Proselytizing

[Saint Frankenstein]

Wouldn't you agree that this is merely Bible-waving to maybe a clientele with a slightly higher IQ?

I'm seeing what that has to do with the subject of proselytism. Trying to convert non-believers and actions taken against members of a religion are two different things.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I'm seeing what that has to do with the subject of proselytism. Trying to convert non-believers and actions taken against members of a religion are two different things.

In sales circles, trying to retain existing customers and prospecting to new customers are two sides of the same coin.

 

[Wherenextcolumbus]

Could be, but I was not under the impression that Jehovah's Witnesses or Mormons did all that much of that kind of work. The Mennonites and the mainline protestants never visit.

I know the JWs do do that kind of work, I know they help during natural disasters. Their main focus is to convert people, but they do help the needy sometimes too, maybe not as much as you would like them to, but they do.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

In sales circles, trying to retain existing customers and prospecting to new customers are two sides of the same coin.

Bad analogy. Excommunication is a corrective measure, not a "sales" measure.

This is going off topic.

 

[Alceste]

I know the JWs do do that kind of work, I know they help during natural disasters. Their main focus is to convert people, but they do help the needy sometimes too, maybe not as much as you would like them to, but they do.

Fancy that! The JW I worked for for a few years never mentioned any kind of concern or empathy for the needy (except himself), but admittedly that's just one guy.

 

[Wherenextcolumbus]

Fancy that! The JW I worked for for a few years never mentioned any kind of concern or empathy for the needy (except himself), but admittedly that's just one guy.

Most are mainly charitable to other JWs and people who are studying with them. That means helping other poor JWs in other parts of the world and if a disaster strikes they will also help non JWs in a disaster situation, but their main focus is converting people and being charitable towards each other. So most of their resources will go into promoting the org rather than charity.
Though they view knocking on your door as a charitable act in itself because they believe they are helping to save people's lives for paradise.

 

[Pegg]

I believe in causes that are more important than me without deifying them. Is that the sort of thinv you're getting at?

but are they interested in you

 

[Pegg]

What do you mean by "something greater than ourselves", Pegg? God? If so, suppose god does not exist, and our need to connect to him is merely tragic? Would it be best then for us to ignore that he doesn't exist and try to connect to him anyway? Would that make for a good life? Or would such a life be a bit like trying to imagine you were the wife of a wonderful man when you were not even really married to anyone?

Wouldn't it be nobler to accept the truth and live it, than to conceive a lie and then try to live the lie?

but you are only assuming that there is no God. Whereas, God has actually presented himself and shown himself, and told us through 'many' people exactly who he is and what he wants.

So I dont believe its a false belief. I believe he is real and therefore I am living according to the truth whereas you may not be.

 

[Pegg]

Awe, wonder, deep peace, etc. doesn't depend on theology no matter how we poke at it. To see life as precious and melt into a beautiful scene with a group of people or out in nature doesn't need supernatural minds watching or giving a thumbs up.

how can you have peace in a world where there is no peace?

Thats the big difference for me. I look at the world and all I feel is dread over what is happening...it actually affects me to see children starving, wars, diseases and all the pain and suffering that goes along with that. And to top it all off people are nasty and hateful and the environment is being destroyed by our 'so-called' progress.

How do you find peace when all that is happening?

 

[Pegg]

Most are mainly charitable to other JWs and people who are studying with them. That means helping other poor JWs in other parts of the world and if a disaster strikes they will also help non JWs in a disaster situation, but their main focus is converting people and being charitable towards each other. So most of their resources will go into promoting the org rather than charity.
Though they view knocking on your door as a charitable act in itself because they believe they are helping to save people's lives for paradise.

that the best sort of help you can give someone is knowledge, hope and reason.

Our work is focused primarily on bible education. And teaching people is far greater then throwing money at a problem.

"Give a man a fish and he'll eat for one night, teach him how to fish and he will eat for a lifetime" ( dont know who said it, but its a good proverb )

 

[Wherenextcolumbus]

but you are only assuming that there is no God. Whereas, God has actually presented himself and shown himself, and told us through 'many' people exactly who he is and what he wants.

Who are these many people who God has presented himself to? Can you verify their experiences?

So I dont believe its a false belief. I believe he is real and therefore I am living according to the truth whereas you may not be.

So because you believe he is real that means you are living according to THE TRUTH!? Right...do I really have to point out what's wrong with that?

 

[Sees]

how can you have peace in a world where there is no peace?

Thats the big difference for me. I look at the world and all I feel is dread over what is happening...it actually affects me to see children starving, wars, diseases and all the pain and suffering that goes along with that. And to top it all off people are nasty and hateful and the environment is being destroyed by our 'so-called' progress.

How do you find peace when all that is happening?

Why would you see a half full cup as completely empty?

Cruelty, starvation, selfishness, etc. doesn't take away all the good and beautiful things about our earth, life, whatever.

I love earth and life personally, if more people really, trully did maybe they would wipe their faces and do more real good to help make it better?

You want to replace an atheists "void" with such negativity? It's not good for you or anybody else.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

but are they interested in you

Is that part of what you mean by "spiritual"?

 

[Alceste]

that the best sort of help you can give someone is knowledge, hope and reason.

Our work is focused primarily on bible education. And teaching people is far greater then throwing money at a problem.

"Give a man a fish and he'll eat for one night, teach him how to fish and he will eat for a lifetime" ( dont know who said it, but its a good proverb )

Give a man a fish and he'll eat for a day. Teach him how to pray and he'll starve to death. That's my motto.

 

[SoulDaemon]

that the best sort of help you can give someone is knowledge, hope and reason.

Our work is focused primarily on bible education. And teaching people is far greater then throwing money at a problem.

"Give a man a fish and he'll eat for one night, teach him how to fish and he will eat for a lifetime" ( dont know who said it, but its a good proverb )

Your quote is good but you failed to under stand it, in my opinion.

Teaching knowledge is different than teaching to seek knowledge. I isn't right to teach your own knowledge but it's right to teach people to search their own.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

how can you have peace in a world where there is no peace?

Thats the big difference for me. I look at the world and all I feel is dread over what is happening...it actually affects me to see children starving, wars, diseases and all the pain and suffering that goes along with that. And to top it all off people are nasty and hateful and the environment is being destroyed by our 'so-called' progress.

How do you find peace when all that is happening?

How do you find hope believing that an almighty god is behind it all?

There's plenty of good in the world if you're willing to look for it. There's bad too, but not believing in God allows for hope that we can improve on things. If all the suffering in the world has come along because of (or even in spite of) God's holy plan, then we have no hope at all of making things better. Who could stand up to God and win?

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Give a man a fish and he'll eat for a day. Teach him how to pray and he'll starve to death. That's my motto.

Yeah, but teach him how to preach, and he'll be able to buy whatever he wants.

 

[Wherenextcolumbus]

that the best sort of help you can give someone is knowledge, hope and reason.

I think that depends on what your calling Knowledge, hope and reason...is knowledge, hope and reason telling your followers they might turn gay if they masturbate?

Our work is focused primarily on bible education. And teaching people is far greater then throwing money at a problem.

And arguably your work is primarily focused on watchtower indoctrination, since you teach beliefs and practices that are arguably not biblical.

"Give a man a fish and he'll eat for one night, teach him how to fish and he will eat for a lifetime" ( dont know who said it, but its a good proverb )

And how do you teach a poor man how to fish by handing him a Watchtower or Awake magazine?

 

[Wherenextcolumbus]

Give a man a fish and he'll eat for a day. Teach him how to pray and he'll starve to death. That's my motto.

Didn't you hear Alceste!? You must suffer in this life so you can get to the next life

 

[Alceste]

Yeah, but teach him how to preach, and he'll be able to buy whatever he wants.

Game, set, match.