More Guns Do Not Stop More Crimes, Evidence Shows

[Revoltingest]

It's all over the news here that some large companies in the US are withdrawing their financial support of the NRA due to US customer pressures.

US folks might just be beginning to exercise their freedom of voice and action over all of this. It is getting interesting enough for the Beeb to tell us all about it.

I heard.
So I'm planning to re-join the NRA.
That so many are dedicated to eliminating our main voice for gun rights is telling.
The anti-gun crowd doesn't just advocate & disagree....they need to silence others.

 

[Milton Platt]

Sounds like a straw man.
We have plenty of guns, & don't need more.
The real question is about regulating who has access to which ones & where.

Interesting article on the topic:
Do most mass shootings happen in gun-free zones?

 

[Revoltingest]

Interesting article on the topic:
Do most mass shootings happen in gun-free zones?

Nothing surprising there.
Mass shootings (however they're defined) are a small component of overall wrongful violence.
But they get the most news...just as a single plane crash killing hundreds is more covered than
auto accidents killing far more people. So such shootings deserve consideration, but shouldn't
be the prime mover of public policy.

 

[oldbadger]

I heard.
So I'm planning to re-join the NRA.
That so many are dedicated to eliminating our main voice for gun rights is telling.
The anti-gun crowd doesn't just advocate & disagree....they need to silence others.

We heard that the NRA has 5 million members, a small % of your adult population.
You can rejoin, of course, but I keep thinking of King Canute on the beach.

You're not any relation, are you? A dribble of royal blood?

 

[ADigitalArtist]

That so many are dedicated to eliminating our main voice for gun rights is telling

NRA speaks for themselves. Even when I was a gun owner (farmer) I never wanted to join those money grubbing fear mongerers. Even less so now that their reaction to massive loss of life is how they can protect their bottom line.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Nothing surprising there.
Mass shootings (however they're defined) are a small component of overall wrongful violence.
But they get the most news...just as a single plane crash killing hundreds is more covered than
auto accidents killing far more people. So such shootings deserve consideration, but shouldn't
be the prime mover of public policy.

That's my point too. People bemoan deaths, it's the central talking point, but apparently there seems to be a good kind of death and the bad kind of death.

It's perfectly okay and acceptable for people to die in vehicle incidents and occurrences en masse, but it's not perfectly ok and acceptable if somebody dies by firearm which statistically is far fewer.

The main crux of the debate should be over types of people themselves who handles any kind of machinery or tools that are dangerous towards human life.

It's completely idiotic to blame guns themselves nor should it be even a consideration when there is so much out there aside from guns that people can be used effectively to take human life.

What I see here is people willing to take people's gun rights away but God help anybody if their car should ever be under the same stringent scrutiny as guns are.

 

[Revoltingest]

We heard that the NRA has 5 million members, a small % of your adult population.
You can rejoin, of course, but I keep thinking of King Canute on the beach.

You're not any relation, are you? A dribble of royal blood?

If I ever had any royal blood, I'm sure it all leaked out in my many & varied injuries.

 

[Revoltingest]

NRA speaks for themselves. Even when I was a gun owner (farmer) I never wanted to join those money grubbing fear mongerers. Even less so now that their reaction to massive loss of life is how they can protect their bottom line.

And they used to dis us heathens.
But while not perfect, they're better than they were.
I view their reaction differently...something other than "money grubbing fear mongers".
That description is as unfair as saying the gun control fans "love school shootings as an excuse to gut the Constitution".

 

[Revoltingest]

....God help anybody if their car should ever be under the same stringent scrutiny as guns are.

Given the greater danger vehicles pose, regulation should be stricter.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Given the greater danger vehicles pose, regulation should be stricter.

By the same logic that people use on guns I think they should use on cars as they do with trucks right now. Government checkpoints so many miles, limited to how many hours you can drive a day based upon fatigue statistics (that would be great for the Greenies who want to lower vehicle emissions to cut down on greenhouse gas), mandatory breaks for the combat of fatigue, Health regulations that must be adhered to and be issued a medical certification saying you are healthy enough mentally and physically for driving, and subject to weigh stations and random inspection stops via patrol car. Oh and don't forget to maintain your electronic log book. ;0)

 

[Revoltingest]

By the same logic that people use on guns I think they should use on cars as they do with trucks right now. Government checkpoints so many miles, limited to how many hours you can drive a day based upon fatigue statistics (that would be great for the Greenies who want to lower vehicle emissions to cut down on greenhouse gas), mandatory breaks for the combat of fatigue, Health regulations that must be adhered to and be issued a medical certification saying you are healthy enough mentally and physically for driving, and subject to weigh stations and random inspection stops via patrol car.

And we must deal with trucks being the newest terrorist weapon.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

It is nowhere near as easy to get and keep a car as a gun. I wish gun regulation were on par with car regulation. Can you imagine having to register all your guns, bring them in for required safety checking, keep all legitimate documentation for title and ownership and have to do periodic proof of competency? Lose license for being unsafe (I'd love to give a ticket to some of my gun friends for not safely stowing their weapons, or taking them where they aren't supposed to be) or for having certain medical issues?

 

[ADigitalArtist]

And they used to dis us heathens.
But while not perfect, they're better than they were.
I view their reaction differently...something other than "money grubbing fear mongers".
That description is as unfair as saying the gun control fans "love school shootings as an excuse to gut the Constitution".

No it isn't. Gun control fans, and gun fans, aren't a monolith. NRA is. As a company they behave in a corrupt, politician buying, fear sowing way to get people to buy more guns. They are one of the best examples of capitalism gone monstrous. Along with big tobacco, big pharma and big oil.

 

[Revoltingest]

No it isn't. Gun control fans, and gun fans, aren't a monolith. NRA is. As a company they behave in a corrupt, politician buying, fear sowing way to get people to buy more guns. They are one of the best examples of capitalism gone monstrous. Along with big tobacco, big pharma and big oil.

We'll have to agree to disagree about the NRA being the more ethical party in this debate.

 

[Thief]

No, where did you get that from? I said that Trump's idea of having teachers carry concealed weapons is stupid. Teachers are like any other profession. There are great teachers, there are bad teachers, there are ethical teachers, there are cruel teachers, there are mean teachers, there are nice teachers, and there are smart teachers and there are stupid teachers. To even suggest that teachers are all smart or all stupid would be pretty foolish and unrealistic.

how about able bodied and willing to shoot back

 

[Thief]

No it isn't. Gun control fans, and gun fans, aren't a monolith. NRA is. As a company they behave in a corrupt, politician buying, fear sowing way to get people to buy more guns. They are one of the best examples of capitalism gone monstrous. Along with big tobacco, big pharma and big oil.

I have seen a report.....Remington is filing for bankruptcy

apparently there isn't enough fear to go around

 

[Thief]

And I want criminals to not have them.

good luck on your side of the fence

 

[idav]

good luck on your side of the fence

K well I’m not against guns I’m against idiots.

 

[wandering peacefully]

It is nowhere near as easy to get and keep a car as a gun. I wish gun regulation were on par with car regulation. Can you imagine having to register all your guns, bring them in for required safety checking, keep all legitimate documentation for title and ownership and have to do periodic proof of competency? Lose license for being unsafe (I'd love to give a ticket to some of my gun friends for not safely stowing their weapons, or taking them where they aren't supposed to be) or for having certain medical issues?

All excellent and very reasonable requirements to owning deadly weapons whose sole purpose is to kill things unlike an automobile. And I would add a use tax used to pay for security for our children at school and mandatory liability insurance just like for an automobile. Nothing in the second amendment prohibits these sensible requirements. They can still have all the guns they want but should help pay for the trouble their pleasure causes. They are free to own guns not to own guns free of responsibility. When the second was written not a one of them would dream of a time when hundreds of children would be murdered at school. I would bet anything not one of them would have written that amendment into the constitution if they could for one second dream of what the gun culture would turn into in this country.

 

[leibowde84]

Instead of his exact wording, imagine what actually policy might result.
The "wall" is similar. Many inferred a continuous physical wall. I knew
better, ie, that it would be discontinuous & multi-faceted.
If teachers are allowed to be armed, this would be under great scrutiny,
so I'd expect careful vetting & training.

Why do you think it is reasonable to assume all of these things about what Trump is secretly thinking. What evidence, specific to Trump (because we all know he is nothing like any other past politician), do you have to support these assumptions. They seem completely unreasonable to me, as you are assuming rational thoughts from an obviously irrational man.