The movement of the earth in Qur'an

[gnostic]

Please read this verse.

25: 69 " The punishment shall be increased for him on the Day(Yawm, یوم) of Resurrection, and he will remain in it forever, with humiliation. "

According to 25:69, day(Yawm, یوم) of Resurrection is endless in Arabic/Qur'an. So, Yawm is not just 24 hours and is a period of time. Please try to understand.

I didn't quote about resurrection.

Though yawn may not always a 24-hour day, it could mean so.

And It not necessarily to measure a day in hours. The ancient Israelite and Jews today measure a DAY, as a cycle of evening and morning, which is from sunset to sunset, regardless of hours. A day can also be measure as daytime and night, so sunrise to sunrise, again regardless of hours.

What I had quoted, which you have ignored completely, 7:54, which talk of 6-day creation, didn't mention hours at all:

Surely your Lord is Allah, Who created the heavens and the earth in six days. Thereafter He leveled Himself upon the Throne (How He did so is beyond human understanding). He envelops the daytime (with) the night, (which) seeks it out promptly, and the sun, and the moon, and the stars are subjected to His Command. Verily, to Him (belong) the creation and the Command. Supremely Blessed be Allah, The Lord of the worlds.

But the 3rd sentence of this verse, does say "daytime" and "night".

So what does cycle of daytime and night make?

Does it mean years? Or decades, centuries, millennia or millions of years?

No to all of above...but a period of daytime and night does equal to DAY, doesn't it?

Doesn't 6 cycles of daytime and nights = to SIX DAYS????

Since the verse make no mention of YEAR, you can't assume it is talking millions or billions of years. To say it does, is UTTERLY DISHONEST!

 

[Shad]

It not strange how people tune things to suit the scientific findings.

Ironic isn't. A religion from God needs scientific clarification in an ad hoc manner,

 

[Union]

Its really ironic for the people who think that Qur'an is a non-sense , a heresy work by a false Prophet from dark age in Arab desert - turns to a book of science daring to discuss big bang , creation of universe , cosmic string , time dilation , relativity , speed of light , escape velocity , quantum physics , gravity , genealogy , archaeology and many more .

 

[Bunyip]

Its really ironic for the people who think that Qur'an is a non-sense , a heresy work by a false Prophet from dark age in Arab desert - turns to a book of science daring to discuss big bang , creation of universe , cosmic string , time dilation , relativity , speed of light , escape velocity , quantum physics , gravity , genealogy , archaeology and many more .

But it doesn't discuss any of that, other than geneology. Sure there are parts that are vaguely reminiscent of modern scientific theories and hypothesis - but there is nothing that is striking in terms of what the ancients believed or knew. Nothing that you can put your finger on and say "wow, how could they have known that?" Nothing suggestive of divine scientific knowledge.

 

[Union]

But it doesn't discuss any of that, other than geneology. Sure there are parts that are vaguely reminiscent of modern scientific theories and hypothesis - but there is nothing that is striking in terms of what the ancients believed or knew. Nothing that you can put your finger on and say "wow, how could they have known that?" Nothing suggestive of divine scientific knowledge.

There are hundred things to strike an honest reader how Qur'an described those modern scientific issues . With the scope of this current discussion , if you read my posts 59 and 60 , it is a surprise how 1400 years ago Qur'an asserted that the universe was created in 6 epochs including 2 epochs for the earth and maintains their timeline ration to 3:1 which is current discovery .

 

[FearGod]

I didn't quote about resurrection.

Though yawn may not always a 24-hour day, it could mean so.

And It not necessarily to measure a day in hours. The ancient Israelite and Jews today measure a DAY, as a cycle of evening and morning, which is from sunset to sunset, regardless of hours. A day can also be measure as daytime and night, so sunrise to sunrise, again regardless of hours.

What I had quoted, which you have ignored completely, 7:54, which talk of 6-day creation, didn't mention hours at all:

But the 3rd sentence of this verse, does say "daytime" and "night".

So what does cycle of daytime and night make?

Does it mean years? Or decades, centuries, millennia or millions of years?

No to all of above...but a period of daytime and night does equal to DAY, doesn't it?

Doesn't 6 cycles of daytime and nights = to SIX DAYS????

Since the verse make no mention of YEAR, you can't assume it is talking millions or billions of years. To say it does, is UTTERLY DISHONEST!

(7:54)
Surely your Lord is Allah, Who created the heavens and the earth in six days. Thereafter He leveled Himself upon the Throne (How He did so is beyond human understanding). He envelops the daytime (with) the night, (which) seeks it out promptly, and the sun, and the moon, and the stars are subjected to His Command. Verily, to Him (belong) the creation and the Command. Supremely Blessed be Allah, The Lord of the worlds.

How did they know that the day is enveloped by the night ?
Only today (present times) we know that it is dark in the outer space and the day even though we see it bright all over the sky but the fact is that this light is enveloped by darkness, amazing

 

[Shad]

Night is a observation reference point on the planet. It is not a reference point of deep space. Keep grasping at those straws

 

[Union]

(7:54)
Surely your Lord is Allah, Who created the heavens and the earth in six days. Thereafter He leveled Himself upon the Throne (How He did so is beyond human understanding). He envelops the daytime (with) the night, (which) seeks it out promptly, and the sun, and the moon, and the stars are subjected to His Command. Verily, to Him (belong) the creation and the Command. Supremely Blessed be Allah, The Lord of the worlds.

How did they know that the day is enveloped by the night ?
Only today (present times) we know that it is dark in the outer space and the day even though we see it bright all over the sky but the fact is that this light is enveloped by darkness, amazing

Hmmm ! Great observation .

 

[FearGod]

Hmmm ! Great observation .

I think they'll fetch for another meaning for what actually enveloping means.

 

[Bunyip]

There are hundred things to strike an honest reader how Qur'an described those modern scientific issues . With the scope of this current discussion , if you read my posts 59 and 60 , it is a surprise how 1400 years ago Qur'an asserted that the universe was created in 6 epochs including 2 epochs for the earth and maintains their timeline ration to 3:1 which is current discovery .

What is surprising about that? Sure, those passages bear a vague similarity to later scientific ideas, but they are not indicative of any sophisticated scientific knowledge - just descriptive language that sounds a little bit similar to various scientific notions. The universe was not created in 6 epochs by the way, nor is the 'timeline ratio' at all a scientific claim.

 

[gnostic]

(7:54)
Surely your Lord is Allah, Who created the heavens and the earth in six days. Thereafter He leveled Himself upon the Throne (How He did so is beyond human understanding). He envelops the daytime (with) the night, (which) seeks it out promptly, and the sun, and the moon, and the stars are subjected to His Command. Verily, to Him (belong) the creation and the Command. Supremely Blessed be Allah, The Lord of the worlds.

How did they know that the day is enveloped by the night ?
Only today (present times) we know that it is dark in the outer space and the day even though we see it bright all over the sky but the fact is that this light is enveloped by darkness, amazing

The verse is so vague that you can actually interpreted the passage in a number of different ways.

But essentially god or Allah as you would call him, make the night cover daytime.

Did you know that even with modern translation, the simplistic but vagueness of description actually convey the author to be nothing more than shepherd with no understanding of science whatsoever.

Any idiot can say something as unlearned as verse 7:54, with

"He envelops the daytime (with) the night, (which) seeks it out promptly...."

It doesn't denote have an in-depth knowledge of astronomy, but what it does show is the author's illogical superstition and unfathomable ignorance.

Night doesn't "envelop" daytime. It is written like who is a shepherd.

Because of our proximity position of our planet to the sun, there is no such thing as darkness as long as the Earth's surface is facing the sun. Darkness only exist on the surface of Earth that isn't facing the sun, and that part is is under the Earth's own shadow.

(Of course, there are exceptions, when small parts the hemisphere that facing the sun, but experiencing night-like darkness, and that's occurrences of the solar eclipses, but solar eclipses don't happen daily.)

Night, or darkness, only occur daily because the Earth's hemisphere that not facing the sun, but we emerge from night, because the planet is rotating on its axis.

The verse is saying this God daily cause night to envelope daytime, may be poetic in its simplistic, but it's also happen to be grossly inaccurate.

It is a verse that showed the author had no understanding of science, least of all astronomy, so it hide under superstitious nonsense that some god hide daytime with night.

The next part of that same sentence and verse also showed the author's illogical superstition:

...and the sun, and the moon, and the stars are subjected to His Command.

Why would the stars, sun and moon be subjected to any "command"?

And what does "command" be?

The author is complete imbecile when it come to science.

If God or Muhammad was here today, they would each fail the IQ test that relate to logic and anything relating to science.

Any Muslims who would present this verse to the community of astronomers as being "scientific", would be laughed off the stage.

 

[Union]

What is surprising about that? Sure, those passages bear a vague similarity to later scientific ideas, but they are not indicative of any sophisticated scientific knowledge - just descriptive language that sounds a little bit similar to various scientific notions. The universe was not created in 6 epochs by the way, nor is the 'timeline ratio' at all a scientific claim.

Qur'an is not teaching the science but is using it as a tool to establish its divine origin . And Qur'an is very successful on it .

And I attached the reference of NASA that the number of major epochs are indeed 6 and various modern scientific methods to establish the age of the universe and the earth whose ratio is matching the way Qur'an also expressed it . Seems like you are the Chairman of NASA

 

[Bunyip]

Qur'an is not teaching the science but is using it as a tool to establish its divine origin . And Qur'an is very successful on it .

And I attached the reference of NASA that the number of major epochs are indeed 6 and various modern scientific methods to establish the age of the universe and the earth whose ratio is matching the way Qur'an also expressed it . Seems like you are the Chairman of NASA

The quran says absolutely nothing about 6 epochs mate, nor does it suggest a ratio between the age of the universe and the age of the earth. You have rather imaginatively assumed that 6 DAYS, refers to six epochs. It doesn't.

 

[FearGod]

The verse is so vague that you can actually interpreted the passage in a number of different ways.

But essentially god or Allah as you would call him, make the night cover daytime.

Did you know that even with modern translation, the simplistic but vagueness of description actually convey the author to be nothing more than shepherd with no understanding of science whatsoever.

Any idiot can say something as unlearned as verse 7:54, with

It doesn't denote have an in-depth knowledge of astronomy, but what it does show is the author's illogical superstition and unfathomable ignorance.

Night doesn't "envelop" daytime. It is written like who is a shepherd.

Because of our proximity position of our planet to the sun, there is no such thing as darkness as long as the Earth's surface is facing the sun. Darkness only exist on the surface of Earth that isn't facing the sun, and that part is is under the Earth's own shadow.

(Of course, there are exceptions, when small parts the hemisphere that facing the sun, but experiencing night-like darkness, and that's occurrences of the solar eclipses, but solar eclipses don't happen daily.)

Night, or darkness, only occur daily because the Earth's hemisphere that not facing the sun, but we emerge from night, because the planet is rotating on its axis.

The verse is saying this God daily cause night to envelope daytime, may be poetic in its simplistic, but it's also happen to be grossly inaccurate.

It is a verse that showed the author had no understanding of science, least of all astronomy, so it hide under superstitious nonsense that some god hide daytime with night.

The next part of that same sentence and verse also showed the author's illogical superstition:


Why would the stars, sun and moon be subjected to any "command"?

And what does "command" be?

The author is complete imbecile when it come to science.

If God or Muhammad was here today, they would each fail the IQ test that relate to logic and anything relating to science.

Any Muslims who would present this verse to the community of astronomers as being "scientific", would be laughed off the stage.

It's only vague for the disbelievers and not for the Muslims.

The darkness enveloping the day's light can be seen easily from the outer space and that was impossible to be known in the 7th century.

 

[Bunyip]

It's only vague for the disbelievers and not for the Muslims.

The darkness enveloping the day light can be seen easily from the outer space and that was impossible to be known in the 7th century.

Why would it even be remarkable for 7th century people to describe it that way? It is hardly a scientific explanation - just a description of what we see.

 

[FearGod]

Why would it even be remarkable for 7th century people to describe it that way? It is hardly a scientific explanation - just a description of what we see.

The quran wasn't only made for the people of that era of ignorance, one example is the born of the state of Israel near the end of times which has nothing to do with the people living in the 7th century but was mentioned in the quran similar to the fact of the Persians and the Romans which was mentioned in the quran before it happened.

 

[Bunyip]

The quran wasn't only made for the people of that era of ignorance, one example is the born of the state of Israel near the end of times which has nothing to do with the people living in the 7th century but was mentioned in the quran similar to the fact of the Persians and the Romans which was mentioned in the quran before it happened.

Only if you stretch your imagination and apply it to very vague and metaphoric fragments.

 

[FearGod]

Only if you stretch your imagination and apply it to very vague and metaphoric fragments.

Yes for the disbelievers that is the case,i don't know what is the wisdom behind it but yes God said it won't guide the disbelievers regardless of any evidences.

 

[viole]

It's only vague for the disbelievers and not for the Muslims.

The darkness enveloping the day's light can be seen easily from the outer space and that was impossible to be known in the 7th century.

Yea, it is called "night".

Ciao

- viole

 

[Shad]

Let do math Quran style. 53+53= a number. Someone else can supply this number. When they do, this is the number I mean in fact.