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Without trust in God, I would have no hope

9-10ths_Penguin

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
Trailblazer said:
It does not talk to me since it does not have a physical voice. It communicates thoughts to my mind.
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So:

- some of the thoughts in your head, you attribute to the Holy Spirit.

- you find these thoughts helpful for guidance.

- you credit all this to God.

Not compelling to me, but you do you.
 
Trailblazer

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
9-10ths_Penguin said:
So:

- some of the thoughts in your head, you attribute to the Holy Spirit.

- you find these thoughts helpful for guidance.

- you credit all this to God.

Not compelling to me, but you do you.
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Why would it be compelling to you? You don't even believe that God exists.
 
osgart

osgart

Nothing my eye, Something for sure
Maybe it's a question of what a person is willing to keep, and what one is willing to let go of, and therein lies fate or destiny.

Humans are indeed running the show until viruses run the show or some other natural catastrophe.

I go for the same life I'd go for regardless of life is finite, or eternal, God or no God.

As I get older I have to learn to let go of things in this life. I wonder what would happen if I let go of everything, and just see where that takes me.

I don't see the point in infant mortality. God makes a place where these things happen.

I see some people only want this one life here and are fulfilled and contented with their lives here and then they peacefully pass away expecting absolutely nothing after this life.
 
Trailblazer

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
osgart said:
I see some people only want this one life here and are fulfilled and contented with their lives here and then they peacefully pass away expecting absolutely nothing after this life.
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but what they expect is not necessarily going to be what they get. I am not much of a gambler when the stakes are so high.
 
Trailblazer

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Thrillobyte said:
I believed in God and tried to trust in him for 60 years and it was a total waste. I never heard from God. He never answered any of my prayers. He didn't protect me from harm.
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Nobody ever hears from God except the Messengers of God. God answers prayers at His own behest and at His own discretion.
God does not protect people from harm because God is not Superman.
Thrillobyte said:
In short, it was if he didn't even exist so that's what I decided: that he doesn't exist and that believe or not believe it would all be the same. And that's exactly what happened. 12 years later nothing has changed for me. My life goes on with no change resulting from my conversion to complete atheism. It's as if God didn't care an iota if I believed in him or didn't believe in him.
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Whether you believe that God exists or not, it will all be the same. The only difference is that if you believe God will guide you you might get guidance.
God doesn't care if we believe in Him for His own benefit since God does not need our belief since God has no needs. God only wants us to believe in Him for our own benefit. God is fully self-sufficient, above the need for any of His creatures.
 
Koldo

Koldo

Outstanding Member
Trailblazer said:
You do not know what "I" can afford to do, only I know that. I could just as easily say that you cannot afford to believe in God so you can't evaluate the evidence objectively, but I would never say that since I don't claim to know what is in your mind

Why do you speak for me as if you know what is in my mind? You don't. Telling me what I can afford to do is also a personal boundary violation, if you know what that is.

66: O EMIGRANTS! The tongue I have designed for the mention of Me, defile it not with detraction. If the fire of self overcome you, remember your own faults and not the faults of My creatures, inasmuch as every one of you knoweth his own self better than he knoweth others.​

I believe in God because of the evidence for God, NOT because I cannot afford not to believe in God. If there was no evidence for God I would not believe in God so I would not trust in God. I have a reason to trust in God, because there is evidence for God.
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It looks like you have missed the entire context surrounding my message.

I truly can't read your mind, however I can read your words and you have said: "Please note that I was careful to change the title of this thread from Without God there is no hope to Without trust in God, I would have no hope, since I am only speaking for myself. I know that lots of people have hope without God, but I have no hope without God."

You said that without God you would have no hope. And I am saying that our mental stability necessitates at very least having a sense of hope when all else that could support us is not present. You have no hope without God and you can't live a meaningful life without hope (or do you happen to disagree?). So you need to believe in God to live. Or, in other words, you can't afford to cease believing in God.

This doesn't mean that you can never change though. Whether you will take the steps necessary to do it though, or even want to, is entirely up to you.
 
Trailblazer

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Koldo said:
You said that without God you would have no hope. And I am saying that our mental stability necessitates at very least having a sense of hope when all else that could support us is not present. You have no hope without God and you can't live a meaningful life without hope (or do you happen to disagree?). So you need to believe in God to live. Or, in other words, you can't afford to cease believing in God.
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You cannot afford to give up the things that give you hope. You have no hope without the things that give you hope and you can't live a meaningful life without hope. You would have no hope without the things that give you a reason to hope, so you cannot afford to give them up without losing your mental stability.

Or, in other words, you can't afford to cease believing in the things that give you hope.
Koldo said:
This doesn't mean that you can never change though. Whether you will take the steps necessary to do it though, or even want to, is entirely up to you.
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This doesn't mean that you can never change though. Whether you will take the steps necessary to do it though, or even want to, is entirely up to you.
 
CG Didymus

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
9-10ths_Penguin said:
Even taking the existence of God as a given, this seems pretty... meh.
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Plus the same old problem... A Protestant hears the Holy Spirit telling them one thing. A Catholic might hear something else. A Mormon something else. And a Baha'i? Definitely something else. So, if they are all hearing different things, is it really the Holy Spirit? Or... just a voice in their head that tells them things that just so happen to coincide with their religious beliefs?

Oh, and it's the same with this "having hope or trust in God". Each person in the various religions puts their hope and trust in the God they believe in. Which I think is defined differently in the different religions. So, hope and trust in their belief of who and what God is?
 
Truthseeker

Truthseeker

Non-debating member when I can help myself
Revoltingest said:
Things hard to see raise questions.
Science offers no answer.
Therefore God....so say some.
But that too raises questions.
Whence booted that guy into existence?
Why a population of only one?

My approach to it all....
We & stuff are here, enjoying the laws of physics (whatever
they are). If we can't objectively answer the question of "Why?",
then it's useless to dwell on the question. And even worse to
presume a particular answer.
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I am not dwelling on it.:)
 
Sand Dancer

Sand Dancer

Currently catless
Trailblazer said:
If you are making an assumption that believers believe because they are emotionally invested in believing that is not true for all believers.
I cannot cease believing in God because I believe God exists. I believe God exists because of the evidence I see for God, not because I am emotionally invested into believing.
You cannot start believing in God because you see no evidence for God.
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Can the evidence possibly be attributed to something other than a god?
 
idea

idea

Question Everything
Trailblazer said:
“While a man is happy he may forget his God; but when grief comes and sorrows overwhelm him, then will he remember his Father who is in Heaven, and who is able to deliver him from his humiliations.”
‘Abdu’l-Bahá, Paris Talks, pp. 50-51
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For my personal experience, when things went well I had faith in God.

I became an athiest in my dark night. (Child abuse by clergy, anger at God, to finding it to be a better mindset to chalk it up to the laws of nature rather than evil God who tortures children)

As for hope - Nature is so powerful, I'm listening to a thunderstorm as I type. Minimalism reduces stress. Embrace scarcity, enjoy each moment.
 
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