Without God there is no hope

[LuisDantas]

If it was not what I chose to do, what was it?

I assume that it was what you hoped to turn out possible and worthwhile.

I do not understand what you mean.

Maybe it is just me.

I tend not to worry about wrong choices, because I rarely even perceive any true choices.

Far, far more often than not achieving enough information (or realizing that the information can't be reasonably obtained) makes any choices rather obvious or perhaps unimportant.

So I rarely feel very anxious due to any choices.

 

[Trailblazer]

Humans need feedback I think. And if there is a God I'm not getting any feedback.

I hear your pain.
I think God turned off His cell phone, or maybe He just responds to certain callers and puts the others on hold, indefinitely.

 

[Colt]

I am not making a claim, I am only expressing a feeling, and I could be wrong so I am open to other perspectives. This is only the way I am feeling now, based upon my trying to change certain things and being unable to do so. In short, I feel completely stuck, like I have no control over my own life, and I feel like God is the only one who can help me. Everything I have tried to do goes to hell in a breadbasket so I have resigned myself to hoping that God will help me by guiding me to decide what to do and assisting me to do it, or that God will help me via fate, by causing things to happen to me.

I believe that everyone's fate is already written in the Book of Life, which is the Tablet of Fate.

“O thou who art the fruit of My Tree and the leaf thereof! On thee be My glory and My mercy. Let not thine heart grieve over what hath befallen thee. Wert thou to scan the pages of the Book of Life, thou wouldst, most certainly, discover that which would dissipate thy sorrows and dissolve thine anguish.

Know thou, O fruit of My Tree, that the decrees of the Sovereign Ordainer, as related to fate and predestination, are of two kinds. Both are to be obeyed and accepted. The one is irrevocable, the other is, as termed by men, impending. To the former all must unreservedly submit, inasmuch as it is fixed and settled. God, however, is able to alter or repeal it. As the harm that must result from such a change will be greater than if the decree had remained unaltered, all, therefore, should willingly acquiesce in what God hath willed and confidently abide by the same.

The decree that is impending, however, is such that prayer and entreaty can succeed in averting it.

God grant that thou who art the fruit of My Tree, and they that are associated with thee, may be shielded from its evil consequences.”

Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 132-133

Then there is the question: What is caused by God's decree and what is caused by a free will choice? I think some things happen to us that are not decreed by God, they are chosen by us, and some things that we do not choose are decreed by God.

Moreover, even if something is decreed by God, not everything that is decreed by God is fixed and settled. The passage above says that the decree that is impending is such that prayer and entreaty can succeed in averting it, so I might be able to influence God’s decree that is impending by praying to God.

What is the connection between fate and free will? How can we have free will if everything is predetermined by God? I believe that God is all-knowing so God knows everything we are going to do, and that has already been written on the Tablet of Fate, but I do not believe that what God knows causes anyone to do anything. I believe things happen because we make a choice to do them and act on that choice.

Is what ends up being written on the Tablet of Fate simply what God knows we are going to choose to do? But what about things that happen to us that are not chosen by us? I think those things are also our fate. In short, I think there is the fate we choose and the fate we don't choose, and I think the passage above is referring to the fate we don't choose, the fate we are hoping to avert, God's decree.

The theory that we only have partial free will seems inaccurate.

 

[Trailblazer]

The theory that we only have partial free will seems inaccurate.

Then what do you think is accurate? Do you think we have complete free will?

 

[samtonga43]

As a former Christian, I can attest that what you described is very typical of people who believe in the God of the Bible, especially most Christians. When I was a Christian, I certainly made a conscious effort to dismiss all of the scriptures in the Bible that described God's irrational anger, narcissism, sadism, psychopathic, and genocidal behavior. Like most Christians I knew and still come across now and then, I blamed humanity and the devil (Satan), believing God was justified in being a &#%!@! SOB. And it never occurred to me to blame God, the Creator, for the world going to hell in a handbasket, or to believe that God creates evil, as Isaiah 45:7 clearly states in the King James Version of the Bible. It was unthinkable to me to even suggest that "the buck stops here!" with God. In essence, I was taught that we humans are the scum of the earth in comparison to God, deserving of his wrath for allegedly sinning against him. The teaching that we are essentially the scum of the earth in comparison to God is based primarily on Isaiah 64:6, which states, "All of us have become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and our sins sweep us away like the wind" (New International Version). I was taught to literally fear God, and I did, to the point where I had awful nightmares.

The whole "God is love" theme is the crux of Christianity and the core message of Christian evangelism. It's part of the evangelical strategy a lot of Christians will use to entice unbelievers into converting to Christianity. Of course, they are more likely to attract potential converts with feel-good messages like "God is love!" or "God loves you!" rather than with a message like this: "God is love, but you should know that the Bible says that God creates evil, disasters, and calamities." So, just ignore that part. And while you're at it, ignore the scriptures about God forcing a rape victim to marry her rapist, dashing infants' heads against rocks, ordering the death of witches, ordering the Israelites to kill every man, woman, child, and infant from another nation, and finally, ignore the verses where it says that God killed every living person on earth, with the exception of one family, in a global flood. It's as if most Christians want unbelievers to focus on and believe only the positive verses about God's so-called love and mercy while ignoring the negative ones revealing his sadistic and psychopathic behavior toward humanity, as well as his barbaric, bloodthirsty, and genocidal behavior of killing people (including children) with impunity. I know Christians who want to portray Christianity in the very best light possible.

If the essential Christian evangelical ploy for attracting converts included some of the horrific stories in the Bible, then how many converts do you think they would attract and convince to convert to Christianity? It's understandable that Christians will adamantly deny that God creates evil, disasters, and calamities. As a former devout Christian myself, I know that it is much easier on a Christian's conscience to blame humanity and/or the devil for all the evil in the world than to blame a "loving and merciful" God that a Christian genuinely believes in and has faith in. I think that it stands to reason that most devout Christians and even the newer versions of the Bible would replace the word "evil" with a less offensive word, like disaster or calamity. Most Christians expect unbelievers to believe the Bible to be true, but they can't even agree on what it actually teaches. And most Christians I've met will insist that the Bible is only the divinely inspired "Word of God" when they agree with certain scriptures. Otherwise, they claim that the scriptures that they don't believe in weren't inspired by God but were rather written by mere mortal men who obviously misunderstood what God was saying.

Isaiah 45:7

KJV: "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things."

Evil:
1. Morally bad or wrong; wicked, 2. Causing ruin, injury, or pain; harmful, 3. Characterized by or indicating misfortune; ominous.

NIV: "I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the LORD, do all these things."

Disaster:
1. An occurrence causing widespread destruction and distress; a catastrophe; 2. A grave misfortune, and 3. A total failure.

ESV: "I form light and create darkness; I make well-being and create calamity; I am the LORD, who does all these things."

Calamity: 1. An event that brings terrible loss, lasting distress, or severe affliction; a disaster, 2. Dire distress resulting from loss or tragedy; 3. Any great misfortune or cause of misery; in general, any event or disaster which produces extensive evils, as loss of crops, earthquakes, etc., but also applied to any misfortune which brings great distress on a person; misfortune; distress; adversity.

As I think I said earlier, I was an atheist who is now a Christian. I just do not recognize the 'Cjhristianity' you describe above. It sounds like a cult.

 

[samtonga43]

I hear your pain.
I think God turned off His cell phone, or maybe He just responds to certain callers and puts the others on hold, indefinitely.

Your God is too small.

 

[Trailblazer]

I tend not to worry about wrong choices, because I rarely even perceive any true choices.

Far, far more often than not achieving enough information (or realizing that the information can't be reasonably obtained) makes any choices rather obvious or perhaps unimportant.

So I rarely feel very anxious due to any choices.

That sounds good. Right now I am thinking about how I should have done x and y today but I didn't.
I am anxious, mostly because I worry that certain things won't get done.
I have to keep telling myself that tomorrow is another day and things will get done.
Thinking I had a choice not only leads to anxiety but to remorse.

 

[Trailblazer]

Your God is too small.

He is the same God you believe in, I just see Him a little differently.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

As I think I said earlier, I was an atheist who is now a Christian. I just do not recognize the 'Cjhristianity' you describe above. It sounds like a cult.

I attended two different First Baptist churches during my childhood and teenage years, but after I left home at eighteen, I was invited to go to a local Nazarene church, which is where I met my husband not quite a year after I joined the church. I attended a couple of Nazarene churches after my husband and I married and started our family. In fact, my husband and some of our children (along with me on occasion) continue to attend the Nazarene church where we've been members for nearly 20 years. It'll be 20 years at the end of August. Both the First Baptist and the Nazarene churches are conservative evangelical churches with an emphasis on evangelism and world missions. The Nazarene church that my husband still regularly attends sends an evangelism team to Belize every summer.

 

[samtonga43]

He is the same God you believe in, I just see Him a little differently.

Nope. The God I believe in is Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

 

[Colt]

Then what do you think is accurate? Do you think we have complete free will?

I think that within our sphere of existence we are given freedom of choice.

“Material mind is the arena in which human personalities live, are self-conscious, make decisions, choose God or forsake him, eternalize or destroy themselves.” UB

To consider that God may have foreknowledge of events doesn’t mean that he violated the free will of his children to make those events happen.

 

[samtonga43]

I attended two different First Baptist churches during my childhood and teenage years, but after I left home at eighteen, I was invited to go to a local Nazarene church, which is where I met my husband not quite a year after I joined the church. I attended a couple of Nazarene churches after my husband and I married and started our family. In fact, my husband and some of our children (along with me on occasion) continue to attend the Nazarene church where we've been members for nearly 20 years. It'll be 20 years at the end of August. Both the First Baptist and the Nazarene churches are conservative evangelical churches with an emphasis on evangelism and world missions. The Nazarene church that my husband still regularly attends sends an evangelism team to Belize every summer.

Are these First Baptist churches responsible for the cultish behaviour you describe?

 

[Trailblazer]

Nope. The God I believe in is Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

I meant it is the God of the Bible, the One True God, which is the same God that Baha'u'llah revealed.

 

[samtonga43]

I think that within our sphere of existence we are given freedom of choice.

“Material mind is the arena in which human personalities live, are self-conscious, make decisions, choose God or forsake him, eternalize or destroy themselves.” UB

To consider that God may have foreknowledge of events doesn’t mean that he violated the free will of his children to make those events happen.

Yes, I prefer to think of freedom of choice rather than free will.

 

[Trailblazer]

I think that within our sphere of existence we are given freedom of choice.

“Material mind is the arena in which human personalities live, are self-conscious, make decisions, choose God or forsake him, eternalize or destroy themselves.” UB

To consider that God may have foreknowledge of events doesn’t mean that he violated the free will of his children to make those events happen.

I agree that God's foreknowledge of events doesn’t mean we do not have free will.

However, free will does not mean we are free to choose anything we desire. What we refer to as “free will” has many constraints such as ability and opportunity.

 

[samtonga43]

I meant it is the God of the Bible, the One True God, which is the same God that Baha'u'llah revealed.

Again, no.
Trinity (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy)

A Trinity doctrine is commonly expressed as the statement that the one God exists as or in three equally divine “Persons”, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

Every term in this statement (God, exists, as or in, equally divine, Person) has been variously understood. The guiding principle has been the creedal declaration that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit of the New Testament are consubstantial (i.e. the same in substance or essence, Greek: homoousios).

Because this shared substance or essence is a divine one, this is understood to imply that all three named individuals are divine, and equally so. Yet the three in some sense “are” the one God of the Bible.

 

[Nimos]

The situation is very complicated but I will try to explain it in brief. Since you are so logical and I am trying to be logical maybe you can help me come up with some ideas.

Clearly, there is not a single solution to all these things.

I still have a pending malpractice lawsuit because of the circumstances surrounding his death, so this is not a simple grief and loss situation.
If I understand you correctly, this sounds like something you could get help with from a lawyer, so you at least get it handed correctly and by someone that is into these things. And hopefully will make you more ease of mind knowing and having to spend less time on it.

My initial choice and the only choice I thought I had was to find another man to marry because, not so much because I feel lonely, but because I could not envision myself continuing to live alone in this big house and taking care of all these cats all by myself. Mind you, I am not doing any more than I was doing when my husband was alive, I am probably doing less, because before his death I was doing everything I am doing now and also taking care of him. I have anxiety as a diagnosis but my anxiety is a lot less now that he is gone and I have dealt with most things one has to deal with after a death in the family.

The way I understand your situation might obviously be wrong. But to me, this seems like one of the main issues and rather to find a suitable or working solution, you seem to want to try to restore what was lost rather than adapt to a new situation. The reason I get this impression is due to what you have told me before even when your husband was alive, and that you weren't really happy with that situation either.
So it seems to me, again with limited knowledge, that you don't really know what you want, but out of "desperation" you are basically just trying to recreate what was there, thinking that a man would solve it and things would basically be the same as before.

To me, it seems like you need more of a change than you are doing. You work and then you have 12-16 cats or how many you have? That is basically like owning a pet store and could imagine that it is almost a full-time job on its own. So a solution might be to consider getting rid of a few of them and to get more time for yourself.

Maybe even moving to a new community where people live closer together so you have neighbours and rather than actively seeking someone to fill the gap, start by making your situation work without one, and simply let life play out on its own and not actively trying to find one. But as I told you earlier, get involved with a hobby or some sort of community where you can meet people, whether that is charity work or whatever. You don't need a huge house I assume? I know you are from the US so all houses there are huge but it also makes things seem empty and more difficult to maintain etc.

My point is that you, seem to have put yourself in a situation where you have gotten your hands tied on the back, because of all the cats. You probably ain't willing to get rid of any of them? But the truth is that maintaining that many animals is rough, it was something else if it was fish

So my best advice is to try to get yourself in a situation where you have time to yourself, where you feel that your life is working according to your needs and where you feel you have full control over it, and not one based on cats or the requirement of a "random" husband etc.

Make sure you get enough time for yourself, so you can do other things than work and look out for cats. That you can go on vacations, join a hobby or community and spend time on that together with other people. But most importantly you should do things that you want to do, not what you feel others need from you, whether that is cats or Bahai community or whatever.

I don't know who your counsellor is what profession or background? But a lot of the stuff, like grief etc. might be worth talking to a psychologist about. Just make sure that it is not one with a religious motivation. But one that is impartial and where religion is irrelevant. I'm not saying that it has to be an atheist, simply that it is a person with the correct intentions, because there are cases, where some of these will try to use religion in treatment and that is a huge red flag.

If fate is hoping that things will go my way without any good reason to believe that, that is the same as what I was doing before with the dating sites. Do you see the similarity? What reason do I have to hope that anything will go my way even if I take certain actions?

Hope is just what we "wish" for. So yes it is the same, you hope there is a man on the dating site that lives up to your expectations and given what you have said there weren't. So maybe the dating site is not the right approach and as I said, maybe it would be best to get things working without one and maybe a husband is to be found in joining a community or a place where you share a hobby with others and it might occur all on its own or natural as you start meeting people there. And even if you don't, at least you have a functional life that you are happy with on your own, so a husband might be a bonus, but not a requirement for being happy because you spent the time getting that working first.

I have some idea what went wrong and why, on the dating sites, but I am in no hurry to keep trying because I feel like I am beating my head against a stone wall, and I am in between a rock and a hard place since I cannot imagine living alone forever. My counselor thinks I should keep trying to find a man but I need to try something different.

I'm not a counsellor, but I think that person is wrong. Because I don't see how your situation as such is solved simply by adding a man to your life. You say that you are not 100% into it being the solution and it comes off again more like you are trying to just fill a gap rather than solving the underlining problems.

So in my opinion, I would calm down and work on getting more time for myself and simply reduce the amount of stress that it must be, working and taking care of that many cats and dealing with the grief etc. And in many cases adding another person to your life, especially if you are not "truly" in love with them is not going to help, but could make things even worse as you then have another thing to deal with. You need to be egoistic in that sense, that you come first and that is what you want to solve and not rely on others, animals or a "random" husband to get there.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Glad it works for you, I found the idea of waiting around to die before things got better to be the root cause of a depressing feeling of hopelessness.

No, No, No. Not waiting around to die because in Scripture Jesus' coming Glory Time of separation as found at Matthew 25:31-34,37 is near at hand.
The figurative separated living 'sheep' can remain alive on Earth, and be here on Earth to see calendar Day One of Jesus' coming 1,000 year governmental reign over Earth.
The purpose of the thousand years is that Jesus will end 'enemy death' on Earth - 1 Corinthians 15:24-26; Isaiah 25:8
Mankind will see the return of the ' Tree of Life ' on Earth - Revelation 22:14,2
So, instead of waiting around to die it is waiting to live - Proverbs 22:4 B; Proverbs 2:21-22 - live life forever.
Live forever under beautiful healthy paradisical conditions as described in Isaiah 35th chapter.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I hear your pain.
I think God turned off His cell phone, or maybe He just responds to certain callers and puts the others on hold, indefinitely.

I suppose the man Job (Job 2:4-5) could have felt the same if he had a cell phone trying to reach God.
Job did Not know Satan was the one challenging Job ( and by way of extension Satan also challenges us )
' touch our flesh.... ' ( loose physical health ) and under adverse conditions we would Not serve God.
Both Job and Jesus under very adverse conditions proved Satan a liar, and so can we.
A reason why we are all invited to pray the invitation to God for Jesus to come ! (Rev. 22:20) is because Jesus will bring ' healing ' to earth's nations.- Revelation 22:2,17
Former pain will be forgotten - Isaiah 65:16 B

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I do not live for a future afterlife, I live in the present. I am on earth for a purpose and I want to fulfill that purpose.
I also have hope that I will continue to live after I die, but not because my physical body will rise from the grave and go on living on earth. That is not what the Bible teaches.
Our physical bodies cannot inherit the Kingdom of God which is in Heaven. Dead bodies cannot inherit what will last forever, Heaven. Our physical bodies will die and we will be raised (resurrected) as spiritual bodies that will be suited to go to Heaven and live forever. That is what the following verses say.
1 Corinthians 15 New Living Translation
40 There are also bodies in the heavens and bodies on the earth. The glory of the heavenly bodies is different from the glory of the earthly bodies.
44 They are buried as natural human bodies, but they will be raised as spiritual bodies. For just as there are natural bodies, there are also spiritual bodies.
50 What I am saying, dear brothers and sisters, is that our physical bodies cannot inherit the Kingdom of God. These dying bodies cannot inherit what will last forever.
51 But let me reveal to you a wonderful secret. We will not all die, but we will all be transformed!
54 Then, when our dying bodies have been transformed into bodies that will never die,[c] this Scripture will be fulfilled: “Death is swallowed up in victory.[d] Read full chapter

Yes, 'physical ' can Not inherit the kingdom - the kingdom Jesus promised for people like those of Luke 22:28-30.
They will be (Not angels) but be the saints/ holy ones who govern with Christ for a thousand years.- Daniel 7:18
They have that first or earlier resurrection of Revelation 20:6; 2:10; 5:9-10
They govern with Christ in Heaven over Earth for a thousand years.
They will serve mankind living on Earth as kings (taking care of governmental duties towards people of Earth)
They will serve mankind living on Earth as priests (taking care of spiritual duties towards people of Earth )
There is No death in Heaven. The death problem exists here on Earth.
Jesus will bring an end to ' enemy death ' here on Earth - 1 Corinthians 15:24-26; Isaiah 25:8
That is how the humble meek people will inherit (Not Heaven) but inherit the Earth as Jesus promised at Matthew 5:5 from Psalms 37:9-11