info on the identity .. This is the Supreme one of Psalm 82 -- head of the Divine Council ... Council of EL .. same god being referred to as having many sons "Sons of the Supreme one"

Now .. lets us pretend that we don't know that obviously this Most High .. Supreme God of the Canaanite Pantheon is EL -- the fellow where we get the word GOD from.

The problem for nay-sayers .. is that if all these epiphets are not referring to EL --- then what is the name of the God being Referred to .. and it is not YHWH .. cause Abe did not know his God buy that name .. so .. if not EL .. what is the name of Abe's God .. ---- and it matters not what the nay sayers reply .. because it is not YHWH ..

Yahweh is Yahweh no matter what the Patriarchs knew Him as. Abraham worshipped the God of Melchizedek, God Most High, it seems, and this God was Yahweh under a different name. Presumably He was El, the chief God of the Canaanite Pantheon and what He had taught the Canaanites etc seems to have been corrupted since Yahweh is the only true God.
Isaac and Jacob knew Him as the God of their father. No doubt there were other descriptive names for God, eg El Shaddai.
But Zedek is just a speculation for the name of a God.

 

[Sargonski]

Of course there is another way to translate the passage. Lacking punctuation, there's at least two ways to tranlsate it: a statement or a question.

Hello? Anybody home?



No, it doesn't say "supreme one" that's false. Mistranslatation.

You still haven't brought any actual evidence of Abe calling God "EL" or any version of "EL". Why is that? Or any evidence of these 1000s of redactions. Why is that?



BUZZZZZZZ! You're own source disputes this translation. You added "by the name of EL..." why can't you correct your errors?



No.... when Abe is with Malchi-Tzedek he uses the name YHWH. And who is El Olium? Are you making up gods again? Last time you you thought for certain it was Zedek, tuned out to Sydyk. So who is El Olium?


OMG, you poor thing. Elyon. It's amatuer hour in the RF debate forum. You're trying to say El-Elyon. This came from your bogus PDF didn't it? Let's see...

View attachment 78280

Yup. LOLLOL, I told you that pdf was bogus. You sound like a total fool El-Oilun, good grief. You know, I'm only telling you thins because I have pity on you. If you want to pretned like you know things, it's El-Elyon. The Oh-sound is long. And technically it's Ail-Elyon. Here, I'll zoom in for you.

View attachment 78281
OK, can you see the difference in the dots. Two dots is a long Ay sound, like made, or played, or going on a tirade. Get it? Then the three dots is a short Eh sound like Fred, or said, or cleft. OK? So what you're tying to say is not El-Oliun. That's wrooooooong. And funny. I wonder how many people you've said this to trying to sound smart?

Anyway, use Biblehub, it's better. I told you before. Look.

View attachment 78282

See that? They at least get the pronounciation correct. And you'll also notice if you look carefully, there is a difference between Ail and Elyon on the first syllable. It's a small detail, but important.




And where does that word "suffices" come from? How do you know that's correct? You misquoted your own source. You completely botched pronouning Elyon because you tursted that bogus source. And now you're trusting it with a translation and I doubt you have any idea how it came up with that choice.



But there's no evidence for it. So these scholars are just guessing. And since the DH has collapsed, but you can't wrap your mind around that fact, you're still working off of OLD data.

What a completely moronic Post .. You whine profusely about a translation .. "EL Supreme" Crying "Your translation site is Garbage" .. Then give a translation from Bible Hub -- failing to state which Bible your translating from .

Sorry to burst your bubble mate --- but differnt Bibles say different things .. I gave a translation from the Leningrad Codex.

What is even more stupid .. is that "Most High" or "Supreme" make no difference to the point .. which is that the "Most High" God of the Canaanites was EL .. MelChiZedek a Canaanite Priest King of "The Most High" A Priest King of EL

You then run around calling me a Fool .. when it turns out to be a log in own eye. What Bible is the translation you gave from ? Let us see who the Fool in the room is

 

[Sargonski]

Yahweh is Yahweh no matter what the Patriarchs knew Him as. Abraham worshipped the God of Melchizedek, God Most High, it seems, and this God was Yahweh under a different name. Presumably He was El, the chief God of the Canaanite Pantheon and what He had taught the Canaanites etc seems to have been corrupted since Yahweh is the only true God.
Isaac and Jacob knew Him as the God of their father. No doubt there were other descriptive names for God, eg El Shaddai.
But Zedek is just a speculation for the name of a God.

No .. That's not how the logic works.. If the Name of the God being Worshiped is EL -- then it is not Yahweh .. Later on what we have (syncretism) is YHWH assuming the identity of YHWH.

If your claim is assumed to be true .. we create even more problems .. as then YHWH is the High God of the Canaanites - Phonecians - Assyrians - Babylonians .. a Trickster God - Pretending to be many different Gods having many different names.

Regardless .. this is simply not what the Israelites believed -- "That YHWH was all these other Gods" .. sorry Charlie .. the Israelites were raging Pagans who believed in the existence of many Gods .. and worshiped many different Gods .. which is Why YHWH is so pissed off at them all the time .. Jealous of these other Gods ..

Sydyk is not Speculation for the name of a God --- The Priest Kings of the Day have the name of their God included in their name ... and a whole lot of people .. Samu-EL - Isra-EL, Ishma-EL, Dani-EL, .. Saul has a Son Meri-Baal.

Now the fact that you have one Priest King -- MelchiZedek -- is already a slam Dunk .. that we have Two (and probably were many more in the 500 years period) one 500 years later Adoni-Zedek "My Lord is Zedek" Tells us the Patron God of Jerusalem has been around a Long Long time -- is well known and highly respected .. Mt. Zion .. not only a respected religious Shrine .. but certainly also respected as a place of Justice, Truth, and Righteousness. .. and also .. the Name Salem - meaning Peace.

Wiki - Misor was the name of a deity appearing in a theogeny provided by Roman era Phoenician writer Philo of Byblos in an account preserved by Eusebius in Praeparatio Evangelica,[1] and attributed to the still earlier Sanchuniathon. He was one of two children of the deities Amunos and Magos. The other named was Sydyk. It is said that these two were the first to discover the use of salt. The names "Misor" and "Sydyk" mean "Straight" and "Just"[2] (or, in another translation, "Well-freed" and "Just"[3]).

Misor's son was named Taautus, and believed to be the inventor of the first written alphabet.[4]

Wiki -Sydyk - Philo of Byblos gave the Greek meaning of the name as Δίκαιον "Righteousness", thus indicating that the word corresponds to the Semitic root for "righteousness", √ṣdq. A Phoenician god named ṣdq is well attested epigraphically; he is also mentioned by Philo as half of a pair of deities with Misor (Μισωρ). Sydyk and Misor are described as being born from Amunos and Magos, who were in turn born from the "Wanderers" or Titans. Sydyk is described as the father of the "Dioskouroi or Kabeiroi or Korybants or Samothracians", who are credited with the invention of the ship.[2]

The Phoenician Sydyk was equated with Roman Jupiter, and hence it has been suggested that Sydyk was connected to the worship of the planet Jupiter as the manifestation of justice or righteousness.[3]

Not only was Zedek the Patron God of Jerusalem under the Canaanites .. The High Priest Zadok - maintained the Prestly Tradition under David .. is then Put High Priest over all Israel .. and is the Priest who annoints Solomon.

Then we have the fact that this Priestly Tradition was maintained .. and that David himself is a Priest of the Order of MelchiZedek ..

The Lord said to my Lord, “Sit at My right hand, Till I make Your enemies Your footstool.”
2 The Lord shall send the rod of Your strength out of Zion. Rule in the midst of Your enemies!
3 Your people shall be volunteers In the day of Your power; In the beauties of holiness, from the womb of the morning, You have the dew of Your youth.
4 The Lord has sworn And will not relent, “You are a priest forever According to the order of Melchizedek.”
5 The Lord is at Your right hand;
He shall [a]execute kings in the day of His wrath.
6 He shall judge among the nations,

This is not the Aaronic Priestly Line --- not a Levite --- and nor is Zadok .. the lineage in Chronicles a well established later interpolation. How does the Canaanite High Priest under Adoni-Zedek manage to have "Levite" lineage ..

Hebrews tells us that Jesus is also a Priest of the Order of MelchiZedek.. hence the Epiphets -- Prince of Peace .. Righteousness .. Justice and the Truth .. for Jesus is not only savior but also Judge... and his Power comes down from Heaven .. Heaven being "The Divine Council" .. or as known by the entire Middle east during time of the Patriarchs and Israelitese --- >>> .. the Council of EL .. You know .. the One mentioned in Psalm 82 .. and the setting for where the drama takes place.

A psalm of Asaph.​

82:1 God stands in[b] the assembly of El;[c] in the midst of the gods[d] he renders judgment.[e]

Bible Gateway passage: Psalm 82 - New English Translation

Psalm 82 - A psalm of Asaph. God stands in the assembly of El; in the midst of the gods he renders judgment. He says, “How long will you make unjust legal decisions and show favoritism to the wicked? (Selah) Defend the cause of the poor and the fatherless. Vindicate the oppressed and suffering...

www.biblegateway.com

 

[dybmh]

What a completely moronic Post .. You whine profusely about a translation .. "EL Supreme" Crying "Your translation site is Garbage" .. Then give a translation from Bible Hub -- failing to state which Bible your translating from .

No.... I gave a transliteration from Biblehub. The translation I gave is the NIV.

Sorry to burst your bubble mate --- but differnt Bibles say different things .. I gave a translation from the Leningrad Codex.

No.... The Leningrad Codex is NOT a translation.

You clearly don't know what you're talking about.

What is even more stupid .. is that "Most High" or "Supreme" make no difference to the point .. which is that the "Most High" God of the Canaanites was EL .. MelChiZedek a Canaanite Priest King of "The Most High" A Priest King of EL

And Abe doesn't believe in that god. In that chapter Abe uses the name YHWH correcting MalchiTzedek.

You then run around calling me a Fool .. when it turns out to be a log in own eye. What Bible is the translation you gave from ?

The NIV.

Let us see who the Fool in the room is

You're the one pretending to know the language. And mistaken that the Leningrad Codex is a translation.

And using Scripure4all foundation as if it's reliable.

And OMG El-oliun. Lol. That's too much. All you had to do was tippy tap on Google to see that was bogus.

But that's how arrogance works. Someone fooled you into using that silly PDF, and you'd never know how stupid it sounds.

Oilun. Priceless.

 

[muhammad_isa]

No .. That's not how the logic works.. If the Name of the God being Worshiped is EL -- then it is not Yahweh .. Later on what we have (syncretism) is YHWH assuming the identity of YHWH.

What is really your point with all this?
Is it supposed to be evidence that The One God of Abraham [ insert your name here ]
does not exist? Just another made-up god?
What, exactly?

 

[Sargonski]

In other words you got nothing. No verse in Genesis that identifies a god named zedek. Got it. I began by asking you for your source for this idea, and so far you have supplied zippity do dah. Quite frankly, I'm tired of you making things up out of whole cloth, and then smearing the person you are talking to by calling them ignorant. I won't be replying to you in the future. You are not worth the effort.

I not the one doing the smearing .. hence the quotation marks .. just replying back what was thrown my direction .. but do pick up your ball and go home .. crying "you Got Nothing" as you go .. as you hurl false accusation ... I never said there was a verse in Genesis identifying a God named Zedek ..

Your inability to figure out that Priest Kings normally were named after the Patron God/cult .. of which they were the head Priest - is hampering your ability to understand.

Your second failure is lacking to recognise a Priest of the Same town having the Same God in his name .. Adoni-Zedek .. his name meaning "My Lord is Zedek" tells us that this was the Patron God of the town ..

The problem here however .. is not that you are "Ignorant" .. as you have been educated enough by the Prophet .. it is not that you dont understand .. but that you are Pretending not to understand ... Go now and Learn ..

 

[dybmh]

No .. That's not how the logic works.. If the Name of the God being Worshiped is EL -- then it is not Yahweh .. Later on what we have (syncretism) is YHWH assuming the identity of YHWH.

But, the God that Abe is worshipping is YHWH, and he says so. Malchi-tzedek says El-Elyon, Abe says YHWH. That's precisely what the text says.

A positive assertion needs evidence. If you have no evidence of Abe worshipping EL, then concluding he was worshipping EL is silly. Especially when the repeatedly gives the name Abe uses when addressing his god. And that name is YHWH.

You need to bring actual evidence for our claims. And if that evidence relies on a redactor changing 1000s of names, you need a lot of evidence.

If your claim is assumed to be true .. we create even more problems .. as then YHWH is the High God of the Canaanites - Phonecians - Assyrians - Babylonians .. a Trickster God - Pretending to be many different Gods having many different names.

No, why in the world would that be. Abe was different. People come up with new ideas.

Regardless .. this is simply not what the Israelites believed -- "That YHWH was all these other Gods" .. sorry Charlie .. the Israelites were raging Pagans who believed in the existence of many Gods .. and worshiped many different Gods .. which is Why YHWH is so pissed off at them all the time .. Jealous of these other Gods ..

But that has nothing to do with Abe. There were no israelites at that time.

Sydyk is not Speculation for the name of a God --- The Priest Kings of the Day have the name of their God included in their name ... and a whole lot of people .. Samu-EL - Isra-EL, Ishma-EL, Dani-EL, .. Saul has a Son Meri-Baal.

But not everyone had names of god in their names.

Now the fact that you have one Priest King -- MelchiZedek -- is already a slam Dunk ..

No... not a lsam dunk. Sydyk is quite different from Zedek.

that we have Two (and probably were many more in the 500 years period) one 500 years later Adoni-Zedek "My Lord is Zedek" Tells us the Patron God of Jerusalem has been around a Long Long time -- is well known and highly respected ..

2 names, 2 different places, 500 year span, and no other evidence. Wow. That's w-e-a-k.

Mt. Zion .. not only a respected religious Shrine .. but certainly also respected as a place of Justice, Truth, and Righteousness. .. and also .. the Name Salem - meaning Peace.

LOL. I'm loving this. So now you're making some connection based on 1 letter. Z. Oh-lordy. This is he best thread ever.

Wiki - Misor was the name of a deity appearing in a theogeny provided by Roman era Phoenician writer Philo of Byblos in an account preserved by Eusebius in Praeparatio Evangelica,[1] and attributed to the still earlier Sanchuniathon. He was one of two children of the deities Amunos and Magos. The other named was Sydyk. It is said that these two were the first to discover the use of salt. The names "Misor" and "Sydyk" mean "Straight" and "Just"[2] (or, in another translation, "Well-freed" and "Just"[3]).

Misor's son was named Taautus, and believed to be the inventor of the first written alphabet.[4]

Oooooh, Random wiki-data.

Why don't you quote the bottom of the article that says your theory is fringe.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misor#cite_note-4

Not only was Zedek the Patron God of Jerusalem under the Canaanites .. The High Priest Zadok - maintained the Prestly Tradition under David .. is then Put High Priest over all Israel .. and is the Priest who annoints Solomon.

Not only are you wrong about Zedek, you're wrong about Zadok. And Zion too.

Then we have the fact that this Priestly Tradition was maintained .. and that David himself is a Priest of the Order of MelchiZedek ..

no.... not David.

The Lord said to my Lord, “Sit at My right hand, Till I make Your enemies Your footstool.”
2 The Lord shall send the rod of Your strength out of Zion. Rule in the midst of Your enemies!
3 Your people shall be volunteers In the day of Your power; In the beauties of holiness, from the womb of the morning, You have the dew of Your youth.
4 The Lord has sworn And will not relent, “You are a priest forever According to the order of Melchizedek.”
5 The Lord is at Your right hand;
He shall [a]execute kings in the day of His wrath.
6 He shall judge among the nations,

So, what? Malchi-tzedek's god was El-elyon, not Zedek.

Answer this: if Zedek was his god, why not use that name in gen 14?

This is not the Aaronic Priestly Line --- not a Levite ---

So what? There were multiple preisthoods

and nor is Zadok ..

Sure he's a levite. You have no evidence that he was anything else.

the lineage in Chronicles a well established later interpolation.

Both lineages have him as levite. This is a nothing burger. Since you won't look it up yourself, I'll do it.

1 Samuel:

​

And Ahiah, the son of Ahitub, Ichabod’s brother, the son of Phinehas, the son of Eli, the Lord’s priest in Shiloh, wearing an ephod. And the people knew not that Jonathan was gone.​

And Zadok the son of Ahitub, and Ahimelech the son of Abiathar, were the priests; and Seraiah was the scribe;​

​

Zadok >>> Atihub >>> ... >>> Phinehas >>> Eli[azer] >>> Aaron

1 Chronicles:

Eleazar fathered Phinehas, Phinehas fathered Abishua, And Abishua fathered Bukki, and Bukki fathered Uzzi, And Uzzi fathered Zerahiah, and Zerahiah fathered Meraioth, Meraioth fathered Amariah, and Amariah fathered Ahitub, And Ahitub fathered Zadok, and Zadok fathered Ahimaaz,​

​

Well, that checks out OK.

How does the Canaanite High Priest under Adoni-Zedek manage to have "Levite" lineage ..

Since Zadok isn't a canaanite priest, there is no problem.

Hebrews tells us that Jesus is also a Priest of the Order of MelchiZedek..

Ummm, Hebrews says Malch-tzedek was immortal. Those letters say a lot of things.

3 Without father or mother or genealogy, without beginning of days or end of life, like the Son of God, he [ Malchi-tzedek ] remains a priest for all time.​

​

Do you actually trust someone who writes that lacking a geneology means that a person is immortal, supposedly, like Jesus?

hence the Epiphets -- Prince of Peace .. Righteousness .. Justice and the Truth .. for Jesus is not only savior but also Judge... and his Power comes down from Heaven ..

Sure, Christians think Jesus is everything. That doesn't say anything about this pagan god Sydyk.

Heaven being "The Divine Council" .. or as known by the entire Middle east during time of the Patriarchs and Israelitese --- >>> .. the Council of EL .. You know .. the One mentioned in Psalm 82 .. and the setting for where the drama takes place.

BUZZZZZZ. It doesn't say "council".

A psalm of Asaph.​

82:1 God stands in[b] the assembly of El;[c] in the midst of the gods[d] he renders judgment.[e]

Bible Gateway passage: Psalm 82 - New English Translation

Psalm 82 - A psalm of Asaph. God stands in the assembly of El; in the midst of the gods he renders judgment. He says, “How long will you make unjust legal decisions and show favoritism to the wicked? (Selah) Defend the cause of the poor and the fatherless. Vindicate the oppressed and suffering...

www.biblegateway.com

So... even if you're correct, this is Asaph's point of view. Has nothing to do with Abe.

 

[Sargonski]

What is really your point with all this?
Is it supposed to be evidence that The One God of Abraham [ insert your name here ]
does not exist? Just another made-up god?
What, exactly?

Not at all.. and not even close to be honest.. how is it you are this far out of the loop .. having absolutely no idea what this conversation has been about.

Did you not already ask me if I was an Atheist .. or more likely accuse .. desperate to engage in some Ad Hom Fallacy --- Attacking the messenger rather than addressing the message .. which you clearly could not handle not understand .. your brain going into "Thought Stopping Mode" .. on account of SMCT ..

You don't know who the God of Abraham Is - yet you profess to believe in this God .. You profess to be a follower of Jesus --- but don't know who his God is either.

"What is the Point" !! you Cry .. ?? --- "What Exactly" --

The point is your heresy .. Brother Muhamu .. due to lack of understanding .. of that which you claim to belief.

 

[dybmh]

I not the one doing the smearing .. hence the quotation marks .. just replying back what was thrown my direction .. but do pick up your ball and go home .. crying "you Got Nothing" as you go .. as you hurl false accusation ... I never said there was a verse in Genesis identifying a God named Zedek ..

You have no evidence that Sydyk was Malchi-tzedek's god.
You have no evidence that Sydyk was Adoni-tzedek's god.
You have no evidence that Malchi-tzedek and Adoni-tzedek were kings of the same place.
You have no evidence connecting Sydyk to Yirushalayim ( Jerusalem ).
You have no evidence of Abe worshipping EL.
You have no evidence of a redactor changing 1000s of names to YHWH.

There is plenty of evidence showing Abe worshipped YHWH by that name.
The wiki article YOU brought asserts this Zedek-god theory is fringe and is talking about PRE-ISRAELITE Jerusalem.

All you have is 1 verse, which is confusing in many english translations which add words that aren't *actually* there.
Even if that 1 verse is interpretted to your choosing, that DOES NOT give the name EL as Abe's god.
All you have guessing and arguing from ignorance "If it wasn't YHWH, what else could it be?".

Your inability to figure out that Priest Kings normally were named after the Patron God/cult .. of which they were the head Priest - is hampering your ability to understand.

So... Israel did not have priest kings. So that's another fault in this theory.

Your second failure is lacking to recognise a Priest of the Same town having the Same God in his name .. Adoni-Zedek .. his name meaning "My Lord is Zedek" tells us that this was the Patron God of the town ..

But they weren't the same town. That's a guess.

The problem here however .. is not that you are "Ignorant" .. as you have been educated enough by the Prophet .. it is not that you dont understand .. but that you are Pretending not to understand ... Go now and Learn ..

No.... you don't understand how compounding assumptions on assumptions reduces the liklihood of a theory being true. and you are chaining together assumption after assumption after assumption. But none of those assumptions are strong. They're all pretty weak.

 

[dybmh]

Not at all.. and not even close to be honest.. how is it you are this far out of the loop .. having absolutely no idea what this conversation has been about.

Did you not already ask me if I was an Atheist .. or more likely accuse .. desperate to engage in some Ad Hom Fallacy --- Attacking the messenger rather than addressing the message .. which you clearly could not handle not understand .. your brain going into "Thought Stopping Mode" .. on account of SMCT ..

You don't know who the God of Abraham Is - yet you profess to believe in this God .. You profess to be a follower of Jesus --- but don't know who his God is either.

"What is the Point" !! you Cry .. ?? --- "What Exactly" --

The point is your heresy .. Brother Muhamu .. due to lack of understanding .. of that which you claim to belief.

Nah, the point is, you probably watched some youtube anti-religious preacher, and thought, I could do that. And here you are preaching your gospel. No evidence, just guesses built on guesses.

 

[Sargonski]

But, the God that Abe is worshipping is YHWH, and he says so. Malchi-tzedek says El-Elyon, Abe says YHWH.

No... not a lsam dunk. Sydyk is quite different from Zedek
Since Zadok isn't a canaanite priest, there is no problem.

So... even if you're correct, this is Asaph's point of view. Has nothing to do with Abe.

Doubling down on the raging pile of mindless diversion from reality. Abe never says "YHWH" - according to "YHWH" and there is little difference between El Elyon "Most High" -- and the interpretation "Supreme one" .. as Both are referring to El .. epithets of EL .. the Most High God of the Canaanite Priest MelchiZedek . Zedek being the patron God of Salem.

You then cry that Sydyk is different from Zedek .. which in this case .. is preposterously false nonsense on Steriods .. Sydyk is the God of Justice and Righteousness .. as is Zedek .. Phoenician God = Canaaanite God .. perhaps do a quick Geography Check .. see how far Tyre is from Jerusalem ...

Of course Zadok is a Canaanite Priest .. he was Priest in Jerusalem prior to David taking over. The King's name was Adoni-Zedek .. "My Lord is Zedek"

This Priestly Order was carried down from MelchiZedek to AdoniZedek 500 Years . Zadok being the High Priest when David took over.

How is the Priestly Order transferred onto David .. if not through Zadok . is there some other High Priest of Zedek that I missed ?

Hoplessly lost is your position .. your Claim that MelchiZedek has nothing to do with Abraham .. a mindless falsehood on steroids .. one you are aware of .. yet utter anyway. .. these are lessons from the dark side .. this behavoir ... indicative of "Thought Stopping" .. had some SMCT - been used - doing a little implantation into the subconscious.

 

[Sargonski]

You have no evidence that Sydyk was Malchi-tzedek's god.
You have no evidence that Sydyk was Adoni-tzedek's god.
You have no evidence that Malchi-tzedek and Adoni-tzedek were kings of the same place.
You have no evidence connecting Sydyk to Yirushalayim ( Jerusalem ).
You have no evidence of Abe worshipping EL.
You have no evidence of a redactor changing 1000s of names to YHWH.

There is plenty of evidence showing Abe worshipped YHWH by that name.
The wiki article YOU brought asserts this Zedek-god theory is fringe and is talking about PRE-ISRAELITE Jerusalem.

All you have is 1 verse, which is confusing in many english translations which add words that aren't *actually* there.
Even if that 1 verse is interpretted to your choosing, that DOES NOT give the name EL as Abe's god.
All you have guessing and arguing from ignorance "If it wasn't YHWH, what else could it be?".



So... Israel did not have priest kings. So that's another fault in this theory.



But they weren't the same town. That's a guess.



No.... you don't understand how compounding assumptions on assumptions reduces the liklihood of a theory being true. and you are chaining together assumption after assumption after assumption. But none of those assumptions are strong. They're all pretty weak.

No compounding of assumptions at all .. and let us not pretend to have some accumen in math/statistics .. nor logic.

Then we have more made up false accusation in the form of Strawman Fallacy --- "Israel did not have Priest Kings" - I never claimed they did. Why is it you have to make things up about others .. when your position is crucified.

Modern Scholarship states that the name of Abe's God Was El .. for some of the reasons given you .. but I have not given a comprehensive list. Your claim of 1 Verse .. is preposterous falsehood on steroid .. as have given many verses which support the Claim that ABe's God Was EL .. only one of which is his communion with the Canaaanite High Priest MelchiZedek.

this is coupled with Biblical History and Biblical Archaeology.

In a Canaanite cities - the Most High God of the Pantheon is EL -- In Phoenician cities -- the High God of the Pantheon is EL -- and Abraham does not know any "Most High" named YHWH .. As we are told by YHWH.

So what was the Name of the Most High God Abraham and this Canaanite Priest King were worshiping. By what name did they know this God .. and it matters not if you respond EL - CRonos- Ahura Mazda - or I Don't KNow .. What we do know is that the name wasn't YHWH.

So what was the name of this Most High God .. who are the other contenders you wish to put forth .. if you think Other than El ?

Crucified is your position ...

 

[muhammad_isa]

The point is your heresy .. Brother Muhamu .. due to lack of understanding .. of that which you claim to belief.

That does not really answer my question..
What heresy? What don't I understand?

You are just rambling on about names of gods, and how many among the Israelites
were ignorant polytheists .. so what?