I am a good man, so why don't I have a girlfriend? Do I need to be a jerk instead?

[Kathryn]

First off any man who claims to understand women completely is a damn fool. Even if it was possible to do so, you all would change your ways just for spite.

The OP does have a point that while many folks claim to want a certain kind of person, they usually are attracted to something different.

Then you have the situation that nice guys finish last which is not nessessarily a bad thing depending on what your doing.

Oooh la la...!

 

[Koldo]

Do you also agree that it's folly to generalize about "what all women want"?

Yes, certainly.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

First off any man who claims to understand women completely is a damn fool. Even if it was possible to do so, you all would change your ways just for spite.

The OP does have a point that while many folks claim to want a certain kind of person, they usually are attracted to something different.

Then you have the situation that nice guys finish last which is not nessessarily a bad thing depending on what your doing.

Oh, how I love dichotomies.

 

[Badran]

The OP said more than enough, I think. When someone muses about being a jerk to women, tough love is the nicest I can think of to answer it.

Put in mind that the way he worded it expresses how much he viewed it as disgusting, in more than one instance in his OP.

So i think the point might not have been as much that he's about to become, or contemplating becoming a jerk seriously, as much as it is airing frustration and wondering as i said. And considering his age (and i hope he doesn't feel insulted by my constant reference to it), i personally wouldn't take it against him in the least.

I think he was more wondering about "the nature of things" and wondering about the truth to the idea that nice guys are really liked by women, rather than asserting or making some decisions about women.

 

[Koldo]

We don't owe anybody anything, and because a guy can't get a date, it doesn't suddenly become a woman's problem.

I don't think he is saying that girls owe him anything though.

 

[MissAlice]

First off any man who claims to understand women completely is a damn fool. Even if it was possible to do so, you all would change your ways just for spite.

The OP does have a point that while many folks claim to want a certain kind of person, they usually are attracted to something different.

Then you have the situation that nice guys finish last which is not nessessarily a bad thing depending on what your doing.

Dont cha know? Women don't know what they want unlessl it comes in a limousine with wine in the back seat and a free trip to the Caribbeans. :beach:

 

[Koldo]

Put in mind that the way he worded it expresses how much he viewed it as disgusting, in more than one instance in his OP.

So i think the point might not have been as much that he's about to become, or contemplating becoming a jerk seriously, as much as it is airing frustration and wondering as i said. And considering his age (and i hope he doesn't feel insulted by my constant reference to it), i personally wouldn't take it against him in the least.

I think he was more wondering about "the nature of things" and wondering about the truth to the idea that nice guys are really like by women.

In other words, to put it simple, it was kind of a rant that expresses his attempt to understand the situation he is in. Which is pretty comprehensible.

 

[Badran]

Also, I need to point out that we weren't responding JUST to the guy in the OP. We were also responding to other, and in some cases, more inflammatory, posts by other people.

I understand that. I was only having in mind posts that specifically aim at the OP.

 

[Badran]

In other words, to put it simple, it was kind of a rant that expresses his attempt to understand the situation he is in. Which is pretty comprehensible.

Precisely.

 

[Chisti]

Suffice it to say that both men and women - at least a vast majority - are shallow.

 

[MissAlice]

I understand that. I was only having in mind posts that specifically aim at the OP.

I realize his frustration but I don't think you can expect people to respond in kind when words target a specific group of people in such a way that sounds offensive. He may not have been trying to be offensive but it did come off that way as not everyone here is a guy. I think there was some good or at least good attempt at feedback. And I wish him luck.

 

[MissAlice]

Suffice it to say that both men and women - at least a vast majority - are shallow.

Which is why it's good to remain single.

 

[-Peacemaker-]

How do you define "success with the ladies?"

For me "success with the ladies" means getting the ladies to want you, not necessarily in a lustful way either though it's usually inevitable if the values of the girl permit things like co-habitation and one night stands. As a Christian, I reject such practices as viable options. If a guy knows how to talk to a woman, he cleans up well, and is confident, he'll create enough dating opportunities to give him a good chance of finding someone he really connects with.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Okay, its not an entitlement thing its more a I feel like a man who is dying of thirst and cannot find water.

I am frustrated because I long for love, sex, companion. I have been told "this is how you attract a woman" and yet my attempts to do via the instructions give to me have ended in failure.

Though I wonder at this "entitlement" thing. I am a human being and all human beings deserve to love and to be love be virtue of being human beings. I dislike your statement because it sounds to me as though you are saying that there are situation where a human being might not be worthy of love.

Anyone....anyone.....who is coming off this desperate needs a wake up call. And my heart goes out to him as much as yours does. But I've got three teenage boys who all have their own misconceptions about women, and a teenage girl who has her own misconceptions about men. I'm just as blunt with them as I am with this thread.

Ruadri is worthy of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. But Kathryn mentioned very well what my point and all the other women's points have been all along. Romantic love is not something that is to be won or earned. It is a relationship.

There is nothing wrong with telling somebody who is frustrated with the same thing happening over and over again to get outside and smell the roses. A change of pace and perspective might be all that's needed.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

I realize his frustration but I don't think you can expect people to respond in kind when words target a specific group of people in such a way that sounds offensive. He may not have been trying to be offensive but it did come off that way as not everyone here is a guy. I think there was some good or at least good attempt at feedback. And I wish him luck.

Exactly.

 

[Badran]

I realize his frustration but I don't think you can expect people to respond in kind when words target a specific group of people in such a way that sounds offensive. He may not have been trying to be offensive but it did come off that way as not everyone here is a guy.

Well, i don't think it was really all that offensive given the points i mentioned.

But, that might just be because i'm an ignorant man.

(Just kidding )

I think there was some good or at least good attempt at feedback.

I agree, there have been plenty of good advice.

 

[Badran]

Anyone....anyone.....who is coming off this desperate needs a wake up call. And my heart goes out to him as much as yours does. But I've got three teenage boys who all have their own misconceptions about women, and a teenage girl who has her own misconceptions about men. I'm just as blunt with them as I am with this thread.

We have different approaches then. Generally, i don't prefer to meet desperate people, or people who are frustrated, with tough love.

I find it both unwarranted and unkind. That's not to say that the person doing it is unkind, but to say that its hurtful, and not in a way i find justified.

Ruadri is worthy of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. But Kathryn mentioned very well what my point and all the other women's points have been all along. Romantic love is not something that is to be won or earned. It is a relationship.

There is nothing wrong with telling somebody who is frustrated with the same thing happening over and over again to get outside and smell the roses. A change of pace and perspective might be all that's needed.

I understand your sentiment and appreciate your sincere attempt at helping him from your perspective.

I just don't think that the guy deserves to be told that he's not really nice at heart for example, just because he is for the first time (or in an early stage) meeting with some difficult things in life.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

We have different approaches then. Generally, i don't prefer to meet desperate people, or people who are frustrated, with tough love.

I find it both unwarranted and unkind. That's not to say that the person doing it is unkind, but to say that its hurtful, and not in a way i find justified.

That's fine. I find coddling foolishness is hurtful and more unkind in the long run, but then again I could not be a nice person when the going gets rough. I mean, look at me! I carry a whip and I use it!

I understand your sentiment and appreciate your sincere attempt at helping him from your perspective.

I just don't think that the guy deserves to be told that he's not really nice at heart for example, just because he is for the first time (or in an early stage) meeting with some difficult things in life.

Look at it this way, if somebody mused they should rob a bank because they were desperate for money, I wouldn't allow that to be a possibility. In fact, I think that line of thinking is only making that person MORE frustrated because he or she is seriously letting go of certain ethics in order to get something, which compounds the self-loathing that's already there. If I hear any sort of musing into unethical behavior for personal gain when the person KNOWS it's unethical, I think it's important to call them out on it.

Frustrated or not, I stand by my statement that if anybody even lightly thinks about being a jerk to women, I have something to say about it, and sternly. Such statements are not to be taken lightly, IMO.

 

[Alceste]

Stay in shape? Hard work. Be in better shape than your competition? Harder work.

Own a car? Work. Own a car that the ladies are known to pay attention to? Harder work.

Have work and a job to begin with? Work. Have work and a job that can compete with the rich players? Insane levels of work and luck.

Have a place to live to bring the ladies to? Work. Have a mansion to compete with the rich players? Insane levels of work and luck.

So you are trying to "get" the type of women who prioritize money and physical appearance over any other attribute, and you are surprised that the women you are chasing select men who are good looking and have lots of money?

By all means, work as hard as you can to get with a superficial twit of a woman, just don't pretend that kind of woman represents all of us.

 

[Alceste]

I'm thinking about throwing myself off a cliff. After I finish this bottle of wine.

Better to throw yourself into the arms of your loving husband and thank whatever God you worship that openly misogynistic attitudes about attracting a mate are in the minority these days.