Why Exist?

[atanu]

I thought of sharing the following.

My younger brother, 6 years my junior is smart. In olden days, we used to use a hand pump for drawing water. My brother had a special way of doing it. Very often he would pump with one hand and a few small kids would massage his free hand. Or often he would just stand and watch the kids pump out water for him in turns. At other times, these kids would give him sursuri (caress) while he enjoyed the care, lying down with half closed eyes and guiding them from time to time as to which part of his body next needed attention. He was just 12 or 13 year old. I used to wonder how he managed such devotion from children day after day. I asked him. He said "I give a chocolate piece to the winner."

We all compete for such chocolate pieces most of our life. Nirlipt (unattached) shiva smiles.

 

[839311]

Why does one exist?

Does any individual know the reason for his/her coming into being?

It is the nature of reality that we should exist.

Does the individual know his/her purpose of being?

There is no inherent purpose. Stuff simply exists because it does. Beyond that, we can make purposes for ourselves if we want to.

 

[atanu]

It is the nature of reality that we should exist.

I agree that it must be the very nature of reality.

There is no inherent purpose. Stuff simply exists because it does. Beyond that, we can make purposes for ourselves if we want to.

How do we know that there is no inherent purpose, even though i fully agree that individuals can make purposes or different meanings thereof?

 

[waitasec]

I
How do we know that there is no inherent purpose, even though i fully agree that individuals can make purposes or different meanings thereof?

the purpose is in our nature, to survive...

 

[atanu]

the purpose is in our nature, to survive...

Remember the time we boxed and you delivered a punch that made me go down permanently? Thereafter, i open your posts with care.

Wow. We have a cause for agreement here.

 

[839311]

How do we know that there is no inherent purpose, even though i fully agree that individuals can make purposes or different meanings thereof?

I see purpose as something that develops as a result of intelligent thought. If it is built-in to the life form, or that it is simply its nature to behave in a certain way, then I don't see that as purpose. So with regards to what were talking about, the natural state of something that exists wouldn't qualify as a purpose.

 

[Thief]

Remember the time we boxed and you delivered a punch that made me go down permanently? Thereafter, i open your posts with care.

Wow. We have a cause for agreement here.

Should have reserved your agreement....
Survival is not a purpose.
Survival is your will to live in contrast to your environment and situation....nothing more.

Purpose has intent.
God having created Man, did so with intent.

You are here to learn all that you can, then back to God you go.

Your body is the evidence of that intent.
All that you know has been delivered by your five senses.
Each to it's own means, this world is brought to your mind and heart.

There is no mystery in being human.
Your form insures a linear experience.
You will be an individual.

Then back to God you go.

 

[Thief]

I see purpose as something that develops as a result of intelligent thought. If it is built-in to the life form, or that it is simply its nature to behave in a certain way, then I don't see that as purpose. So with regards to what were talking about, the natural state of something that exists wouldn't qualify as a purpose.

You beat me to it...by one minute!

But would you agree to my previous post?

 

[waitasec]

Remember the time we boxed and you delivered a punch that made me go down permanently? Thereafter, i open your posts with care.

Wow. We have a cause for agreement here.

:faint:

 

[839311]

Survival is not a purpose.

I think survival can be a purpose. If someone thinks about life and what they want, one of the things they may decide is that they want to live, so I think it would qualify as a purpose. I think survival is also not necessarily part of our nature, although perhaps a case could be made that it is the nature of humanity as a species. I say that because some of us commit suicide, not wanting to live anymore.

Purpose has intent.

Yes.

God having created Man, did so with intent.

If this is true then yes that would qualify as purpose.

You are here to learn all that you can

Possibly. I think a good case could be made for this. There are a few different possibilities that come to mind which would explain why we are here.

1. We're supposed to get something out of it, some wisdom and knowledge
2. Because we chose to live in this world, perhaps out of boredom. Eternity is a long time, after all.
3. Have fun
4. Excitement
5. A grand adventure?

Your body is the evidence of that intent.

I think our body counts as evidence for the view that God didn't create us. There is a ton of genetic junk in our dna, as well as numerous functional problems which are hard to explain if they were designed. We would have to assume that God was either a crappy designer, or that he wanted to create us with as many flaws as we have. Then there is a vast amount of evidence supporting evolution, such as fossils.

Some intelligent being could have created the spark (the big bang) which started it all. But the evidence suggests that after this happened there was little to no intelligent intervention.

All that you know has been delivered by your five senses..

Fair enough.

There is no mystery in being human.
Your form insures a linear experience.
You will be an individual.

I guess?

Then back to God you go.

Could be.

 

[atanu]

Should have reserved your agreement....
Survival is not a purpose.
Survival is your will to live in contrast to your environment and situation....nothing more.

:faint:

Ha ha. It is. From the stand point of ego it is. No doubt this is a relative purpose and that there is more to it.

 

[waitasec]

Survival is not a purpose.
Survival is your will to live in contrast to your environment and situation....nothing more.

what other will is there? we have no choice but to want to survive because we exist.

Purpose has intent.

to survive

God having created Man, did so with intent.
You are here to learn all that you can, then back to God you go.

Your body is the evidence of that intent.
All that you know has been delivered by your five senses.
Each to it's own means, this world is brought to your mind and heart.

this is a moot point.

There is no mystery in being human.

i agree...
however the innate human quality of curiosity and the ability to reason always seems to trump that stance.

Your form insures a linear experience.

your words contradict you, you come across as if you are speaking with hindsight.

You will be an individual.

correction...we are individuals.

Then back to God you go.

yet you say

Your form insures a linear experience.

 

[waitasec]

Ha ha. It is. From the stand point of ego it is. No doubt this is a relative purpose and that there is more to it.

because of our tendency to entertain our thoughts?
:beach:

 

[atanu]

because of our tendency to entertain our thoughts?
:beach:

If i tell you you may not agree readily. So, i will leave you a metaphor.

Suppose you are an actor playing role of a woman who will die soon. As an actor will you be concerned about survival of the character?

 

[waitasec]

If i tell you you may not agree readily. So, i will leave you a metaphor.

Suppose you are an actor playing role of a woman who will die soon. As an actor will you be concerned about survival of the character?

well that depends really.
if it would ensure steady work..yes
if it is a one time role, i'll accept it and move on hoping to find more work


in order to ensure my survival as an actor...

 

[atanu]

If i tell you you may not agree readily. So, i will leave you a metaphor.

Suppose you are an actor playing role of a woman who will die soon. As an actor will you be concerned about survival of the character?

well that depends really.
if it would ensure steady work..yes
if it is a one time role, i'll accept it and move on hoping to find more work

in order to ensure my survival as an actor...

Probably my wording was not right.

You are playing a dying character in a movie. The character has to reflect all the anguish. But will the real person, that is you - the actor, will be in anguish?

 

[waitasec]

Probably my wording was not right.

You are playing a dying character in a movie. The character has to reflect all the anguish. But will the real person, that is you - the actor, will be in anguish?

it wouldn't be an honest anguish but rather contrived...

i suppose the thing about acting is that the artificial world in which the actor is living in is understood as artificial...and depending on their talent are we then convinced into thinking that the artificial is real.

 

[PolyHedral]

Probably my wording was not right.

You are playing a dying character in a movie. The character has to reflect all the anguish. But will the real person, that is you - the actor, will be in anguish?

Of course I won't be in anguish - but I am not the one dying.

 

[839311]

You are playing a dying character in a movie. The character has to reflect all the anguish. But will the real person, that is you - the actor, will be in anguish?

Many people think that Heath Ledger sort of did this. He got into the character of the Joker too much, and couldn't handle it. I don't know about that myself. Still, its one of the best acting performances Ive seen. Maybe the best.

 

[Thief]

This is digressing badly.

From the obvious...to shallow rebuttal...to high school technique of speech dissection...and now we are to address 'acting'...

So let's run with that...

God was bored.
At the moment of creation, the universe contained no other spirit.
He was the First.

Speaking to One's Self, God would be tired of talking to His reflection.
(like talking to a mirror)
Angels tend to be 'yes' men.
The ones that make denial end up getting cast out of heaven.

Otherwise dead substance (clay) lacks spirit and response.
Hence the creation of Man.
A blend between the spiritual and the physical.

Man is a creation that will yield a fresh perspective on each occasion.

Act as you please....suffer the consequence.