Do Christians and Muslims Worship the Same God?

[Maimonides]

They didn't have the original scripture that what the revelation to the prophet is all about they had strayed! the Torah and injeel were deemed to be corrupted.

Correct....I think my problem is when the current Torah as is used in today's Synagouges and is deemed corrupted, in certain debates I find Muslims often at times quoting the Bible a lot. That's like me quoting a research I know that has flaws in it. I'm either going to quote the source to refute it or not use the source at all.

 

[kai]

Correct....I think my problem is when the current Torah as is used in today's Synagouges and is deemed corrupted, in certain debates I find Muslims often at times quoting the Bible a lot. That's like me quoting a research I know that has flaws in it. I'm either going to quote the source to refute it or not use the source at all.

Yes its not unusual for some people to take the view that points which suit some people arnt corrupted and those that dont are.

 

[Database]

Muslims and Christians both worship God
but difference is Christians dont accept Hazrat Muhammad PBUH as a Prophet of ALLAH

 

[J2hapydna]

Correct....I think my problem is when the current Torah as is used in today's Synagouges and is deemed corrupted, in certain debates I find Muslims often at times quoting the Bible a lot. That's like me quoting a research I know that has flaws in it. I'm either going to quote the source to refute it or not use the source at all.

I believe in both the Torah and the Quran, as divinely inspired.

 

[mirfan]

Um Agree with database with one more thing Muslims dont believe in Jesus as son of God but `as prophet

 

[J2hapydna]

Um Agree with database with one more thing Muslims dont believe in Jesus as son of God but `as prophet

The Hebrew word for son also means servant. Hence, servant of God in Hebrew can also be translated to son of God and used as such by Christians. http://knowingallah.com/V2/Document.aspx?lang=en&id=1432

 

[A-ManESL]

Correct....I think my problem is when the current Torah as is used in today's Synagouges and is deemed corrupted, in certain debates I find Muslims often at times quoting the Bible a lot. That's like me quoting a research I know that has flaws in it. I'm either going to quote the source to refute it or not use the source at all.

There are many Muslims who don't believe in literal corruption of the text of the Bible, but in corruption of meaning or interpretation. You can take a look at point 3 and 4 here for details.

Regards

 

[Caladan]

There are many Muslims who don't believe in literal corruption of the text of the Bible, but in corruption of meaning or interpretation. You can take a look at point 3 and 4 here for details.

Regards

How many Muslims would you say hold that opinion? also would you say that the Muslims who join in and try to find 'evidence' for the prophethood of Muhammad in the Hebrew Bible hold this opinion? do these people understand that the holy scripture of the Jews (and Christians), has no context about 7th century Arabia, but deals with the people of Israel and their relationship with God, starting from perhaps what archaeologists would call the Iron age, many centuries before Mecca has existed, before Muhammad was born into the tribe of Qurayash, and centuries before Arab tribes in Hijaz heard of the Archangel Gabriel. it does not deal with the tribal feuds between the tribes of Medina, but with the political schemes between Israelite monarchs and the kings of the Near Eastern empires, about Israelite leaders, prophets, and people, about their poetry and literature, their own prophecies, and their own distinct linguistic style and usage, which is different from the content of the Qur'an.

 

[A-ManESL]

How many Muslims would you say hold that opinion? also would you say that the Muslims who join in and try to find 'evidence' for the prophethood of Muhammad in the Hebrew Bible hold this opinion?

I dont know the answer to the first question as to how many. The list I linked to contains reputable scholars though, not ordinary Muslims, so it is a probable that these scholars had many followers. For the second, I would say nothing could be concluded about the opinions of Muslims who indulge in, what I believe to be , such immature exercises. I am yet to come across real scholars who have tried to do this.

Regards

 

[J2hapydna]

do these people understand that the holy scripture of the Jews (and Christians), has no context about 7th century Arabia, but deals with the people of Israel and their relationship with God, starting from perhaps what archaeologists would call the Iron age, many centuries before Mecca has existed, before Muhammad was born into the tribe of Qurayash, and centuries before Arab tribes in Hijaz heard of the Archangel Gabriel. it does not deal with the tribal feuds between the tribes of Medina, but with the political schemes between Israelite monarchs and the kings of the Near Eastern empires, about Israelite leaders, prophets, and people, about their poetry and literature, their own prophecies, and their own distinct linguistic style and usage, which is different from the content of the Qur'an.

Caladan,

I am not sure if you have read the Quran. However, it is not a book full of stories about Arab tribes in Mecca and Medina. Nor does it describe the names of the children of Ishmael nor the tribes that were formed by his children etc. It mostly a description of stories about Moses and the people who were with him.

 

[Caladan]

Caladan,

I am not sure if you have read the Quran. However, it is not a book full of stories about Arab tribes in Mecca and Medina. Nor does it describe the names of the children of Ishmael nor the tribes that were formed by his children etc. It mostly a description of stories about Moses and the people who were with him.

I have read the Qur'an. I am aware that it discusses Moses more than any other religious figure, and that it discusses the people of Israel. and there is much sense in that, Islam takes great inspiration from the tradition of Israel, from its prophets, its leaders, and its ancient society in the middle east, Muhammad and Islam had to base their tradition on flourishing existing monotheistic society and tradition, especially when the God of Islam is considered to be the God of the people of Israel and the Jews.
however the Hebrew Bible and Israelite tradition deal with the people of Israel, their relationship with God, their political and social challenges centuries before Muhammad appeared, before Mecca was built, and before Islamic tradition made itself dominate in the middle east.
The Hebrew Bible has nothing to say about this episode in history, about the tribe of Qurayash, about Muhammad meditating in the cave and about his challenges against the Jahilliyah.
It is perfectly natural for Muslims to find basis or inspiration for their tradition in the Hebrew Bible or Jewish tradition, however it does not come out well when Muslim believers plagiarize the holy scripture of other Abrahamic traditions which have been established long before the Qur'an was written and the Hadith compiled, further more it doesn't represent Muslims well when they show this kind of ignorance of one of the most celebrated and studied texts in Western history.

 

[Caladan]

I dont know the answer to the first question as to how many. The list I linked to contains reputable scholars though, not ordinary Muslims, so it is a probable that these scholars had many followers. For the second, I would say nothing could be concluded about the opinions of Muslims who indulge in, what I believe to be , such immature exercises. I am yet to come across real scholars who have tried to do this.

Regards

That's fair. however I'd be interested to know a little about the credentials of these Islamic scholars of the study of the Hebrew Bible and the Hebrew language, and who's interpretation it is they are criticizing.

 

[J2hapydna]

however the Hebrew Bible and Israelite tradition deal with the people of Israel, their relationship with God, their political and social challenges centuries before Muhammad appeared, before Mecca was built, and before Islamic tradition made itself dominate in the middle east.

The Hebrew Bible has nothing to say about this episode in history, about the tribe of Qurayash, about Muhammad meditating in the cave and about his challenges against the Jahilliyah.

Yes, but if scientists suggest that the Quraysh and the Cohanim are descendants of a single man who lived about 3,000 years ago. If Jewish historians begin to suggest that religious practices of Islam are too close to Jewish traditions for them to have evolved separately. If history suggests that a family of Cohens that is lost to Jewish history, was trying to unite with Assyrians and Egyptians (Hanif = profane) around the time the Quraysh was formed. Then, I would say religious people need to modify their views to bring them in line with secular reality. One cannot pander to religious dogma and allow it to superce secular facts. btw, The Quran disagrees with your view that Muhammad and Arabia have nothing to do with the Jewish Bible. I do not expect you to accept the Quran, since you are Jewish. However, I do expect one to acknowledge the scientific findings and respect the rights of Muslims to believe what the Quran says, when there is secualar evidence to support such views. I feel Isaiah 19 and Matt 24 both have considerable to say about this episode in history.

 

[A-ManESL]

That's fair. however I'd be interested to know a little about the credentials of these Islamic scholars of the study of the Hebrew Bible and the Hebrew language, and who's interpretation it is they are criticizing.

You may take a look here for starters. I think you need to develop an understanding of the general methodologies of such analysis and the context of the analysis before anything else. Imam Ghazali argued with the implicit assumption that the Gospels were genuine.

Regards

 

[Caladan]

Yes, but if scientists suggest that the Quraysh and the Cohanim are descendants of a single man who lived about 3,000 years ago.

Which scientists are these? where have they obtained their education? are their theories seriously studied in a peer reviewed environment?

If Jewish historians begin to suggest that religious practices of Islam are too close to Jewish traditions for them to have evolved separately.

Which Jewish historians? what are the specific claims? Jews have always lived in the middle east, in pre-Islamic times and in Islamic times, the influence of the Jews over the people of the middle east is evident, even in the Qur'an itself not to mention the Hadith.

If history suggests that a family of Cohens that is lost to Jewish history, was trying to unite with Assyrians and Egyptians (Hanif = profane) around the time the Quraysh was formed. Then, I would say religious people need to modify their views to bring them in line with secular reality.

Who's history? in which university's library can I find these historical books? also Hanif does not mean profane, in Islamic tradition a Hanif is a man who rejected polytheism during the times in which Arab people were polytheistic and perhaps even practiced tradition related to that of Abraham. further more are you saying that what you just proposed is a secular reality and has no religious agenda to give more credibility to Islam in the eyes of 'Westerners'?

One cannot pander to religious dogma and allow it to superce secular facts. btw, The Quran disagrees with your view that Muhammad and Arabia have nothing to do with the Jewish Bible. I do not expect you to accept the Quran, since you are Jewish. However, I do expect one to acknowledge the scientific findings and respect the rights of Muslims to believe what the Quran says, when there is secualar evidence to support such views. I feel Isaiah 19 and Matt 24 both have considerable to say about this episode in history.

I am talking about the Hebrew Bible, not what some Muslims think. the Hebrew Bible has NOTHING to say about Muhammad or Islam. also which scientific findings are we to acknowledge? so far some of the claims made by some Muslim members, usually not the longstanding Muslim members would get students kicked out of classes in some of the universities I know, sort of a parallel to asking an Egyptologist about the aliens building the pyramids in his class.. it cannot turn out well.
as for Muslims and the Qur'an, the Qur'an is the book of books of Islam and nowhere have I told Muslims not to treat it as such.

 

[J2hapydna]

Which scientists are these? where have they obtained their education? are their theories seriously studied in a peer reviewed environment?

Use any of the following commercially available softwares to determine Age of Most Recent Common Ancestor.

DNA Tools - Statistics FTDNAtip | Common Ancestor, Mutation and Expected Calculator | Statistical software | statistical analysis of genomic Dubai, Saudi Arabia, Oman

Apply it to Familtree DNA database of Jews and Arabs.

Family Tree DNA - The World's Only Newsletter Dedicated to Genetic Genealogy

Which Jewish historians? what are the specific claims? Jews have always lived in the middle east, in pre-Islamic times and in Islamic times, the influence of the Jews over the people of the middle east is evident, even in the Qur'an itself not to mention the Hadith.

Do you have a Facebook account? I can link you to a Jewish historian in Jerusalem.

Who's history? in which university's library can I find these historical books? also Hanif does not mean profane, in Islamic tradition a Hanif is a man who rejected polytheism during the times in which Arab people were polytheistic and perhaps even practiced tradition related to that of Abraham. further more are you saying that what you just proposed is a secular reality and has no religious agenda to give more credibility to Islam in the eyes of 'Westerners'?

Josephus is one source from this time period. He is not someone created by Al Qaeda to promote Islam to the West, if that is what you are suggesting. I am sure you can find his work in many libraries.

The important fact is that Hanif existed in Arabia prior to the coming of Muhammad. Hanif in Arabic means to incline away. It can be a reference to one who inclines away from polytheism. It could also be someone who inclined away from Judaism and Christianity since the hanif believed in the God of Abraham but did not associate themselves with Judaism and Christianity. In Syriac Hanipha were the heathen. In Hebrew h.n.f is a reference to profane.

Yes I deny that these ideas are to give credibility to Islam in the eyes of Westerners. Unless by Westerners you mean reasonable people.

I am talking about the Hebrew Bible, not what some Muslims think. the Hebrew Bible has NOTHING to say about Muhammad or Islam.

So you say. Which Bible is Isaiah 19 found in?

also which scientific findings are we to acknowledge? so far some of the claims made by some Muslim members, usually not the longstanding Muslim members would get students kicked out classes in some of the universities I know, sort of a parallel to asking an Egyptologist about the aliens building the pyramids in his class..

These universities (that you know) must be in Israel, which kick students out. Although, many of these studies are coming out of Universities in Israel and historians in Israel. You can start by acknowledging the fact that the Arabs generally were not distantly paternally related to the Jews like Native Americans were to the Europeans, as western historians had suggested, among other things. Are you denying that Onias IV was trying to fulfill Isaiah 19? Are you denying that the Southern/ Mudhari arabs and Cohanim are the only two populations on earth in which descendants of one man named J1c3d are most common? Are you denying Muhammad claimed to be a prophet foretold in the OT?

 

[Caladan]

Use anyone of the following commercially available softwares to determine Age of Most Recent Common Ancestor.

DNA Tools - Statistics FTDNAtip | Common Ancestor, Mutation and Expected Calculator | Statistical software | statistical analysis of genomic Dubai, Saudi Arabia, Oman

Apply it to Familtree DNA database of Jews and Arabs.


Family Tree DNA - The World's Only Newsletter Dedicated to Genetic Genealogy

Surly you jest. a couple of posts ago you posted about the genetic link between the Jewish Cohanim and the tribe of Qurayash, and you provide me general sites of a do it yourself 'find your family' DNA websites? and a general line about the Jews and the Arabs?

Do you have a Facebook account? I can link you to a Jewish historian in Jerusalem.

Lets keep it here in this debate. who are these historians?

Josephus is one source from this time period. I am sure you can find his work in many libraries.

Which specific comments by Josephus?

The important fact is that Hanif existed in Arabia prior to the coming of Muhammad. Hanif in Arabic means to incline away. It can be a reference to one who inclines away from polytheism. It could also be someone who inclined away from Judaism and Christianity since the hanif believed in the God of Abraham but did not associate themselves with Judaism and Christianity. In Syriac Hanipha were the heathen. In Hebrew h.n.f is a reference to gentile/ profane.

Are you trying to make a point here? if so which is it?

So you say. Which Bible is Isaiah 19 found in?

Oh dear. Isaiah 19? 19 what? Chapter 19? verse 19 of which chapter?

These universities must be in Israel, which kick students out. Although, many of these studies are coming out of Universities in Israel and historians in Israel.

Wrong, I am talking about any university which does not take 'Quranic miracles of science' as academic, or pesudo-history as academic. etc. practically any university outside the Muslim world.

You can start by acknowledging the fact that the Arabs generally were not distantly paternally related to the Jews like Native Americans were to the Europeans, as western historians had suggested, among other things. Are you denying that Onias IV was trying to fulfill Isaiah 19? Are you denying that the Mudhari arabs and Cohanim are two populatioons on earth with descendants of one man named J1c3d being most common?

The fact that mideastern Jews and Arabs are related goes a long way from finding Islamic truths in the Hebrew Bible, there is no mystery in mid eastern people who have lived in the middle east for centuries to share similarities, however for Muslims to claim that the Hebrew Bible talks about Muhammad, and that the offspring of Jewish priests are related to Muhammad's tribe takes quite an irrational leap of faith.
am I denying these things? these things are hardly established in the first place!

 

[J2hapydna]

Surly you jest. a couple of posts ago you posted about the genetic link between the Jewish Cohanim and the tribe of Qurayash, and you provide me general sites of a do it yourself 'find your family' DNA websites? and a general line about the Jews and the Arabs?

The Cohanim populations share SNP J1c3d and similarities on 67 marker Haplotype with Southern Arabs and Mudhari tribes like no other nation on earth (both in absolute and relative terms). Those who understand the concept of SNPs and 67 marker Haplotype tests can use the tables I have provided to determine when these people shared a recent common ancestor. YDNA is not vodoo. It is science. SNP J1c3d is a very real and recent discovery.

Which specific comments by Josephus?

According to Josephus, Onias IV hoped that he and his family would eventually fulfill Isaiah 19:19-24 after he was expelled from the temple in Jerusalem. He established an altar on the border between the Egypts, to fulfill Isaiah 19. This temple was destroyed in the days of jesus. According to Josephus, Onias IV had decided to abandon the minorah (candelabrum) in favor of lamps hanging from strings between poles. He also introduced the minar.

Are you trying to make a point here? if so which is it?

My point is that Hanifs preexisted Muhammad in Arabia and all the meanings of Hanif in Hebrew, Syriac and Arabic would apply to the descendants of Honi. Jews may have considered the priests in Honi's Temple profane = Hanif, for constructing altar to G-d outside Jerusalem and ministering to non Jews. Christians may have considered Honi's Jewish followers hanipha who mixed with Non Christian Assyrians and Egyptians (heathens= hanipha) for denying the divinity of Jesus to be a heretics (hanipha). Arabs would have considered them Hanif because they inclined away from polytheism. So, the monotheist followers of Honi who worshipped the God of Abraham and revered the kabaa, would have been considered Hanif by all nations in the middle east.

Oh dear. Isaiah 19? 19 what? Chapter 19? verse 19 of which chapter?

Chap 19 in the Book of Isaiah (The same one that the Cohen Gadol Onias IV was trying to fulfill) . If you read Josephus on Onias IV it will become clearer to you, dear. Notice there are just 24 verses in the chapter. So, it should not be too difficult for you to read.

The fact that mideastern Jews and Arabs are related goes a long way from finding Islamic truths in the Hebrew Bible, there is no mystery in mid eastern people who have lived in the middle east for centuries to share similarities, however for Muslims to claim that the Hebrew Bible talks about Muhammad, and that the offspring of Jewish priests are related to Muhammad's tribe takes quite an irrational leap of faith.

It is one thing to be related and quite another to be so closely related (via SNP J1c3d). Can you name any other nation that clusters so tightly with the Cohanim, who are mostly descendants of one man carrying SNP J1c3d? Secondly, simiarlities are one thing and sharing rituals that could not have evolved independently is another.

If a Cohen family, kicked out of Jerusalem was busy trying to unite with Assyrians and Egyptians, by ministering to them on altars with minars, without candebrums on the border between the Egypts to fulfill Isaiah 19 suddenly disappeared. Then, if some man shows up a few hundred years later, who claims to be prophesised in the bible, who is genetically closely related to the Cohens, who starts uniting Assyrians and Egyptians around an altar without candelbrums, with lamps hanging from strings tied to poles and minars, a few hundred miles south of where the old Cohens had built their first temple on the border of Egypt; teaching rituals to worship G-d that closely remsemble those practiced by Jews in the days of the Temple, in that case, I do not think it takes an irrational leap of faith to conclude that that this man & his family may be the descendant of that lost Cohen family.

Now, if it so happens that this man, in addition, had come at at time when there was a pestilence arising out of Egypt, the water ways in Egypt were stinking, the crops were failing, etc as described in isaiah 19, then I would say that not only was this man probably a descendant of this Jewish family but he fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah 19 in a way that no other person in history but a real prophet such as Isaiah could have predicted.

Finally, do not compare this thesis with Chariots of the gods. There is no evidence for the existence of aliens. On the other hand there is plenty of evidence that Onias actually existed and his family was trying to achieve these things around an altar on the border of Egypt in the Sinai not that far from Mecca, before they disappeared in a world where the Romans were persecuting Jews and Arabia could provide a refuge. Therefore, it is plausible to assume that as persecution of Jews increased in Byzantium, this family, like many other Jews described in Arab history, would have moved south from the Sinai into Arabia. This is a reasonable and plausible historical explanation of how, why and where Islam spread as it did, and harmonizes the genetic evidence with what is known in history. The idea, held by historains, that Southern and mudhari Arabs were distantly related to Jews, in the same way as Native Americans were to Europeans has now been debunked.

 

[J2hapydna]

Surly you jest. a couple of posts ago you posted about the genetic link between the Jewish Cohanim and the tribe of Qurayash, and you provide me general sites of a do it yourself 'find your family' DNA websites? and a general line about the Jews and the Arabs?

It was only in Feb 2010 that geneticists discovered the SNP J1c3. I am talking about the SNP J1c3d, that was discovered after J1c3 was discovered. The evidence is very recent and developing very quickly:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_J1c3_(Y-DNA)

Therefore, it will be a while (perhaps another year, if at all) before any formal comprehensive study on the relationship of Arabs and Jews, will come out, that will include the significance of these new snps. However, those who understand SNPs and Haplotypes can immediately understand the implication by using the tables I have provided you. Do we have to wait for a study to tell us who is taller you or me? We can each tell each other our heights and determine who is taller. Similarly, we can find out how closely two people (a Jew & Arab) are related to each other using these tables and comparing our SNP and Haplotype profiles.

 

[Caladan]

The Cohanim populations share SNP J1c3d and similarities on 67 marker Haplotype with Southern Arabs and Mudhari tribes like no other nation on earth (both in absolute and relative terms). Those who understand the concept of SNPs and 67 marker Haplotype tests can use the tables I have provided to determine when these people shared a recent common ancestor. YDNA is not vodoo. It is science. SNP J1c3d is a very real and recent discovery.

Interestingly the only links I can find relating to the claims are dodgy posts on internet forums. surly by now, the claims you now import to this forum have been written about by geneticists, as it is a very real and recent discovery.
I would be interested to see articles by geneticists who write of the links between Jewish priests and the tribe of Quraysh.

According to Josephus, Onias IV hoped that he and his family would eventually fulfill Isaiah 19:19-24 after he was expelled from the temple in Jerusalem. He established an altar on the border between the Egypts, to fulfill Isaiah 19. This temple was destroyed in the days of jesus. According to Josephus, Onias IV had decided to abandon the minorah (candelabrum) in favor of lamps hanging from strings between poles. He also introduced the minar.

That is quite a cryptic post right there, please take your time and make your posts more readable. for example the line 'between the Egypts' does not make much sense, Onias IV built his temple at Leontopolis, in the central part of the Nile Delta. further more it would be very interesting to see you prove that the fact the Onias temple was built in the form of a tower means he introduced the minaret.
And again, of course it would be interesting to see the peer reviewed articles you can bring to expose the link between Onias IV and Muhammad's tribe, the Quraysh

My point is that Hanifs preexisted Muhammad in Arabia and all the meanings of Hanif in Hebrew, Syriac and Arabic would apply to the descendants of Honi. Jews may have considered the priests in Honi's Temple profane (for constructing altar to G-d outside Jerusalem) and ministering to non Jews. Christians may have considered Honi's Jewish followers who mixed with Non Christian Assyrians and Egyptians (heathens= hanipha) and denied the divinity of Jesus to be a heretics (hanipha). Arabs would have considered them Hanif because they inclined away from polytheism. So, the monotheist followers of Honi who worshipped the God of Abraham and revered the kabaa, would have been considered Hanif by all nations in the middle east.

This is quite a mishmash you have there. the 'monotheistic followers of Honi who revered the Kaaba', sources, sources, por-favor.

It is one thing to be related and quite another to be so closely related (via SNP J1c3d). Can you name any other nation that clusters so tightly with the Cohanim, who are mostly descendants of one man carrying SNP J1c3d? Secondly, simiarlities are one thing and sharing rituals that could not have evolved independently is another.

Many people in the middle east region, and even the expanded mid east region share genetic similarities through the Haplogroup J. I am still waiting for you to share the information that the Cohanim and the tribe of Quraysh share the closest genetic similarities, also I am waiting for the overwhelming ritualistic similarities.

If a Cohen family, kicked out of Jerusalem was busy trying to unite with Assyrians and Egyptians, by ministering to them on altars with minars, without candebrums on the border between the Egypts to fulfill Isaiah 19 suddenly disappeared.

The offspring of Onias have fit very well in the Egyptian elite, taking the positions of generals in Cleopatra's army, I don't know so much about ministering the Jewish religion to Egyptians, and certainly nothing about minarets.

Then, if some man shows up a few hundred years later, who claims to be prophesised in the bible, who is genetically closely related to the Cohens, who starts uniting Assyrians and Egyptians around an altar without candelbrums, with lamps hanging from strings tied to poles and minars, a few hundred miles south of where the old Cohens had built their first temple on the border of Egypt; teaching rituals to worship G-d that closely remsemble those practiced by Jews in the days of the Temple, in that case, I do not think it takes an irrational leap of faith to conclude that that this man & his family may be the descendant of that lost Cohen family.

See, this is where your post starts to resemble the kind of material you would find on a David Icke forum. Jews and Muslims have lived in the middle east for centuries, those generations who lived in Arab/Muslim lands share many basic things with the Muslims obviously, Muhammad being prophesied in the Hebrew Bible is NOT one of them, also It would help if you quote the verses from the Qur'an which say that the Hebrew Bible prophesies about Muhammad.

Finally, do not compare this thesis with Chariots of the gods. There is no evidence for the existence of aliens. On the other hand there is plenty of evidence that Onias actually existed and his family was trying to achieve these things around an altar on the border of Egypt in the Sinai not that far from Mecca, before they disappeared in a world where the Romans were persecuting Jews and Arabia could provide a refuge. Therefore, it is plausible to assume that as persecution of Jews increased in Byzantium, this family, like many other Jews described in Arab history, would have moved south from the Sinai into Arabia. This is a reasonable and plausible historical explanation of how, why and where Islam spread as it did, and harmonizes the genetic evidence with what is known in history. The idea, held by historains, that Southern and mudhari Arabs were distantly related to Jews, in the same way as Native Americans were to Europeans has now been debunked.

This is another mishmash. that Onias IV existed is a long stretch from proving that he is the forefather of a line that is related to Muhammad. also who are these 'Mudhari Arabs', the internet does not provide much information about them, so any neutral source unrelated to this subject of who specifically these groups of Arabs are would be interesting.
as for Native Americans, Europeans, and Arabs and Jews. obviously Mid eastern Jews and Arabs share many similarities as both being people with long roots and traditions in the middle east, there is really no mystery here.