Do Christians and Muslims Worship the Same God?

[Sajdah]

And I would also like to quote what Dardess say about the creation: " The Qur'an doesn't deny Genesis's depiction of the creation of the world in six orderly stages. In fact, the Qur'an assumes that its listeners already know about that primordial event from the Hebrew bible. The Qur'an wants to go instead to a point it believes is too often overlooked: the moral meaning of God's orderly creation. In sura 7:54, for example, the fact that the night and day "seek the other in quick succession" is not referred to confirm an orderly creative process, but primarily to show us, the Qur'an's audience, the lesson we should draw from that fact. The Qur'an if full of such references to the orderly obedience of the created world to God's amr or command. These references always target to human beings with the expectation that they will act according to the amr God has given to them as faithfully as the night and the day and all other phenomena already do to the amr given to them"

Who is Dardess? Has he studied Arabic language, and studied the science of Qur'an from credible Islamic institutions to give himself the right of explaining the verses of the holy Qur'an?
You know Lawrence, it is important to know his qualifications, it is not opened for any random guy to explain the Qur'an, even if they were Muslims....It is only exclusive to the knowledgeable scholars....

Maybe it's just hard to explain to you the concept of Trinity in the christian (actually more on Catholic) perspective because of doctrinal differences. And I would also don't want to insist myself, for that opposes the catholic doctrine about freewill.

Ok, what sort of questions? But don't expect too much from me. I'm not that good in quoting something from the scripture, that's why I use our dogma as a guide. Also, don't expect that good answer from a 17 yr old like me, I'm not Einstein!

Don't worry I'll not ask you to quote from your scripture, because I'm thinking of reading the New Testament, I've an Arabic copy, and wanted to read it long time ago, so when I start reading it, I'll send you the questions, if you don't mind

btw I don't think Einstein would be helpful in answering questions about christianity

 

[Bowman]

Really? From which anti-Islam book have you read that rubbish?!

The Arabic Koran.

 

[Renji]

Who is Dardess? Has he studied Arabic language, and studied the science of Qur'an from credible Islamic institutions to give himself the right of explaining the verses of the holy Qur'an?
You know Lawrence, it is important to know his qualifications, it is not opened for any random guy to explain the Qur'an, even if they were Muslims....It is only exclusive to the knowledgeable scholars....

Dardess is a member of both the Muslim-Catholic Alliance and the Commision on Muslim-Christian Relationa in Rochester, New York. And yes, he studied arabic, he do Qur'anic "recitations" and has sent a copy of his book to an Imam so they can check it.

Don't worry I'll not ask you to quote from your scripture, because I'm thinking of reading the New Testament, I've an Arabic copy, and wanted to read it long time ago, so when I start reading it, I'll send you the questions, if you don't mind

That's fine with me.

 

[Sajdah]

The Arabic Koran.

• The holy Qur'an is not anti-Islamic book, because it is the source of Islam..
• There is nothing as The Arabic Qur'an and the English Qur'an....etc...There is only one version of the holy Qur'an and it is in Arabic, the language it was revealed in....Other than that is called a translation of the meaning of the holy Qur'an....
• Now all what you have to do is to quote the verses from the holy Qur'an and put the translation to them too to support your claims which are:
• We Muslims worship Satan
• Jesus PBUH is god, and was crucified......etc
• Entrance into paradise is through the belief in Jesus christ as Lord

If you didn't quote all what you claimed from the Qur'an, then I think it would be good for you ( in case you want to have some credibility on this site) to tell us the book, or the person you heard him repeating such lies blindly...

 

[Sajdah]

Bowman, this site will help you in finding any verse from the Qur'an so quickly (but I bet in your case, it will be impossible for you to find any word of what you claimed, even if you kept searching thousands of years)...
The Holy Quran

 

[Bowman]

• The holy Qur'an is not anti-Islamic book, because it is the source of Islam..

If it is the source of islam, then why do the two differ so much...?

There is nothing as The Arabic Qur'an and the English Qur'an....etc...There is only one version of the holy Qur'an and it is in Arabic, the language it was revealed in....Other than that is called a translation of the meaning of the holy Qur'an....

Since we do not have the 'original' Koran in possession today...how can you make this claim?

 

[Bowman]

Now all what you have to do is to quote the verses from the holy Qur'an and put the translation to them too to support your claims which are:

• We Muslims worship Satan

الله الصمد

Allahu alssamadu

112.2 " The erecting of allah."





Observe the key term used only this one time in the Koran…


صمد = “samadu”

“samadu” definition:

Masculine singular noun. Elevated ground: or elevated and rugged ground, not so high as to be a mountain: or hard, firm, or tough, ground: or a narrow, rugged, and low part of a mountain, producing trees. With the article “al”, an epithet applied to God. A lord; because one repairs, betakes himself, or has recourse, to him in exigencies; or, when applied to God, because affairs are stayed, or rested upon Him; or a person to whom one repairs, betakes himself, or has recourse, in exigencies; or signifies a lord to whom obedience is rendered, without whom no affair is accomplished: or one to whom lordship ultimately pertains; or a lord whose lordship has attained its utmost point or degree; in which sense it is not applicable to God: or the Being that continues, or continues forever for ever, after his creatures have perished: or the Creator of everything, of whom nothing is independent, and whose unity everything indicates: or one who takes no nourishment, or food: also high, or elevated; applied to anything: a man above whom is no one: a man who neither thirsts nor hungers in war. A Lord, one to whom reference is made in matters of importance; as an adjective it means sublime, everlasting. Solid: not hollow; in which sense it may not be applied to God. A people having no trade, or occupation, nor anything by means of which they may live.

الصمد = “al” + “samadu” = “alssamadu” = the setting up, or erecting, a thing

It comes from the root “samada” (sad-miim-dal), which means he tended, repaired, betook himself, or directed himself or his course or aim, to, or towards, him, or it; or endeavored to reach, or attain, or obtain, him, or it; or had recourse to him, or it. He pointed towards it. Set up, erect a thing, adorn, wish, repair, strike. To wish to approach any one.

References:
An Arabic-English Lexicon, E.W. Lane, volume four, pp. 1726 - 1727
The Dictionary of the Holy Qur’an, 1st edition, Abdul Mannan Omar, pp. 321 - 322
A Dictionary and Glossary of the Koran, John Penrice, p.86
Concordance of the Koran, Gustav Flugel, p. 111



Even a casual study of the term “alssamadu”, being applied directly to the Koranic “allah”, is disturbing to say the least.

The term itself obviously emanates from pagan idol worship.

Look at the root definition:

• He directed himself towards it
• He pointed towards it.
• Set up, erect a thing

All these things speak of an idol that was worshiped as deity.

The term itself also speaks of an idol:

• Solid; not hollow
• Applied to anything
• A lord whose lordship has attained its utmost point or degree
• Elevated ground

A solid idol that has been placed on elevated ground and is worshiped due to the fact that it has attained its utmost point or degree.

Thus, if “allah” was a statue, as this ayah clearly indicates, then how could he ever beget a Son?

Think on it…

 

[Rainbow Mage]

I have a question for the Muslims who have so far posted in this thread. Doesn't the Quran say that Christians and Muslims have the same God, and that some Christians will inherit paradise, and that the Quran only says that Christians have an incorrect view of God? How is that saying they're not the same God?

 

[Sajdah]

If it is the source of islam, then why do the two differ so much...?

Islam and Qur'an differ??

Since we do not have the 'original' Koran in possession today...how can you make this claim?

If you didn't quote all what you claimed from the Qur'an, then I think it would be good for you ( in case you want to have some credibility on this site) to tell us the book, or the person you heard him repeating such lies blindly...

 

[Sajdah]

الله الصمد

Allahu alssamadu

112.2 " The erecting of allah."

Here is the correct translation;
[112:2] "Allah-us-Samad (allah The Self-Sufficient Master, Whom all creatures need, (He neither eats nor drinks))
btw why don't you post the source you quoted this post from? Anyway I'll do it for you: Koran copied from the Bible - Page 25 - Christian Forums
You know it is called plagiarism!

 

[Sajdah]

I have a question for the Muslims who have so far posted in this thread. Doesn't the Quran say that Christians and Muslims have the same God, and that some Christians will inherit paradise, and that the Quran only says that Christians have an incorrect view of God? How is that saying they're not the same God?

Please, read the thread and you will find the answer to your question...

As for "christians will inherit paradise" part:

[2:62] Verily! Those who believe and those who are Jews and Christians, and Sabians, whoever believes in Allah and the Last Day and does righteous good deeds shall have their reward with their Lord, on them shall be no fear, nor they grieve.
The answer is in the bold part... I hope that helps!!

 

[Bowman]

Here is the correct translation;
[112:2] "Allah-us-Samad (allah The Self-Sufficient Master, Whom all creatures need, (He neither eats nor drinks))

You just finished saying that there are no correct translations outside of Arabic.

Have you now changed your mind?

btw why don't you post the source you quoted this post from? Anyway I'll do it for you: Koran copied from the Bible - Page 25 - Christian Forums
You know it is called plagiarism!

How does one plagiarize oneself?

 

[Bowman]

Jesus PBUH is god,

Here, from the Koran, Jesus is stated to be God:

Jesus Knows the Hour


Twice, in sura 43, Jesus Christ (i.e. the Son), is accurately described as possessing knowledge of The Resurrection…

ولما ضرب ابن مريم مثلا إذا قومك منه يصدون وقالوا ءألهتنا خير أم هو ما ضربوه لك إلا جدلابل هم قوم خصمون إن هو إلا عبد أنعمنا عليه وجعلنه مثلا لبني إسرءيل ولو نشاء لجعلنا منكم ملئكة في الأرض يخلفون وإنه لعلم للساعة فلا تمترن بها واتبعون هذا صرط مستقيم​

Walamma duriba ibnu maryama mathalan itha qawmuka minhu yasiddoona waqaloo aalihatuna khayrun am huwa ma daraboohu laka illa jadalan bal hum qawmun khasimoona in huwa illa AAabdun anAAamna AAalayhi wajaAAalnahu mathalan libanee isra-eela walaw nashao lajaAAalna minkum mala-ikatan fee al-ardi yakhlufoona wa-innahu laAAilmun lilssaAAati fala tamtarunna biha waittabiAAooni hatha siratun mustaqeemun

And only Mary's Son, held up (as) a sign on your nation, from Him they start raising clamor. And they said: "Are our gods better or He?” That they set Him forth to you except disputation, but they, a nation (of) contentious people. Indeed He except a slave; we have bestowed blessings on Him, and we made Him a sign to Israel’s sons. And if we will, truly we made from your angels upon the earth, they succeed. And truly He (has) knowledge to The Resurrection, so have no doubt on account of it, and follow Me, this exact right path. (43.57 – 61)


Here, only Jesus Christ is described as being a sign to the people.

Jesus is stated to be an exception (i.e. in a class all by Himself, via “illa”) both to the disputing people, and also as a mere slave.

Jesus is shown to be in deity status as He is compared against the people’s gods. Further, Jesus is stated to have angels upon the earth, and that He possesses indisputable knowledge regarding the Resurrection.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------

قل إن كان للرحمن ولد فأنا أول العبدين سبحن رب السموت والأرض رب العرش عما يصفون فذرهم يخوضوا ويلعبوا حتى يلقوا يومهم الذي يوعدون وهو الذي في السماء إله وفي الأرض إله وهو الحكيم العليم وتبارك الذي له ملك السموت والأرض وما بينهما وعنده علم الساعة وإليه ترجعون ولا يملك الذين يدعون من دونه الشفعة إلا من شهد بالحق وهم يعلمون​

Qul in kana lilrrahmani waladun faana awwalu alAAabideena subhana rabbi alssamawati waal-ardi rabbi alAAarshi AAamma yasifoona fatharhum yakhoodoo wayalAAaboo hatta yulaqoo yawmahumu allathee yooAAadoona wahuwa allathee fee alssama-i ilahun wafee al-ardi ilahun wahuwa alhakeemu alAAaleemu watabaraka allathee lahu mulku alssamawati waal-ardi wama baynahuma waAAindahu AAilmu alssaAAati wa-ilayhi turjaAAoona wala yamliku allatheena yadAAoona min doonihi alshshafaAAata illa man shahida bialhaqqi wahum yaAAlamoona

Say: "Indeed on account of the most merciful Son, so I myself the worshippers' first.” Glory be to the heavens and the earth’s Lord, the throne's Lord, from what they ascribe. So leave them alone; they indulged and they jest until they meet their day whom they were threatened. And He, whom upon the cloud, God, and upon the earth, God, and He, the wise, the one who knows. And exalted whom certainly His, King (of) the heavens and the earth and what is between them and with Him is the knowledge of the Resurrection, and to Him you are taken back. And has no power to prevail whom they call from superior to Him, The Intercession, except He; He bore witness on account of The Truth and them, they know. (43.81- 86)



Again, sura 43 proclaims that the Son (i.e. Jesus Christ) possesses knowledge of the Resurrection (AAilmu alssaAAati).

Jesus Christ, the subject of these ayahs, also has these things revealed about Him:

• Jesus is worshiped as the Most Merciful
• Jesus is Lord of the heavens and earth
• Jesus is King of the heavens and earth
• Jesus is Lord of the Throne
• Jesus is God upon the Cloud
• Jesus is God upon the Earth
• Jesus is The Intercession
• Jesus is The Witness
• Jesus is The Truth
• None are superior to Him
• Jesus takes back those who are His on the Day of Resurrection

Not surprisingly, these ayahs are proclaiming Jesus’ return on a Cloud, on the Day of the First Resurrection, just as found in Revelation chapter fourteen.

 

[Bowman]

Jesus was crucified......etc

وقولهم إنا قتلنا المسيح عيسى ابن مريم رسول


الله وما قتلوه وما صلبوه ولكن شبه لهم وإن


الذين اختلفوا فيه لفي شك منه ما لهم به من علم


إلا اتباع الظن وما قتلوه يقينا​

Waqawlihim inna qatalna almaseeha AAeesa ibna maryama rasoola Allahi wama qataloohu wama salaboohu walakin shubbiha lahum wa-inna allatheena ikhtalafoo feehi lafee shakkin minhu ma lahum bihi min AAilmin illa ittibaAAa alththanni wama qataloohu yaqeenan

4.157 And their saying: "Truly we killed The Messiah, Jesus, Mary's son, “allah's” messenger”, and that they killed him, and that they crucified him, and certainly they alike, and truly whom they differed in Him, certainly they (are) not in doubt from Him, on account of Him, from knowledge, except to follow the belief, and that they surely killed him.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Honestly I can't see how Christians and Muslims don't worship the same God. It's obvious they do. Now one could argue about semantics, but in the end, they both believe many of the same things about God. They believe God is almighty, all knowing, that he will raise the righteous and unrighteous to judgment of either eternal bliss or eternal torment. I could go on.

 

[Bowman]

Entrance into paradise is through the belief in Jesus christ as Lord

Paraphrased Book of Revelation Heaven material is strewn across the pages of the Koran and exactly mirrors the description contained in the Holy Bible.

Koranic Paradise is built upon, and is reserved for, the followers of Jesus Christ. This is readily apparent from the construction of Heaven as it contains twelve foundations built upon Jesus’ twelve disciples; with twelve gates of entrance based upon the twelve tribes of Israel.

All this, completely lost to ignorance in what is now known as Islam…




1) Will there be a New Creation?
Revelation: yes (3.12, 21.1-2, 21.5)
Koran: yes (10.4, 10.34, 14.19, 17.49-51, 17.98, 21.104, 27.64, 29.19, 30.11, 30.27, 32.10, 34.7, 35.16, 50.15, 71.17-18)

2) Will the New Creation consist of a New Heavens and a New Earth?
Revelation: yes (21.1-2, 21.5)
Koran: yes (14.48, 17.99, 21.104, 27.64, 29.19, 30.11, 30.27, 71.17-18)

3) Will the Old Heavens and the Old Earth pass away?
Revelation: yes (21.1)
Koran: yes (81.11)

4) Will there be a City?
Revelation: yes (3.12, 11.2, 14.2, 20.9, 21.2, 21.10, 21.14 – 16, 21.18 – 19, 21.21, 21.23, 22.14, 22.19)
Koran: yes (90.1 - 2)

5) Does the City descend?
Revelation: yes (3.12; 21.2, 21.10)
Koran: yes (90.1 – 2, 26.90, 50.31, 53.13, 67.27, 81.13)

6) Is someone descending with the City?
Revelation: yes (3.21, 14.1)
Koran: yes (90.1 - 2)

7) Does the City involve a father and offspring?
Revelation: yes (3.21, 14.1)
Koran: yes (90.3)

8) What is the shape of the City?
Revelation: cube (21.16)
Koran: cube (5.95, 5.97)

9) What is it made of?
Revelation: gold (21.18 - 21)
Koran: gold (17.92 - 93)

10) Is the foundation made of precious stones?
Revelation: yes (21.19 - 20)
Koran: yes (56.15)

11) Are these precious stones various colors?
Revelation: yes (21.19 - 20)
Koran: yes (81.13)

12) Made of chrysolyte?
Revelation: yes (21.19 - 20)
Koran: yes (24.35, 55.58, 81.13)

13) What is surrounding the City?
Revelation: wall (21.12 - 19)
Koran: wall (7.44-49, 53.15, 57.12 -13)

14) Is the wall high?
Revelation: yes (21.12 - 19)
Koran: yes (7.44-49)

15) Is the wall green?
Revelation: yes (21.11, 21.18)
Koran: yes (81.13)

16) How do you enter the City?
Revelation: gates (21.12-13, 22.14)
Koran: gates (13.22-24, 21.101-103, 38.50, 39.73, 43.34, 57.12-13)

17) How many gates are there?
Revelation: twelve (21.10 - 13)
Koran: twelve (85.1)

18) Are the gates open?
Revelation: yes (21.25)
Koran: yes (38.50, 39.73, 76.19)

19) What do the gates look like?
Revelation: pearls (21.21)
Koran: pearls (22.23, 35.33, 52.24, 55.22, 55.58, 56.22 -23, 76.19)

20) Do the gates have names on them?
Revelation: yes (21.12)
Koran: yes (85.1)

 

[Bowman]

Honestly I can't see how Christians and Muslims don't worship the same God. It's obvious they do. Now one could argue about semantics, but in the end, they both believe many of the same things about God. They believe God is almighty, all knowing, that he will raise the righteous and unrighteous to judgment of either eternal bliss or eternal torment. I could go on.

Muslims deny the Son.

Therefore they do not worship the same God.

 

[ZooGirl02]

I believe that Christians and Muslims worship the same God. Here is what the Catechism of the Catholic Church says:

841 The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."

 

[Renji]

Muslims deny the Son.

Therefore they do not worship the same God.

I don't know why you have (I think) such "Anti Islamic thoughts". However, I do not believe you when you said that they worship Satan. Both Christianity and Islam treat Satan as the enemy of God. And As what I've seen on the Muslim people, they have a strong faith in God, that is comparable to the faith of Abraham (which we, christians sometimes fail to show to God). They believe in the Creator. Wouldn't God be pleased if you accept Him that way? They may not accept Jesus as God, but still, they believe in Him as a prophet.

 

[Renji]

Paraphrased Book of Revelation Heaven material is strewn across the pages of the Koran and exactly mirrors the description contained in the Holy Bible.
Koranic Paradise is built upon, and is reserved for, the followers of Jesus Christ. This is readily apparent from the construction of Heaven as it contains twelve foundations built upon Jesus’ twelve disciples; with twelve gates of entrance based upon the twelve tribes of Israel.

Doesn't that make the Qur'an of the Muslims contain the same message that Bible would want to say about the Kingdom of God and the salvation of man? If the Qur'an "mirrors" the Bible on that part (and any other parts), doesn't that make it as a word of God also (on the Christian's part), just presented in a different way?